Meet the Satmar Hassidim Planning a Zionist Settlement

Sanguine

Mon, May 04 2015, 2:26 am

MagentaYenta wrote:

Frankly, I have no dog in this fight but I find the whole concept fascinating.

Me too and I love this forum cause I go to sleep and come back and the discussion went on and now I can post

I have to comment on this post cause I actually made aliya to a kibbutz for its supposed idealism

amother Bisque wrote:

The kibbutz movement was supposed to be a socialist way of life -they're actually falling apart-in theory it seemed very idealistic but we see communism also fell apart and capitalism is thriving. Hashem wants there to be all kinds rich poor etc.

Hashem doesn't want poor people to have people who starve in the street. People are rich or poor cause of what Hashem gave them (talent, rich parents, a winning lottery ticket...), and people are poor cause of what Hashem gave them (bad luck, poor health, lower intelligence...). And the rich should take care of the poor. Kibbutz in its ideal is actually the highest form of Tzedaka. "Each gives according to their ability and each receives according to their needs". I can feed and clothe my 10 kids even though I can only peel potatoes in the kitchen. My children will receive the same as yours (or more if they need more) even though you have just 2 kids and you work in hi-tech. I think that's what Hashem really wants with all types of people, not that some people shoulld actually be starving poor and have to beg for Tzedaka. But the Kibbutz ideal fell apart cause it's not sheltered from the big world and the next generation wasn't willing to break their backs working while living in a 2 room house when they saw what was out there. The problem was that there was no motivation to try harder. OK - enough of my kibbutz speech (though I think Kollel has a similar problem) - Now on to Satmar Zionists...

myself wrote:

There are plenty of Satmar'ers in Israel. Can anyone explain why this group is different? What's Zionist about them? Are they planning to join the army? Wink

the article wrote:

When he is asked about service in the army, his answer is clear: “I am from the Levite tribe, which was always in the front ranks, with the Ark of the Covenant and a drawn sword. Until the Sanhedrin of 72 wise men is established, the IDF is apparently the holiest organization in the Nation of Israel.

Read the article again. These guys are so idealistic it's scary.

the article wrote:

The group is very knowledgeable about Israeli politics. “We love Moshe Feiglin very much. Regrettably, he did not enter the Knesset, so some of our guys support Eli Yishai, others Naftali Bennett. Our guys are further rightward than Bennett, some are even in the direction of Kahane.”

A member of the group identified as Yaakov told Klein he wants to live in the Land of Israel and does not care where. “It can be in Damascus, as far as I am concerned. I'm not joking, That, in my eyes, is the problem of the religious-Zionist public, which is always fighting not to give back territory. It's absurd – we should talk about annexing more territory. “

They're making their own religion (Satmar but their goal is against the way of the Satmar Rebbe?), and they're making their own Zionism too (won't speak Hebrew, the language of the modern state - What else won't they do?).
And now for an interesting thought -

Maya wrote:

The one problem is that the wives are much more resistant to the idea of moving that far away from their families. That's why it hasn't actually happened yet.

Well, what do they think of this?

Quote:

Mishna Ketubot Chapter 13 Mishna 11
[A MAN] MAY COMPEL ALL [HIS HOUSEHOLD] TO GO UP [WITH HIM] TO THE LAND
OF ISRAEL., BUT NONE MAY BE COMPELLED TO LEAVE IT. [ONE’S ENTIRE
HOUSEHOLD] MAY BE COMPELLED TO GO UP TO JERUSALEM BUT NONE MAY BE
COMPELLED TO LEAVE IT. [THIS APPLIES TO] BOTH MEN AND WOMEN
Babylonian Talmud Tractate Ketubot Folio 110 side B
Our Rabbis taught: If [the husband] desiresto go up and his wife refuses she must
be pressed to go up; and if [she does] not [consent] she may be divorced without a
ketuba. If she desires to go up and be refuses, he must be pressed to go up; and if
[he does] not [consent] he must divorce her and pay her ketuba. If she desires to
leave and he refuses to leave, she must be pressed not to leave, and if [pressure is
of] no [avail] she may be divorced without a ketuba. If he desires to leave and she
refuses he must be pressed not to leave, and if [coercion is of] no [avail] he must
divorce her and pay her ketuba.

Just wanted to comment on that

So those are my comments on the posts. I do think that it's wonderful that they want to move here and that they really understand the idea of Religious Zionism as started by Rav Kook. I'm not at all surprised that people that are so Makpid on Mitzvot want to live in EY as Zionists. I always say that I don't understand how these big rabbanim justify living in Chu"l and passing up on all the extra Mitzvot that we are zocheh to keep here. And I also don't understand people who don't appreciate that the modern state is what allows so many people to keep these mitzvot that are Tluyot BaAretz.

I hope they're a big enough group to succeed.