LETTUCE!!!!! None to be found in Israel.

m in Israel

Mon, May 25 2015, 1:41 am

water_bear88 wrote:

I noticed this thread last night but didn't open it- weirdly, this is the first Friday in several weeks my husband was able to find lettuce that wasn't half-rotten! I would like to know, is there anyone who doesn't hold by matza menutak? I thought it met everyone's standards (definitely lets the land rest, still buying form Jewish Israeli farmers).

In theory I think everyone does "hold" by matza menutak. But you know it wouldn't be so simple to find something that everyone here in Israel agrees on, right? Wink

There are different opinions on what constitutes "menutak" -- basically a question of what type of material is used to separate the growing items from the ground (whether it is halachically considered porous or not).

Similarly, I"m pretty sure everyone theoretically agrees that shmitta today only applies to the borders of Olei Bavel, and not Olei Mitzrayim -- but again, lots of contoversy over where those borders actually are (hence the labeling of produce as coming form "drom arava" vs. "arava tzefonit", etc.)

BTW, for those of you who mentioned school schedules -- my kids had regular school on Friday (well, regular Friday schedule -- till 11:30), and they have school today as well (although only until 2:30)! Their Chadarim really do NOT give a lot of time off for ANYTHING Smile

water_bear88

Mon, May 25 2015, 2:18 am

m in Israel wrote:

In theory I think everyone does "hold" by matza menutak. But you know it wouldn't be so simple to find something that everyone here in Israel agrees on, right? Wink

Thanks for the explanation!

Sanguine

Mon, May 25 2015, 2:33 am

We're all required to keep Shmitta (just like Kashrut), but there are always different interpretations - All kosher, but different. I've been to weddings where there are signs on each serving dish stating which Hechsher it is (I ate everything Wink

) . I was once at a Ponevitch wedding where they served only fish cause the Chattan and Kallah's families didn't hold by the same Hechsher for meat. Neither one was "more" Kosher, just different.

What's nice in Israel is that they almost "force" people to keep Shmitta, no matter how secular they are, since most the big supermarket's fruits and vegetables are Heter Mechira.

cinnamon

Mon, May 25 2015, 2:36 am

Sanguine wrote:

) . I was once at a Ponevitch wedding where they served only fish cause the Chattan and Kallah's families didn't hold by the same Hechsher for meat. Neither one was "more" Kosher, just different.

Hi Sang, can you write this on my thread about passing on food?
I seriously don't get what the big deal is.

grace413

Mon, May 25 2015, 2:56 am

Smile1234 wrote:

The noshnoshim salad is good with just white cabbage too, I've made it numerous times when there was no lettuce to be found.

My neighbor's aunt came from america and brought her (dont ask me how) POS'TIVE LETTUCE!! Now how's that for real chu"l lettuce? I'm so jealous Wink

WADR, it's illegal for individuals to bring fresh produce into Israel from abroad.

Smile1234

Mon, May 25 2015, 8:23 am

grace413 wrote:

WADR, it's illegal for individuals to bring fresh produce into Israel from abroad.

Well they didnt get caught Smile

And since I posted this I heard about others who also had fresh lettuce brought from America for yt... go figure! I dont think anyone would bring it for me if I asked lol

StripedFlower

Mon, May 25 2015, 8:46 pm

sped wrote:

We used only Badatz, but my FIL checked it out a few weeks ago and said there is a big improvement in Rav Efratis this year.
Just throwing that out for you.

Do you mean Eidah Chareidis?

What's chul? Chutz Laaretz?

m in Israel

Mon, May 25 2015, 11:17 pm

StripedFlower wrote:

Do you mean Eidah Chareidis?

What's chul? Chutz Laaretz?

"Badatz" stands for "Beis Din Tzedek" Most of the private hechsherim in Israel are called the "Badatz of X" or "Badatz of Y". Colloquially, when someone simply says "Badatz" without referring to which one it usually means the Eidah Chareidis (which it clearly does here based on context).

"Chul" is chutz laaretz, and in this context it is referring to produce coming from outside of EY (or outside of the parts of EY which are mechuyav in shmitta). Due to shmitta concerns all produce this year is categorized in different ways and different people prefer different types. There is "yuval chul" (including certain parts of the Negev) "yuval nochri" "heter mechira" "otzar Beis Din" "matza menutak", etc.

In the context of the OP, she wants lettuce that is grown in an area that the Badatz Eidah Hachareidis considers "chul" with regard to shmitta, and is under that hechsher for both shmitta and bug infestation issues.

June

Mon, May 25 2015, 11:52 pm

m in Israel wrote:

Similarly, I"m pretty sure everyone theoretically agrees that shmitta today only applies to the borders of Olei Bavel, and not Olei Mitzrayim -- but again, lots of contoversy over where those borders actually are (hence the labeling of produce as coming form "drom arava" vs. "arava tzefonit", etc.)

once we're on the topic, does anyone know what "moshav tzofer" or "moshav paran" are? rami levi has veggies from there, and we're not sure what it means.

water_bear88

Tue, May 26 2015, 12:43 am

June wrote:

once we're on the topic, does anyone know what "moshav tzofer" or "moshav paran" are? rami levi has veggies from there, and we're not sure what it means.

https://www.google.com/maps/@3.....9,10z

I just searched for them on Google Maps- they're both roughly southeast of Mitzpe Ramon (which is itself about a third of the way to Eilat from Beer Sheva), on the Jordanian border.

luppamom

Tue, May 26 2015, 12:48 am

This is a question for your LOR. But, I am happy to share what I heard (not from a rav).

Paran is a Jewish yeshuv that is questionable if it is in Eretz Yisroel or not. I think the Eidah says it is not Eretz Yisroel and therefore can be treated like chu"l. That's probably why they're selling it in a store that has an Eidah hechsher on the fruits and vegetables.
BUT, some are more machmir and say it should be treated like Eretz Yisroel and is a problem to buy. This is why it's a good idea to ask about this specific thing.

I don't know anything about Tzofer. I'm guessing that it is similar to Paran.

luppamom

Tue, May 26 2015, 12:50 am

m in Israel wrote:

Here's my question. What's matzah menutak? I don't think I've seen that term yet.

etky

Tue, May 26 2015, 1:42 am

luppamom wrote:

Here's my question. What's matzah menutak? I don't think I've seen that term yet.

Detached growing beds - I.e,. produce that is technically not grown in the ground. Has similar halachot to hydroponically grown produce (gidulay mayim).