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Forum -> Announcements & Mazel Tovs -> Tehillim Needed
Bad news for the Jews
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PinkFridge




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 15 2015, 10:41 am
Barbara wrote:
You don't have to support the deal, or Obama.

But when someone refers to Obama as a "shartza" -- ie, a n1gger -- a "Muslim" and an "anti-Semite," then they paint themselves as a racist and a fool.


I agree that that's not constructive and understand how doing that doesn't much for the speaker's credibility. (Usually. While I didn't like it I still appreciate that poster's points in this case.) However, one can say that one finds the ties he has to the Muslim world, whether pragmatic or ideological, disconcerting. But I'm not even thinking about that.
Wait, right now I'm listening to post conference questions. "Are you concerned that Assad likes this, that so many Iranians are still shouting Death to Israel?" Probably from Fox news but still glad it's coming out.
The president's really faltering.
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PinkFridge




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 15 2015, 10:45 am
Sanguine wrote:
Nope - They burn Israeli and American flags together. But our problems are 1 - We're just a stone throw away from them. 2 - The anti-semites of the world aren't looking to destroy America. They're looking to destroy Israel, the Jewish homeland.


I wasn't trying to minimize that. Just saying that this is enough to make anyone concerned, including Americans who aren't thinking of Israel.

Hm...the president's using the no better alternative line. Should we start a new thread and brainstorm?
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PinkFridge




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 15 2015, 10:52 am
Barbara wrote:
This is one part of the deal that I don't particularly like, FTR. But if we're going to discuss it, let's get it right.



You and the rest of the world don't like it. The pres. is addressing this right now. He says that with the hashgacha temidis we will have we'll know if something's going on in the chain, and then they'll have some splaining to do. (He didn't say splaining, but said explaining.)
Then if they refuse to let us in, we will have the right to override it. And if they continue to refuse, we'll just snap back sanctions.

He just said, snap back sanctions.

Then why not snap back sanctions NOW for the refusals????
I really don't get this.
Has there been any expression of good will on Iran's part?


Last edited by PinkFridge on Wed, Jul 15 2015, 10:52 am; edited 1 time in total
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GreenEyes26




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 15 2015, 10:52 am
fmt4 wrote:
Wow, you know all this top secret information and you haven't told anyone? You have to send letters to all the newspapers and call the CIA, FBI and the NSA! Maybe you can still save the world from the evil Muslim super- spy!


Rolling Eyes
Rolling Eyes
Rolling Eyes


I mean, seriously.
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wiki




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 15 2015, 11:17 am
Quote:
Then if they refuse to let us in, we will have the right to override it. And if they continue to refuse, we'll just snap back sanctions.

He just said, snap back sanctions.

Then why not snap back sanctions NOW for the refusals????
I really don't get this.
Has there been any expression of good will on Iran's part?


The sanctions were an international effort. Most of those countries only agreed to the sanctions as a conditional medium-term arrangement to buy us time and pressure to make a deal. Lots of those countries will NEVER snap their sanctions back into place in Congress doesn't ratify the deal.

I am no fan of the deal that Obama and Iran have pieced together, but unfortunately at this point, Obama may be right that all of the alternatives look much worse.

Definitely daven. This is not the outcome I was hoping for, but we can still daven to Hashem and hope that the arrangement will work out all for the best.
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happybeingamom




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 15 2015, 12:19 pm
Lev Melachim B'Yad Hashem

The answer is Teshuva, Tefila V'Tzedoka. There is no point screaming about Obama. I did what I could, I did not vote for him but the rest is out of my control.
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Raisin




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 15 2015, 12:41 pm
I skimmed the NYT article. At one point Obama compares himself to Reagan and Nixon, who respectively broke the cold wars with Russia and China. I don't know much about China, but in general Gorbachov is given a lot more credit then Reagan for ending the cold war. I think it would have ended without reagan, but not without gorbachov. (I think china also had a relatively liberal leader)

So if Iran had a gorbachov, we might be talking. Do they?

