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S/o of having less kids...
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amother
Cerulean


 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 4:54 pm
Wouldn't you sooner send to public school with tutors, than to limit your family size simply because of the absurdity of tuition?
What would happen if all the paying parents would pull out and send a bunch of kids to public school with tutoring 2x/week after school?
Isn't anything better than denying a neshama's entry into the world because of a financially dysfunctional system?
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TwinsMommy




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 8:56 pm
we're doing public school AND we're done at one boy and one girl, so we're doing both. Not happy about it, though.
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UQT




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 8:57 pm
Are you advocating quantity over quality?
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wantavaca




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 9:33 pm
Even if I wouldn't have to pay tuition I would still have a problem. I need lots of household help in order to maintain my mental health and be a good mommy.
If I could have someone cooking and someone else cleaning and a nanny for the babies, I'd want to have eight kids.
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nywife




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 9:37 pm
amother wrote:
Isn't anything better than denying a neshama's entry into the world because of a financially dysfunctional system?


This is where it gets really sticky. Who says we're "denying entry" by choosing not to have a child? Who says that child was supposed to be born at this time to this person? Who says that persons hishtadlus wasn't to NOT have the child if they couldn't properly care for it? We can't start making black and white rules because we can't play God.
Bottom line is, we don't have neviim and a way of knowing what exactly is the right thing to do. So we look at ourselves, what we can handle, act accordingly and hope we are doing what Hashem wants from us.
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 10:16 pm
TwinsMommy wrote:
we're doing public school AND we're done at one boy and one girl, so we're doing both. Not happy about it, though.

Hugs to you, TwinsMommy, but I think you have other major factors involved that make this not so relevant to this post... this is talking about when people are weighing the financials of having more children vs being able to afford yeshiva tuition. Special needs is a whole other kettle of fish.
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Laiya




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 10:21 pm
I can make a spin-off of your spin-off:

amother wrote:

[snip]
What would happen if all the paying parents would pull out and send a bunch of kids to public school with tutoring 2x/week after school?


Why can't all frum parents in 1 geographic location coordinate to do this--enroll all children in their local public schools? The already over-crowded public school system, which in NYC spends aprx. $18,000 per year to educate EACH STUDENT, would (at least in some locations) be overwhelmed.

Wouldn't this force the government's hand into compromising on school vouchers or some form of tuition reimbursement?
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happybeingamom




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 10:32 pm
New York State has the Blaine Amendment which prohibits the state giving money to religious education. Vouchers will not happen in New York State unless the States constitution is amended.
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Laiya




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 10:43 pm
And still, there are ways around this, too

(ETA. Cuomo's defeated Parental Choice in Education Act from this past June)


Last edited by Laiya on Sat, Oct 03 2015, 11:48 pm; edited 1 time in total
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amother
Orange


 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 10:45 pm
TwinsMommy wrote:
we're doing public school AND we're done at one boy and one girl, so we're doing both. Not happy about it, though.


what will you answer Hashem (after 120) when you will be asked why you didn't want the other neshamos that were destined to be yours?
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nywife




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 10:52 pm
amother wrote:
what will you answer Hashem (after 120) when you will be asked why you didn't want the other neshamos that were destined to be yours?


With all due respect, that is wrong of you to ask. We are not supposed to have children out guilt and again, who are we to say that's even a question?
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amother
Orange


 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 10:55 pm
guilt?? Who's talking about guilt?? most woman have kids because they love children. If they don't, that's another story.
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youngishbear




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 10:57 pm
amother wrote:
what will you answer Hashem (after 120) when you will be asked why you didn't want the other neshamos that were destined to be yours?


I never learned that this will be a question we will need to answer.

Please don't have children out of fear or guilt.
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Laiya




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 10:58 pm
amother wrote:
what will you answer Hashem (after 120) when you will be asked why you didn't want the other neshamos that were destined to be yours?


Some hold that a man has fulfilled his mitzvah with 1 boy and 1 girl.
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TwinsMommy




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Oct 03 2015, 11:52 pm
I never said anything about special needs in my post. I'm fairly certain now based on what I know about the Jewish schools in our community that my kids if they were Nt might have started in a Jewish school but would eventually be homeschooled or public schooled anyway.

We have a Psak from a Rav who isn't lenient on these matters that we can be done at one boy and one girl. Do I *want* more? Of course. There are lots of things I want that I shouldn't have.
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Kugglegirl




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 04 2015, 12:12 am
I've had kids in & out of public schools with special learning needs that some would not have pulled out of day school for. I do not believe that we "save" any money, necessarily by doing it, since we still were paying around $4000 per child for tutoring Judaics & getting less covered than if we were in day school.

If we believe that H'shem is sending us our parnassa, then we believe that H'shem is sending what we need for the day school. (& believe me, even earning in the 6 figures, we are qualifying for scholarships & take what we can get)

So who is to say that if someone limits their family, then they are going to have the extra income? (though I am not of the camp that says have as many kids as you are physically able to have--- I think kids benefit from having parents who are in good health, mental & physical, who are not overly stressed economically or in other ways.)

So given all this, I have given much serious thought to what is the best use of our community resources & how to give children the best education to be erlich yidden who will have the skills to survive in the world we live in.

In my state there are state sponsored cyber-charter schools. I seriously think our communities need to stop expending community resources on secular studies when a reasonable cyber charter system is available. Children enrolled in the cyber charter schools get the special education resources they need (& there are many day school children who need it), text books, computers, materials and resources.

Our existing day schools can be reconfigured as learning resource centers, with various services and resources available on an ala carte basis. For families who do not have a parent who can supervise cyber learning at home, a cyber-mentor resource room with learning mentor or parent volunteers on a rotating basis could serve as one option.

Parents could also choose to home school the portions of Judaics and kodesh that they feel ready to support at home.

Judaics instruction, davening, social groups, special interest learning groups can all be structured around student needs, parent preferences and the special skills of the children and community members.

There are communities already moving in this direction.
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DrMom




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 04 2015, 1:41 am
amother wrote:
what will you answer Hashem (after 120) when you will be asked why you didn't want the other neshamos that were destined to be yours?

Do you use this argument to force your DH to have sx with you?
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marina




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 04 2015, 2:15 am
amother wrote:
what will you answer Hashem (after 120) when you will be asked why you didn't want the other neshamos that were destined to be yours?


Because You forgot to give me the financial and emotional resources to handle more kids?

That was easy.
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chani8




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 04 2015, 5:51 am
I honestly cannot imagine choosing to have or not have kids based on finances.
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moonstone




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 04 2015, 6:04 am
amother wrote:
what will you answer Hashem (after 120) when you will be asked why you didn't want the other neshamos that were destined to be yours?


What a disgusting comment. How dare you ask such a thing, you self- righteous *****?
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