Father Asks School To Bar Unvaccinated Children for son

Scrabble123

Thu, Jan 29 2015, 1:08 pm

amother wrote:

Doesn't mean that whoever wrote that post is emotionally damaged and such. That's kind of cruel to say that.
I'm anonymous because unfortunately people equate not vaccinating with killing which is so wrong and untrue. And I don't want to identify myself and have others call me a killer.

Let me just tell you something. People will never agree with everything you do. No matter what it is, there will always be someone there to disagree. When you make a decision with all of the right "reasons" to do so, you have to support yourself 100%. Part of that support is not being ashamed of what others will say. I don't agree with your decision and opinion regarding vaccines and find it to be a gross mistake on your behalf possibly resulting from a variety of reasons, but I respect you as a human being and want a face to respect.

Hashem_Yaazor

Thu, Jan 29 2015, 1:27 pm

I understand why people are going amother on this.

I have been bashed repeatedly for not even having an anti-vax view, but because people assume I do since I actually question and push the boundaries, people have seen fit to accuse me of all sorts of behavior and probably think less of me as a person/poster because I dare to disagree. I still am not going anonymous, but it would be too late anyway Wink

If no one knew my views, and I posted elsewhere under my screenname, they would not be imposing their biases elsewhere. There definitely is more animosity to anti-vaxers (on this site and the real world), likely out of fear. I sort of understand it, but not to the degree it's taken. I wouldn't be surprised if in the not-so-far future, people start calling CPS on non-vaxxers. That's the world we live in today.

southernbubby

Thu, Jan 29 2015, 1:35 pm

Hashem_Yaazor wrote:

I never use amother. If I am going to bother to get into these discussions, I want to take credit for my ideas. There are some people on here who use amother to bash, so let them bash a live personality (me). I used to take it personally but then I read some of the threads on why people love to bash so let them enjoy themselves. And some of them are dysfunctional individuals so for all we know the same lady might be arguing with her self, all anonymously of course and the rest of us geniuses get all excited and argue with some nameless, faceless, cowardly troll. Amother was supposed to be so that women could talk about personal situations without giving personal information. It has been beyond abused on this site. You are a wonderful mod and you are a very intelligent woman and you see for yourself that posters who are putting inflammatory statements out there anonymously do not make imamother more enjoyable for those of us who play by the rules. The best thing to do is ignore them which maybe some of you can make me a chart with stars on it for actually doing it.

southernbubby

Thu, Jan 29 2015, 1:38 pm

Hashem_Yaazor wrote:

It's not about being ashamed what others will say. There is no guilt for someone who has convictions.

It's about protecting one's own safety and getting respect elsewhere which is not happening to anti-vaxers who write under their screennames.

So maybe the answer is to delete those posts who are not in respectful disagreement. We are obviously in the topic to discuss our viewpoints and we obviously have conflicting viewpoints and a few of the anti-vaxers have not been respectful either but if something is really an attack, it should be reported and deleted.

Fox

Thu, Jan 29 2015, 2:30 pm

I've been watching this conversation unfold for several days, trying to think through the issues as well as attempt to contain my pro-vax bias (which I'm not sure is entirely possible).

I think the analogy between peanut allergies and this situation is somewhat flawed. The real question is whether public schools have the right to set various standards for attendance and the degree to which parents who disagree with those standards should be accommodated.

A better analogy, I think, would be the presence of frum Jewish children in public schools.

Is it reasonable for parents to ask that their children be excused on Jewish holidays and activities centered around non-Jewish holidays? Yes -- the absence of those children will not change what is being provided for the majority.

Is it reasonable for parents to ask that the public schools close in honor of Jewish holidays and that Jewish learning be integrated into the curriculum? No. A public school, no matter how sensitive to minority opinions, is by nature in the business of catering (within legal and civic parameters) to the values and standards of the majority.

So what did the observant Jewish community do? We started our own schools.

The majority of people in the Marin County schools, armed with not- insubstantial arguments, favor an environment where children have been vaccinated. Is it possible they are wrong? Sure! They may be wrong about all kinds of things, including how to best teach reading. That said, they are relying on the most authoritative evidence available to them.

If non-vaxers feel strongly about the issue, why not start their own schools? And if that's too much trouble, maybe they don't feel so stronging about vaccinations after all.

Frumdoc

Thu, Jan 29 2015, 2:41 pm

Couple of facts to chew on.

1. Medical textbooks are not written or published by drug companies, or not the ones that are used in medical schools or postgrad training. Of the 100 odd medical textbooks I have on my shelves, there is not a single one written by or published by a drug company.

2. Hepatitis B kills people. Of those who go on from acute to chronic infection (rates vary from 10 to 90% depending on the age you are when you get infected - the younger you are, the more likely to develop chronic infection) the up to 25% of chronic Hep B pts die from their infection and the effect it has on the liver.

I've seen plenty of people die from hep b, it is horrible, one of the nastiest most gruesome deaths, usually they vomit blood until there is none left, and continue to do so as you transfuse more and more in. They are deep yellow, covered in bruises from deranged clotting caused by their illness, delirious from liver failure and puffed up with fluid filling their abdomen so they look 9 months pregnant.

Now I don't care if you vaccinate your children against hep b, because it isn't likely to contaminate me or my family. It is a decision based on the probability of infection in your community, if it is low or high, then make a risk assessment and do what you want.

But don't tout the nonsense of "hepatitis B is harmless, I've never seen anyone die from it so it is all just a CDC scare tactic".

Have you personally seen someone die from meningitis, or have their neck broken, or die in an MVA? Or seen a fungating breast tumor erode through the chest wall and invade an artery so they bleed to death? Or a stillborn? Yet you don't deny those things happen, and you might even try to protect against them,with seatbelts, mamograms or prenatal checks or vitamins.

Sure, on here the actual, verifiable facts are as believable as the nonsense others claim is true. Don't believe me, it doesn't matter who I am or who I say I am, what I am saying is checkable, and you can confirm what you want - that is the "magic" of science.

Hashem_Yaazor

Thu, Jan 29 2015, 2:45 pm

southernbubby wrote:

It's a two way street.

I see a lack of respect and attacking on both ends.

But that is not what I am talking about.

I am talking about what goes beyond these discussions and how the animosity to anti-vaxers is carried on well beyond these threads.

I am not a strong supporter of amother (I have only posted in one thread as amother, when pregnant with a breech baby in 2008, a total of 3 posts I think). But I don't think it's abusing amother to protect one's safety in such a controversial issue with the climate being what it is these days.

Barbara

Thu, Jan 29 2015, 3:32 pm

Hashem_Yaazor wrote:

It is against the rules of the site, however. And its sad to see the practice endorsed by a moderator.