Women not allowed to wear eyeliner?

ftmother

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 12:10 pm

Does it say in shulchan aruch that a woman is not allowed to wear eyeliner? Crying

Maya

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 12:20 pm

I was taught in school that it is assur. I now know that is not actually true.

ftmother

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 12:34 pm

I don't know, someone just told me it says in shulchan aruch. baruch Hashem I'm not the only one who has never heard of that!

amother

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 12:36 pm

I don't think we were taught that it says in shulchan aruch, just that Yeshaya hanavi gave mussar to the daughters of Israel that they colored their eyes... or something like that.

I personally accepted this chumra/kabalah. Many others from my school/class/community wear eyeliner, so it's not even minhag hamakom.

I'm Satmar Williamsburg, if it helps clarify.

rising hero

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 12:48 pm

Maya wrote:

I was taught in school that it is assur. I now know that is not actually true.

This. And perfume. And less than four inches etc etc...and whoever does is gonna burn in hell for it לעולם ועד Rolling Eyes

Chayalle

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 12:52 pm

amother wrote:

I don't think we were taught that it says in shulchan aruch, just that Yeshaya hanavi gave mussar to the daughters of Israel that they colored their eyes... or something like that.

I was taught, in high school, using texts, that Yeshaya Hanavi gave mussar to the Bnos Yisrael for wearing excessive eye coloring.

I personally wear eyeliner and eyeshadow, but I go for a subdued look.

I'm not giving any piskei halacha here. Not saying how to define what is/isn't excessive. Just what I learned.

loveandpeace

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 1:12 pm

Tznius is a feeling if u can be honest with urself u will figure out if it's assur or not. Also if ur hub needs it and stuff. What's ok for me might not b ok for u.
N vice versa

4everonadiet

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 1:24 pm

I do hear that all the time. Someone even suggested I ask a shaylah. Do you have a clue how I would look without liner?????

I can't believe Hashem would want me to look so terrible...

Chayalle

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 1:30 pm

loveandpeace wrote:

Tznius is a feeling if u can be honest with urself u will figure out if it's assur or not. Also if ur hub needs it and stuff. What's ok for me might not b ok for u.
N vice versa

I strongly disagree. Tznius is Halacha. Not a feeling.

amother

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 1:48 pm

4everonadiet wrote:

I do hear that all the time. Someone even suggested I ask a shaylah. Do you have a clue how I would look without liner?????

I can't believe Hashem would want me to look so terrible...

My friend looks like a cancer patient without it...

I totally hear you. As has been mentioned, it's not halacha even though your community minhag may be to frown upon it.

If your husband is ok with it or asks for it, why are you even worried about it? Let everyone be bodek their own tzitzis.

ftmother

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 1:48 pm

I just read in the tznius a day book from rabbi falk that excessive eyeliner is a problem and its also minhag hamakom.

youngishbear

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 1:49 pm

Chayalle wrote:

I strongly disagree. Tznius is Halacha. Not a feeling.

True and untrue.

If you consider tznius refinement, there is a spirit of the law that's hard to express with black and white rules.

zaq

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 1:58 pm

Find some woman who dislikes you intensely and ask her to rate your eye makeup. If she says you look like a streetwalker, you are wearing too much.

ftmother

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 2:02 pm

Hahaha nice answer, but I would hope people who like me would be honest too Wink

youngishbear

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 2:02 pm

zaq wrote:

Find some woman who dislikes you intensely and ask her to rate your eye makeup. If she says you look like a streetwalker, you are wearing too much.

Trust zaq to come up with a creative solution...

This is where the "tznius is a feeling" part comes in. Shulchan aruch (or the navi) doesn't specify how many swipes of mascara is too many, and the answer to this will depend on the individual.

zaq

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 2:26 pm

ftmother wrote:

Hahaha nice answer, but I would hope people who like me would be honest too Wink

Hope all you want, but do not bet on it. That is why I suggest someone who dislikes you...a lot. She will be brutally honest. A friend will not want to hurt your feelings and get all mealy-mouthed: "well, it's somewhat more than I would wear, but then your coloring is so much richer than mine, you need more dramatic makeup that won't just disappear on you." And you will believe it because you want to.

mommy1108

Fri, Feb 27 2015, 2:50 pm

youngishbear wrote:

True and untrue.

If you consider tznius refinement, there is a spirit of the law that's hard to express with black and white rules.

Spirit of the law and refinement apply to sensitivities. The statement that you made was general about tznius. Tznius is cut and dry Halacha. Period. If you want to talk refinement, that is where you can apply the grey area idea and pick and choose sensitivities based on your own instincts

DrMom

Sat, Feb 28 2015, 9:59 am

ftmother wrote:

Does it say in shulchan aruch that a woman is not allowed to wear eyeliner? Crying

Is it allowed for men?