The fact that Israel doesn't like this is not good news.
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ally




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 15 2015, 1:04 pm
Raisin wrote:
I skimmed the NYT article. At one point Obama compares himself to Reagan and Nixon, who respectively broke the cold wars with Russia and China. I don't know much about China, but in general Gorbachov is given a lot more credit then Reagan for ending the cold war. I think it would have ended without reagan, but not without gorbachov. (I think china also had a relatively liberal leader)

So if Iran had a gorbachov, we might be talking. Do they?

The fact that Israel doesn't like this is not good news.


Yes. Can I point out that while Obama is busy snidely attacking Netanyahu as per usual, in contrast to other conflicts, criticism and concern are being voiced by parties across the spectrum in Israel. Not just the right. And that says a lot.
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PinkFridge




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 15 2015, 1:20 pm
wiki wrote:
Quote:
Then if they refuse to let us in, we will have the right to override it. And if they continue to refuse, we'll just snap back sanctions.

He just said, snap back sanctions.

Then why not snap back sanctions NOW for the refusals????
I really don't get this.
Has there been any expression of good will on Iran's part?


The sanctions were an international effort. Most of those countries only agreed to the sanctions as a conditional medium-term arrangement to buy us time and pressure to make a deal. Lots of those countries will NEVER snap their sanctions back into place in Congress doesn't ratify the deal.

I am no fan of the deal that Obama and Iran have pieced together, but unfortunately at this point, Obama may be right that all of the alternatives look much worse.

Definitely daven. This is not the outcome I was hoping for, but we can still daven to Hashem and hope that the arrangement will work out all for the best.


A number of good points here.
Remind me again, who comprised the international effort?
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Kfar




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 15 2015, 11:28 pm
Time to wake up people -- write your congressman asap.


ttps://www.commentarymagazine.com/2015/07/15/much-worse-than-munich/
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etky




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jul 16 2015, 12:02 am
The way I see it, this agreement suffers from the same fundamental flaw that brought down the Oslo accords - the leap of faith that expects economic betterment and, in the case of Oslo, a measure of political autonomy, to moderate extremism, temper ideology and religious radicalism and quash anti-Western (and anti-Israel) sentiment. It's a long shot that this will materialize and if it doesn't I don't think that the safeguards in the deal offer enough assurances that Iran will not achieve nuclear capability for military purposes. Meanwhile the agreement is expected to spark off an arms race in the entire region, making it even more explosive and unstable than it is now.
It's highly irresponsible to undertake this gamble and yes, "appeasement" is exactly the word that comes to mind, with Obama in the role of Chamberlain.
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PinkFridge




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jul 16 2015, 6:23 am
etky wrote:
The way I see it, this agreement suffers from the same fundamental flaw that brought down the Oslo accords - the leap of faith that expects economic betterment and, in the case of Oslo, a measure of political autonomy, to moderate extremism, temper ideology and religious radicalism and quash anti-Western (and anti-Israel) sentiment. It's a long shot that this will materialize and if it doesn't I don't think that the safeguards in the deal offer enough assurances that Iran will not achieve nuclear capability for military purposes. Meanwhile the agreement is expected to spark off an arms race in the entire region, making it even more explosive and unstable than it is now.
It's highly irresponsible to undertake this gamble and yes, "appeasement" is exactly the word that comes to mind, with Obama in the role of Chamberlain.


You know, I'd thought the bolded was part of it too. But the president said that he doesn't expect any of that. All this plan is geared to do is prevent Iran from getting a bomb for 10 years.
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Sanguine




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jul 16 2015, 7:23 am
ValleyMom wrote:
I feel so pathetic I have NO clue what is going on dealing with kids and their daily "crisis" in the summer... Can someone clarify the entire situation with several bullet points.

I am such an uninformed misfit...

The Israel Project
Everything you need to know about the Iran nuclear deal, in one graphic.


Now you get it?
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Iymnok




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jul 16 2015, 7:26 am
Sanguine, your signature is more appropriate than ever.
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