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Help: Pulling out for individual work - reluctant kid



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amother
Scarlet


 

Post Sun, Dec 13 2015, 9:51 pm
Ideas please. I am not feeling inspired and creative lately and this is becoming a crisis at work. I work with kids who need extra help in school and have a different setup this year. In the past kids were sent to me for specific periods outside the classroom, and they never had to leave anything in middle because it was a set period. The school changed the way they work things this year and now I'm working within the classroom, without such clearly defined times for each kid, but am supposed to find times to pull kids to the side to work with them on the things they are behind in. We're talking about 5-6 year olds (kindergarten) and the main time I am able to pull them aside is during snack or free play/centers. The way the teachers run the classroom is that while some kids are at a working center other kids are free playing.

So I have one kid who's a pretty eager customer naturally, one who is kind of not so into it but motivated to learn better and easy to bribe with stickers and prizes, and one who is refusing to come with me, not interested in learning, and does not respond to rewards. They tell me he responds well to "fun" - I am trying to bring in fun activities but he doesn't even give me enough of a chance to see whether my activities are fun, he just refuses, tunes me out, runs off to play with the free-play kids. Note they have a very long chunk of play time and I would never pull a kid for the whole thing - more like 5-10 minutes here and there. Also, I never pull them during yard type of free play - only within the classroom where this child is playing with the same blocks every time, not like it's that super exciting. I get involved with his games in attempt to build up a relationship and he is ok with that, but as soon as I even turn the discussion towards anything more demanding - not even to pull him aside but trying to work a little intellectual challenge into the play - he shuts down and starts ignoring me.

Please help me figure out how to get through to this kid! He has a lot to work on and the supervisor is starting to pressure me to make more progress with him but I'm not getting anywhere because he is so resistant!
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zigi




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Dec 13 2015, 10:10 pm
would this kid work better with a set time? make an exception for him. take him out side of the classroom to work with you
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amother
Scarlet


 

Post Sun, Dec 13 2015, 10:19 pm
As per the new school policy, I'm not supposed to do that. But I don't think it would work anyway, he would just refuse to leave the room with me the same way he refuses to come aside with me. It's terribly undermining to any authority I've hoped to have but I can't figure out how to win this one when he flat out refuses Sad

Meant to mention I have already tried including his friends in the pull-aside activities. What ended up happening was I was surrounded by a crowd of enthusiastic other kids while mine slipped off and went back to his game, irretrievably, and I just prayed that the principal wouldn't come in just then and find me playing with 5 kids I *wasn't* assigned to embarrassed

I am also stumped on how to integrate learning goals into his play - usually in this type of situation I'll try to do a mix of both. However his preferred play activity doesn't vary - not in an autistic way but in a boy-play way that I've seen all over - each kid puts together a couple of blocks to make a car, which is about to become a spaceship, and their cars/spaceships chase each other around being the good guys trying to smash/laser/etc the bad guys. Somehow this is endlessly entertaining despite looking exactly the same to me every day. Half hour of this, with occasional variation of building a garage for the car/ship. So I've tried to do some language-building and question-answering by talking about the cars/spaceships/garages, but when it's exactly the same every day and totally closed to suggestions (especially inane suggestions coming from old teacher lady) I just feel I've hit a limit on what other language to bring in...
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octopus




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Dec 13 2015, 10:21 pm
You gotta win him over. Bring fun activities or games into the classroom. First ask teacher if it's okay if you make your own center in the corner during center time. Have that kid choose a friend or two to come with him (within the class). In the span of a few days, all the kids are going to be jealous of this kid and this kid will want to come out with you. Also, don't ask a kid, "you want to come out now?" That's very passive. You have to say, "ok, it's time to come out now. I have two activities with me and I want you to choose one." or something to that affect. you might be working harder in the short run, but you will win in the long run.
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octopus




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Dec 13 2015, 10:24 pm
wait I'm unclear from your post- your issue is pulling aside in the class or the kid wanting to come with you when you do a pull-out?
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amother
Scarlet


 

Post Sun, Dec 13 2015, 10:28 pm
octopus wrote:
You gotta win him over. Bring fun activities or games into the classroom. First ask teacher if it's okay if you make your own center in the corner during center time. Have that kid choose a friend or two to come with him (within the class). In the span of a few days, all the kids are going to be jealous of this kid and this kid will want to come out with you. Also, don't ask a kid, "you want to come out now?" That's very passive. You have to say, "ok, it's time to come out now. I have two activities with me and I want you to choose one." or something to that affect. you might be working harder in the short run, but you will win in the long run.

This is pretty much exactly what I have been trying to do and it ain't working. At all. Sad

To clarify: I am supposed to be both working with him within the classroom as well as pulling him for private lessons still within the classroom but off to the side in a separate corner/area/whatever which doesn't actually have to be separate - the point is that I'm supposed to be doing targeted individualized learning activities. I can have a friend join the activity at least some of the time. So far that hasn't helped one bit.
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5*Mom




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Dec 14 2015, 1:38 am
I think there's a more fundamental reason why this kid doesn't want to engage with you when you try to get down to business: he's not interested in what you're selling. Either he doesn't need it (he sounds quite bright and resourceful to me) or he thinks he doesn't need it and it's making him feel bad about himself. What type of intervention are we talking about here? Why does he need this and why does it have to be in front of other kids?
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amother
Scarlet


 

Post Mon, Dec 14 2015, 1:49 am
Right, he's not interested. Seems to be just simply not motivated. He's 5 years old and would rather play.

