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How should I react to death-obsessed 5 old?



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bigsis144




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 6:26 pm
So my almost-5-year has been on a very morbid streak for the past few weeks.

We have not had a recent death in the family, we do not live in Israel/I have not been extensively describing the situation in Israel to him, and while he's seen a few Disney movies with the obligatory dead parent(s), I don't think they're what's causing this.

Examples of things DS has said to me include:

Quote:

(while putting DS to bed)

Me: "Good night, Y. I love you."
Y: "Will you always love me?"
Me: "Of course! I will love you forever and ever, no matter what you ever do."
Y: "Will you love me even if I die?"
Me: "I would be very sad, but of course I would still love you..."
Y: "Will you love me even if I'm cut in half?"
M: (matter of fact-ly) "I hope that never happens. But, yes, I will always love you, no matter what happens."
Y: "Will you love me even if I'm on fire?"


Quote:
"Remember when I died and then came back to life?"


Quote:
"Ema, can I show you what a dead person looks like?" (lies down face-down in the middle of the kitchen)


Quote:

Y: "Ema, would you ever cut me in half?"
Me: "No. Why would I do that??"
Y: "Maybe if I ate something yummy and then you wanted to eat it. You would cut me in half so you could have it."


My child has officially turned into Wednesday Addams. For now I'm ignoring/being matter-of-fact/trying as hard as possible not to have visibly disturbed reactions. I hope it's just a phase and he'll grow out of it as long as I don't make a big deal.

His mood when saying these things ranges from bemused to quite serious, but never visibly fearful or distraught.

Any advice? Is there any point at which I should consult a child psychologist?
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imasinger




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 6:34 pm
Have you asked him? "DS, you've been talking a lot about death and dying. Have you seen or heard anything that started you thinking or worrying about it? Death can be pretty scary to think about."
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Dolly Welsh




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 6:48 pm
Could he be angry?

Do you have a new baby?

Is there a bully around?

Has his father not been paying him enough attention?

The killer may be inside him.

Hugs to him.

To you too. You sound nice.
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animeme




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 6:51 pm
Has there been a birth? I don't know why, but my ds connected his sister's birth with a lot of death questions. He was about six.

If he's matter-of-fact without any anxiety or fear, he's likely just playing with some ideas in his head. And the "cut me in half" thing , etc? Could be video games, or cartoons.
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mummiedearest




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 7:01 pm
my kids started showing an interest in death at the age of 3 and 2. the then 3 yr old learned about the avos being buried in mearas hamachpelah. he talked a lot about how when you die, your sons have to put you in a cave. this spurred a whole lot of questions from both children. we answered each question seriously. the fascination has still not gone away. within the last two years, the kids have lost 3 great-grandparents, and they already had quite a grasp on the meaning of death based on all their early questions. with death in the family, we got other questions, like, "how did the doctors know grandma is dead? maybe she's just sleeping and they put her in a box and buried her and she'll wake up buried." beforehand, the questions were less out of fear, they were more like, "mommy, when you die, can I have your jewelry?" (gotta love six-year-olds...)

anyway, boys do pick up on particular ways to die. I would definitely ask him about this recent fascination. ask him if some kids talk about death in camp/school and what he thinks it means. he sounds confused about something, but it may not be a death-related issue.
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MommytoB




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 7:02 pm
All of my kids have gone through a stage between ages 3 - 5 where they are obsessed with death. Current almost 4 year old when I tell him I love him forever says "what about when we die?" With varying degrees they have all asked repeatedly about anything and everything related to death. Just keep on message with a consistent answer.
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naomi2




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 7:07 pm
MommytoB wrote:
All of my kids have gone through a stage between ages 3 - 5 where they are obsessed with death. Current almost 4 year old when I tell him I love him forever says "what about when we die?" With varying degrees they have all asked repeatedly about anything and everything related to death. Just keep on message with a consistent answer.


just finished this conversation with DS 5!

apparently it is pretty common and if he doesn't seem anxious about it I wouldn't worry.

another poster suggested asking why he's so interested in it. that sounds like a good idea just in case. but leave out the part that labels death as being "pretty scary".
no need to put ideas into his mind. death shouldn't be scary, just a fact of life.
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imasinger




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 7:12 pm
naomi2 wrote:
just finished this conversation with DS 5!

apparently it is pretty common and if he doesn't seem anxious about it I wouldn't worry.

another poster suggested asking why he's so interested in it. that sounds like a good idea just in case. but leave out the part that labels death as being "pretty scary".
no need to put ideas into his mind. death shouldn't be scary, just a fact of life.


That sounds like you may have your own discomfort on the topic.

Of course death is scary. Tellng a kid that it isn't, or that it is "just a part of life" is doublespeak. Many things that are just a part of life are scary, including shots, scraped knees, angry and yelling adults, and roller coasters. Far better to tell the truth and help him process his feelings.


