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The U.S versus everyone else



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ven




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 29 2015, 7:02 pm
As I stated in the previous topic I am from europe. I am sometimes still shocked about the vastly different lifestyles I detect on this forum. I do get a hunch that living in israel is more euro like then US like..
Things I discovered:
- having one bathroom is normal here, having two toilets max. Anything more is decadent or non excistent. So yes 7 bedroom houses still have one bathroom
- A good paycheck is about 2000 euro per month , a lot of people get a lot less. Granted everything else is payed for by the state.
- We move ,paint , etc everything ourselves
- Coupons do not exist , credit cards neither ( they do but are only used as emergency back up)
- we cook from scratch
- A normal house costs betweem 150.000 to 350.000
- We are not that friendly to outsiders , u kinda have to get to know us.
- We have 20 days paid vacation.
-...
I could go on , but whoww what a difference with US . Or am I wrong ?? Plzz correct me if I do think we live much more " basic"
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zaq




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 29 2015, 7:35 pm
The USA is a huge country with different regions, different ethnic groups, and very different lifestyles. A good paycheck in Mississippi is bupkes in Boston. You can buy an entire ranch deep in the heart of Wyoming for the same money that would net you a small apt. in Manhattan, though you'd have to pay extra for the cattle. There are neighborhoods in the US where over 100 different languages are spoken, and there are places where if your great-grandpappy wasn't born there, you're a newcomer to be viewed with suspicion.

As a country, the US is big, rich, generous, naive, optimistic, ingenious, creative, wasteful, open and accepting. No other country on earth except Israel is as accepting of and generous and kind to foreign immigrants. But as individuals, we are as different from one another as it is possible for individuals of the same species to be--some are nice and some not nice at all. We are not so much a melting pot as a salad bowl, with contributions good and bad from innumerable different nationalities that have chosen to make this place their home.

I have one bathroom, cook from scratch, make a modest living, live in a small apt, don't own a motor vehicle, seldom go to the movies,never listen to country-western music, and couldn't care less about baseball. I am very American, and pleased and proud to be so.
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yo'ma




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 29 2015, 7:38 pm
ven wrote:
As I stated in the previous topic I am from europe. I am sometimes still shocked about the vastly different lifestyles I detect on this forum. I do get a hunch that living in israel is more euro like then US like..
Things I discovered:
- having one bathroom is normal here, having two toilets max. Anything more is decadent or non excistent. So yes 7 bedroom houses still have one bathroom I live in South America, not Europe or the US and in our 4 bedroom apartment we have 3 bathrooms. One is just a toilet and sink and the other two have one a bath and shower and one just a shower. The one with just a shower is made for a cleaning lady and that's where we get the fourth bedroom also, from the maids room, which we don't have a live in. When I lived in the states, I lived in a 3 bedroom house and apartment and both only had one bathroom each.
- A good paycheck is about 2000 euro per month , a lot of people get a lot less. Granted everything else is payed for by the state.
- We move ,paint , etc everything ourselves Again, we and like a lot of other people, we hire people to do these things.
- Coupons do not exist , credit cards neither ( they do but are only used as emergency back up) Coupons do not exist here either or extremely rarely, but credit cards is used a lot more often than cash here. They even give incentives to use the credit cards.
- we cook from scratch
- A normal house costs betweem 150.000 to 350.000
- We are not that friendly to outsiders , u kinda have to get to know us.
- We have 20 days paid vacation.
-...
I could go on , but whoww what a difference with US . Or am I wrong ?? Plzz correct me if I do think we live much more " basic"

I once asked about Europe and the answer was, each country has their own things. Saying all these things are European, I can't believe. A different mentality, yes, but as I always say, everyone is the same everywhere, even living the basics.
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Fox




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 29 2015, 7:41 pm
When you compare cultures, there are always going to be things you like more and less about each one.

* One key difference that I notice many Europeans don't fully comprehend is that the US isn't just one country. It's really 50 countries -- or at least 10-15 -- each with significantly different attitudes and values.

* Compared to Europe, we've got loads of space. This accounts for having lots of bathrooms, I guess. Obviously there are places where the population is quite dense (e.g., Manhattan and San Francisco), but a lot of what is "normal" in America is predicated on having a home where the buffalo roam, so to speak.

* The role of government is a bigger difference than you might realize. In general, Americans value having the government to do as little as possible. No one ever loses votes by saying that government should be smaller.

* Everything is new by comparison to Europe. This is an advantage and disadvantage.

* Class discrimination is almost non-existent. The only ones whose families have been here more than a few hundred years are the Native Americans, and so far, they haven't started any exclusive clubs or schools.

* Race is to America what social class is to Europe. It's the festering sore that we can never quite manage to heal.

* Vacation? Americans are spectacularly unfamiliar with that concept! For the benefit of our GNP and the detriment of our mental health, Americans are expected to work long hours with few breaks.

* Cooking from scratch? Well, if you're a mom who works 30 hours a week (considered "part-time") *and* you're paying $800 (728 Euros)for health insurance *and* sending your children to a school that receives no state subsidies . . . well, a cake mix is a decent compromise!

I don't think it's a matter of "basic" -- I think the elements of European life that are more rigorous (e.g., cooking from scratch rather than using pre-packaged food or shortcuts) exist precisely because other elements (e.g., vacation, maternity leave, social benefits) are less demanding.

Likewise, the elements of American life that are more rigorous (e.g., longer work weeks, less vacation, etc.) foster the shortcuts that we take.