He needs it a whole lot. The other kids his age are already starting to read and spell and he still doesn't consistently know letter sounds. He also has attention, memory, comprehension, processing problems - the works. Just a little out of it overall.

I don't think he feels bad about being taken aside. It's kindergarten and every other kid is getting some kind of therapist, for the most part they see it as fun hence all the other kids begging to join.

He's just simply not interested. It's hard for him to focus and follow directions for anything. Unstructured playing with blocks is so much easier and more fun for him. It is not OK for him to be doing that when we have work to do (and again I make my work as fun and easy as possible - but yes it is going to be more challenging than his same old good-guy/bad-guy block thing) but I don't know what else I can try to make that clear... I'm not going to punish him because we already lack a reinforcing relationship. I'm just not getting through to him.

Personally I think if I had more time on my hands maybe we could work up a more reinforcing relationship and he'd be more willing to come with me, but he is being verrrry slow to warm up and I don't have that kind of time - it is already the middle of the year and he's falling farther behind by the minute, seemingly.
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5*Mom




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Dec 14 2015, 2:21 am
My advice is not going to help you. 5-yr-olds *should* play. Although his skills are not up to where the other kids' skills are, he sounds completely fine developmentally. Everything you describe is developmentally appropriate. There is a wide range of normal for learning letter sounds, developing focused attention, etc. Yup, he is unmotivated to learn what you want him to learn and that is perfectly normal at his age. In the name of school, he's being pushed - as it sounds like the other children are; you say they all are receiving some form of therapy or another shock - and it probably won't end well for him.

Why can't he be allowed to play this year and just repeat the grade next year when he'll probably be more ready? I mean, without it being a big deal?

I'm sorry, I know you are doing your job and this is not your decision. Good luck to both of you.
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animeme




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Dec 14 2015, 7:44 am
Pushing in is wonderful for many situations and activities. But to get a kid with attention issues to focus on a specific task while all his friends are milling around making noise? Also, for a kid who may only feel competent at this free/center choice time, this is what he's getting pulled out of to work on hard things?

Can you talk to the principal about pulling this specific kid out into a less busy space while his peers are engaged in a structured activity he's behind on? Pull him when he wouldn't be as happy in the classroom anyway, so that you are the more fun choice, and he is more likely to go willingly.
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octopus




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Dec 14 2015, 9:24 am
get a dry erase marker board that is magnetic and magnetic letters. you can work on letters for 2 minutes at a time that way. Or thirty seconds even. Child can play blocks while you do this.
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5*Mom




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Dec 14 2015, 10:02 am
animeme wrote:
Pushing in is wonderful for many situations and activities. But to get a kid with attention issues to focus on a specific task while all his friends are milling around making noise? Also, for a kid who may only feel competent at this free/center choice time, this is what he's getting pulled out of to work on hard things?

Can you talk to the principal about pulling this specific kid out into a less busy space while his peers are engaged in a structured activity he's behind on? Pull him when he wouldn't be as happy in the classroom anyway, so that you are the more fun choice, and he is more likely to go willingly.

This makes good sense.
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Dec 14 2015, 1:32 pm
Let me get this straight. You have a kid who has attention issues, who does not like the subject you're teaching, and the school expects him to do one on one in a class full of playing kids???

What genius thought that up? Banging head

OP, I feel for you. You've been set up to fail with this situation. My DD has a short attention span, does horribly in math, and is completely unmotivated and resistant. Complete pull out and one on one in a quiet classroom is the ONLY way to get through to her, and even then, it's hit or miss. Mostly miss. I have nothing but sympathy for teachers and aids who have to work with kids like mine.
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amother
Scarlet


 

Post Mon, Dec 14 2015, 3:06 pm
Well, for starters thanks for the validation about how hard this task is!

To clarify, he would not be the only one working while everyone is playing. They split the class into groups with some playing while others work and then they switch. But yes this child seems to view playing as an option at all times... it's a personality thing. He's very sociable, playful.

5*mom sorry but you are not the professional working with this child and I haven't given you nearly enough info to say that he's developmentally fine. He is not. He has a lot of issues that need work, mostly in the general cognitive processing areas. Yes 5-year-olds should play but it doesn't need to be all day - they have PLENTY of play time in this class and I am looking for 5 minutes here and there. He will not be more ready next year without significant intervention because of his cognitive issues (for all I know he might already be repeating... I should check on his birthdate again)

B"H today I got him for a little bit. It took some wheedling both ways but I brought one of my best games and he took the bait. It took some doing to get him to not bounce back away before we even got the game off the ground, but then we had a good couple of turns... hope this continues in the right direction.
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turca




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Dec 14 2015, 4:29 pm
I don't do early childhood anymore, but when I used to, I did had a very similar student, we dropped all individual work bec it was not for his best interest. we did keep him in the same grade the year after,that's when all started to work. Then I had another one... I could go on and on.
U had a good session today, u might not have a good one tomorrow, just don't think that everything is lost. I hope the coordinator understands that.
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animeme




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Dec 14 2015, 5:43 pm
Do this boy's parents know about the new model? Are you this boy's primary point of aid? If I were his parents, I would be very upset about how things are set up. If he is not being adequately helped in this model, the model needs to change. Can you set up a meeting with the school/his parents about his plans?
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