Last edited by imasinger on Mon, Jul 28 2014, 7:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Zehava




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 7:17 pm
Has his rebbe mentioned anything that might have got him thinking?? It's close to tisha bav maybe he was teaching about the churban and people dying.
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amother


 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 7:23 pm
My kids do it too - not with this intensity, true, but some really *squirmy* moments there... it kind of spurred me into thinking about my own views on death, and trying to be honest with them about it - something along the lines of

Hashem decides when each person dies and goes to shamayim, and while I hope to be together with you a long time, Hashem is the one Who decides when each person is niftar, and I don't worry because I know He will give me as long a life as He knows is perfect for me.

(that was in response to when will I die, or something.)

It helped when I remembered how my grandmother started packing to move to Israel during the Cuban Missile Crisis - she said if the world will be a nuclear wasteland, either she wants to die in Israel or Israel will be the only place to survive, and either option is okay. That gave me a lot of perspective.

I think the advice above is right on target, though. You sound like a cool mom.
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2cents




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 7:26 pm
my four year old kept asking about death around pesach time. like: "will you hold my hand when I'm dying?"
and "I'm scared I'm going to dye tonight".
really scary for me as a mother to hear!
finally, he burst into tears one night and said he doesn't want to dye because he's scared of the water. after prodding for an explanation, turns out he had learned about paroh's army drowning in the yam suf and it was terrifying him.

he got over it and seems fine now, but I would get so shaken up hearing my baby talk this way! had it not stopped soon, I would have sought therapy/help to figure out what was scaring him.
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bigsis144




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 8:08 pm
Thanks for the advice and reassurance, everyone.

My mother-in-law worried me a bit when she overheard one of DS's macabre comments and said, "Your kid is downright creepy. I sure never heard my kids or any others talk like that..."

I responded with all the confidence I could muster that he's an otherwise visibly happy child who is bright, inquisitive and imaginative, so I'm sure this too shall pass, but I'll keep an eye out in case it becomes more upsetting to him.

I guess I'm just still shaking off that comment a bit.

So, really, everybody, thanks for letting me know I'm on the right track and what I should ask/look out for.
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amother


 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 8:17 pm
My daughter is learning how our family tree works, who is whose sister, etc.
my mother is dead and whenever she says who my mother is she always follows it up with "and she died". (My daughter is 4.5)

When my son what's around that age he once told me in the car while I was driving "mommy be careful eating your nectarine, cause I don't want you to get into an accident because then you'll die, I'll die and Esther will die, and Esther and I don't want to die"

The splitting in half made me think of a magic trick, had he seen some magic recently? Also is it possible someone showed him the YouTube video "dumb ways to die"?
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 28 2014, 11:33 pm
I think it's totally age appropriate, as long as he doesn't have extreme anxiety, nightmares, etc.

Instead of worrying about having all the right answers, work on having all the right questions. Open up the conversation and let him do most of the talking. Keep it moving by being interested and saying things like "Why do you think that would happen?" and "What do you think would happen next?" I guarantee you, you'll get to the bottom of whatever is going around in his little mind, and once he's got it all out he'll probably back down on the obsession very quickly.

BT/DT
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amother


 

Post Tue, Jul 29 2014, 12:19 pm
If this goes on for a while you may want to ask your pediatrician about it. Talk about death and "would you still love me if I killed someone" was the begining of an anxiety disorder for a couple of relatives. While it may just be a stage, if you are nervous it does not hurt to ask a professional.
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self-actualization




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jul 29 2014, 1:21 pm
My two older kids are very deep thinkers and went through similar things. We talk about neshamas, and people coming back when mashiach comes. We also talk about how most people who die are old and have accomplished a lot.

As an aside, just the other day my daughter, who is 4 1/2, said - how do chickens grow? I said - they are animals, not plants. They grow up on a farm and when they are old enough, they are killed to make food. Don't worry, it's after they get married and have children and their children are able to live on their own.

Next question: how do we kill chickens.
Answer - in Jewish law we do it the most pain free way. We cut their throat so they can't breathe and they die right away.
Older brother asks - so how do non-Jews kill their chickens?
Answer - they bop them over the head.
Next question (I don't remember who asked) - how do we know that our way is better?
Answer - we don't know for sure, because we can't ask the chicken, but this method was given to Moshe at Har Sinai.

When my son was 5 years old we went down a similar line of questions regarding death and souls. By accident I had pocket-dialed my husband and the whole conversation went to his voice mail. He thought we were crazy! But my two older ones are very deep thinkers and they want to be satisfied with the real answers.
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naomi2




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jul 29 2014, 2:45 pm
imasinger wrote:
That sounds like you may have your own discomfort on the topic.

Of course death is scary. Tellng a kid that it isn't, or that it is "just a part of life" is doublespeak. Many things that are just a part of life are scary, including shots, scraped knees, angry and yelling adults, and roller coasters. Far better to tell the truth and help him process his feelings.


why are you assuming things about my feelings on death?

I didn't say to tell the child that death is or is not scary. I said not to label feelings that he didn't express or to give him ideas about how he should feel, just leave it out entirely. by asking what he thinks about death or why he is curious you will get a good idea of how he feels about it. then you can proceed from there.
OP's child seems to be curious about it not anxious or scared.
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