Is one better than the other? Not really. I hate the American obsession with work, but I know I'd go nuts the first time I had to deal with a European bureaucrat over something.

Ultimately, you can have one bathroom or half a dozen; you're still going to run out of toilet tissue when you need it most!
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Laiya




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 29 2015, 8:14 pm
zaq wrote:
The USA is a huge country with different regions, different ethnic groups, and very different lifestyles. A good paycheck in Mississippi is bupkes in Boston. You can buy an entire ranch deep in the heart of Wyoming for the same money that would net you a small apt. in Manhattan, though you'd have to pay extra for the cattle. There are neighborhoods in the US where over 100 different languages are spoken, and there are places where if your great-grandpappy wasn't born there, you're a newcomer to be viewed with suspicion.

As a country, the US is big, rich, generous, naive, optimistic, ingenious, creative, wasteful, open and accepting. No other country on earth except Israel is as accepting of and generous and kind to foreign immigrants. But as individuals, we are as different from one another as it is possible for individuals of the same species to be--some are nice and some not nice at all. We are not so much a melting pot as a salad bowl, with contributions good and bad from innumerable different nationalities that have chosen to make this place their home.

I have one bathroom, cook from scratch, make a modest living, live in a small apt, don't own a motor vehicle, seldom go to the movies,never listen to country-western music, and couldn't care less about baseball. I am very American, and pleased and proud to be so.


Zaq, this sounds like the beginning of an article. You should write one! (I like Fox's post too!)
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Mrs Bissli




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 29 2015, 8:37 pm
A fellow European based poster here. Interesting observations, OP, but I must say what you posted actually highlighted how diverse Europe is.

* Houses: I think many people I know live in 3-4bedroom houses if you have 3-4 kids, 2-bed room if you're young married or up to 1-2 kids. Most houses have 1.5 or 2 baths, 0.5 bath being 'guest cloakroom'. Having said that bedroom sizes are definitely smaller than in US, though probably larger than what I've seen in Israeli flats.

* salary/cost of living: this is one area where there is a BIG difference within Europe. Let's say GBP20k a year is really not enough salary in London, considering housing costs if you have family (so often both parents work). Though not that many people I know earn 6-digit salaries (unless they live in posh areas). Doctors earn less than US counterparts but lawyers, accountants and bankers receive packages comparable to US counterparts.

* DIY is big, but most people hire removal companies and there're many 'men with a van'--lots of builders, plumbers and handiman thanks to expanded EU.

* Coupons do exist but not as widespread as in US. Pretty much everyone has credit cards, but then again debit cards which you use for contactless payment is becoming well accepted.

* in total agreement with longer paid holidays. Even longer in France. People don't hesitate leaving early on summer Fridays, (I'm talking non-Jews as well). But then again, US has more public holidays (I think England has only 6 days or so, even Queen's birthday is not a holiday...).

* also agree with others that small governments/less government intervention carry less appeal here than in US (though UK tends to gripe about EU meddling). Socialised medicine--admittedly both pros and cons--are very highly regarded.

* Less commercialisation/retail culture. Shops are plainly not open or open only limited hours on Sundays. Frequency/duration of sale (bargain) can be regulated. Though French invented hypermarkets, Germans are very much into deep discounters, Swiss are very much into private brands.

* Many non-Jewish schools (especially more academic ones, grammar school) are single gendered at secondary school levels here. Most secondary schools including state schools have uniforms. Children finish school only in July.

* Higher VAT/sales tax in high-teen%, though basic items like foods and childrens clothing or books are exempt.

* there are increasingly ready-to-cook chilled meals. I don't think many people cook every meal from scratch (esp for general population with no kashrut restrictions). Smaller food servings, different eating habits (salads served after main before desserts), totally acceptable to have a glass of wine for weekday lunch/dinner. Depending on the country, dinner can start much later, and meals progress at slower pace (what Americans consider slow/bad service).

* More centralised Jewish organisation (eg United Synagogue in UK), headed by Chief Rabbis. Less prevalent non-orthodox denomination, though this means not all members of orthodox synagogues are shomer mitzvot strictly speaking.

* If you live is most European large cities, multiculturalism and ethnic diversity is a fact of life, especially for former colonising countries. A part of London (or a part of Geneve for that matter) looks like Little Lebanon or Little Riyadh esp in summer because of visitors from former colonies in the Middle East.
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Mrs Bissli




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 29 2015, 8:40 pm
BTW I just realised the actual title of the thread is US versus 'everyone else', not just Europe. I should post US lifestyle vs Asian lifestyle (used to live there for some time) when I have a chance.
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nylon




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jul 30 2015, 12:44 am
Fox, I completely disagree that the US is not class conscious. It is, very much so; we just like to pretend everyone who isn't very rich or very poor is "middle class." Ever hear the terms "White trash" or "trailer park trash"?

The US has a complicated class system in fact, with classes that can run in parallel economically but not culturally.

And, in parts of the Northeast, California--you WILL lose votes saying government should be smaller. At least much smaller, and not focusing on specific issues of corruption/waste. The kind of large scale small government conservatism is less appealing to many big city residents. Even in the South, cities tilt leftward. (their suburbs do not!)

The UK actually has more good quality ready made options in supermarkets (outside the kosher segment, where the US has a much bigger market and hence more choices) than the USA. And a more sophisticated banking system in some ways with faster electronic payments (my DH was shocked when he moved here and found out that sending someone money still involves a paper check and not the Faster Payments Service), and just as much reliance on credit/debit cards for everyday purchases. British DH is also terrible at DIY, and a lot of Americans pride themselves on doing it.
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