really upset! | Imamother

Tamiri

Sun, May 19 2013, 12:30 am

I would never ask girls to bring anything. I would never ask for help. In fact, I want them to appear as close to candle-lighting as possible (doesn't work where I live, as we have to pick them up from the bus depot but that's besides the point). With the matter of food, I understand that some places may have little kids/not too much money for food and girls want snacks.
That's fine.
But why not simply eat in the kitchen or DR?
Do kids generally eat in their bedrooms?
As for snacks: right, that may not be common in all homes. I sure don't keep junky snacks around besides for special occasions. But there are full meals (breakfast of coffee and cake are served) and a fridge with apples. Tupperwares with biscuits and pretzels. And really, besides eating in the bedroom... couldn't they have cleaned up the crumbs? Why did *I* have to find them?

mandksima

Sun, May 19 2013, 1:21 am

I don't have sleeping guests other than family because we don't have a spare room so I can't say for sure how it would bother me if girls ate cookies in their bedroom but I doubt it would. Sem girls usually drive me crazy with other things, not this. The issues of not helping or being really jappy bug me more.

Reminds me of the following time where I was the guest: we, as a family, once went to a certain family we didn't know personally to try out a new area we considered moving to for a whole Shabbat where there just wasn't sufficient food for ds who was picky (they knew we were coming with a few kids and 0% kid friendly food) so I was glad I brought a few bags of nosh (pretzels, biscuits, fruit.) He was starving all Shabbat (I think he ate challah at the meals) and I was embarassed to ask the host for something plain as she worked so hard on preparing complex dishes and her kids were all older so they all ate the food she served. I was too embarassed to give my son the bag of nosh to walk around with and go the dining room/kitchen so I told him to eat it carefully in the room. I could see the host being upset with that now as I read the OP but I was quite uncomfortable being the guest in that situation. So, I can definitely see both sides of the situation and I wasn't trying to be inconsiderate of bugs, just didn't see another easy senario. Oy, good thing I am not a guest often!

AlwaysThinking

Sun, May 19 2013, 3:27 am

When I was in sem I sometimes found it very embarassing to be in the dining room or living room, especially if there was family around... they were strangers and I was shy!

If sem girls offer to help, very nice, but I would want to make them feel as comfortable as possible. In fact, when I have sem girls to stay, I leave food and drink in the room! I want them to feel cared for and have an enjoyable experience... I don't expect them to help, who knows what has gone on that week! Sem isn't exactly normal life, it's full of all-nighters and early mornings... it's actually quite hard to go away to strangers every shabbos, and also plans to tend to fall through, and miscommunications between friends often causes awkward situations such as double bookings...

amother

Sun, May 19 2013, 4:17 am

which brings us back to the question of why sem girls have to find " places" to be for shabbos! shouldnt sems, just live yeshivos, provide all year hosting for their students, for all meals, every day?! they certainly pay enough.
I think that this leads to the attitude of taking for granted that people should host them, after all - what else are the girls supposed to do? as a sem girl I resented being a begger, and all the uncomfortable shabbosim, and its so unfair on hosts too, who are practically almost seen as just doing their duty as a resident of Israel

Liba

Sun, May 19 2013, 4:26 am

Part of seminary is meeting the local families and interacting with them. Many seminaries have the girls out in the community doing chessed. One way for them to be more comfortable with the family who is hosting them is interacting with them more and not being strangers. Having the girls come Thursday afternoon for a couple hours to help peel vegetables, make beds, take kids to the park etc, not just come last minute as guests like they are coming to a hotel would make both sides more comfortable.

The seminary girls would know who they were going to, what to expect and not feel like such awkward strangers, and the families wouldn't be as stressed out about the extra work or feel used as a free hotel.

aebz

Sun, May 19 2013, 9:20 am

Riff wrote:

Yes! I hated being forced to constantly make plans. Being in a house full of strangers is enough to make anyone shy!

I would ALWAYS bring cake or wine and offer to help during the meals, but it would never occur to me to go Thursday night to help cook or clean. There were girls in my seminary who became really active in their Chesed homes or helped the Eim Bayit all Thursday night, but that's just not my personality. I'm helpful but not the type who would feel comfortable in someone's home to that level.

While I think it's horrible that these Seminary girls are being so rude, it is important to understand these are young girls who are away from their family for an entire year, and are forced to be guests every week. They may be just an unhappy about the situation as you are, and trying their best to make it work.

And, if you don't want girls eating in your bedroom, say something and make sure they feel comfortable eating in the kitchen or living room! Many girls are warned by their seminaries that the people they are going to don't have a lot of money so they may feel uncomfortable eating a lot by the meal. Furthermore, they may have eating restrictions. I'm a vegetarian and inevitably, when my friends or seminary set up the meal, that fact was never communicated. When I was at seminary there were many meals that consisted of only meat and maybe some chummus. I learned to always bring some sort of food with me just in case. I felt it would be rude to eat my own food in front of everyone and considering that in my family growing up, there was no rule against eating in your bedroom, it never occurred to me that it would be a problem. If your family doesn't eat in the bedroom, then communicate that rule because it is not necessarily a given in all households (just like you also need to communicate shoes on or off in the house, etc).

mummiedearest

Sun, May 19 2013, 8:29 pm

my first shabbos in seminary (one out of two, I left after two weeks...) was spent mostly in my apartment ("the dorm") by myself. relatives of friends invited me over for meals. I would have cooked for myself otherwise. I got in "trouble" for staying in the dorm by myself. apparently this was against the rules... Rolling Eyes

I would have gone nuts if I had to stay somewhere for shabbos. the second shabbos was spent at the home of our "dorm mommy," and at least I had met her and had my roommates there.

a well-run sem should arrange for local families to host girls on a certain schedule. the hostesses should be able to inform the sem of their expectations of guests (help serve, clear table, take kids to the park for an hour in the afternoon, etc.) and their accommodations (fruit in the fridge for the taking, breakfast served, linens available or not, etc.). the girls should have uniform rules about when to confirm and when to cancel by. wednesday seems reasonable. there is really no reason to have everything up in the air as it is.

(ftr, my sem was not in israel.)

amother

Sun, May 19 2013, 8:34 pm

I ate in the room as a seminary girl. Like others said I didn't want to over eat and was definitely too embarrassed to ask /take food from TheI kitchen! I hope I never left crumbs but if I did it was obviously not intentional. These girls are away from home often homesick especially ones with no family in Israel.. It is difficult and awkward for them to always be a guest.. Keep that in mind before you judge them. I remember always being so touched when a host would leave a snack and drink for me in room or whever or send us home with food.. Never expected but always showed they really cared and it just felt good to feel taken care if when do far from family.