I didn't give her the ice cream she wanted

greenfire

Tue, Aug 02 2016, 12:19 am

creditcards wrote:

I definitely would treat her now and then, since I realized she really notices the difference and really wanted it. Until now she was basically ok with my answer when I gave her what I bought for her.
Once I had told her no, I didn't want to give into her just because she had a fit (which I almost did) I don't want her to know that when I say no, she can just throw a fit and get whataver she wants. Had I know before saying no what a fit she would have I wouldn't say no. I don't feel like spending money on something expensive for my kids when they don't appreciate it yet, and they are just as happy with something cheaper. Even if they are almost as happy.
There are other stuff I used to not give her and started giving her just because she became smarter. for ex: I used to only let her have plain yogurt when she was a baby (for myself I got the flavored) she ate the plain very nicely. She would sometimes ask for the flavored one and I would try to hide it from her. But once I saw she knows what she wants I just started buying her only the flavored ones.

btw it more than 50 cents, and it all depends on your budget.

as a parent you have to learn to admit when you make a mistake ... harboring the good tasting foods is just really odd - rude - weird - selfish and will merely enforce the same habits for said child ... not to mention unhealthy connection to eating food whilst in hiding which can lead to anorexic and/or bulimic behaviors

the 50¢ is merely a pecuniary interest

ice cream is something for which one splurges much like therapy

amother

Babyblue

Tue, Aug 02 2016, 12:36 am

greenfire wrote:

harboring the good tasting foods is just really odd - rude - weird - selfish and will merely enforce the same habits for said child ... not to mention unhealthy connection to eating food whilst in hiding which can lead to anorexic and/or bulimic behaviors

Saving a treat for later does not equal "harboring food". I think it's actually very healthy to save a treat and not gorge on it immediately.

If you have an overall unhealthy relationship to food, yes, this will be just another problem. But if overall you don't make food into a power struggle, then it is very educational to allow a food to be "for sharing" or "not for sharing," and "something special that I save as a treat."

Your body language will convey whether this is a selfish behavior or matter-of-fact.

And there is a difference between "hiding food" and not broadcasting that you are eating something when there is not enough of it to go around, so as not to arouse jealousy for no reason.

Unless you propose that if everyone doesn't get it, nobody gets it? (I don't ascribe to that philosophy.)

amother

Puce

Tue, Aug 02 2016, 2:14 am

This reminds me of a memory from my childhood one time my mom bought a honey bun from a gas station and asked me if I wanted to share it with her. I was so excited because we rarely, rarely got sweet treats in my house. Well, later I asked my mom if we could eat it now and she was like "what honey bun? What are you talking about?" (I was old enough to realize she ate it herself). I was so disappointed and I still remember this silly story a million years later because yes, it is cruel to dangle a treat in front of a child's face that rarely gets treats but yet eat it yourself. My child is still young so he doesn't understand when I eat expensive treats, but I still always give him a small taste if he asks. When he's older I won't let him have expensive treats whenever he wants, but once a week on shabbos or a special treat for rosh chodesh. And things I buy are for everybody to eat, never just for myself, that's just cruel. A candy bar snuck in your purse here and there is something else because my kids won't know about it and won't be any wiser so that's okay. But to dangle a treat in front of a child and say nope that's just mommy's is hurtful and your child won't forget.

FranticFrummie

Tue, Aug 02 2016, 5:40 am

I totally understand about not opening the freezer. My DD would stand all day in front of the open freezer door, hanging off the handle. She'd stare deeply into the freezer (or fridge sometimes), waiting for treats to magically appear, if she'd just be patient enough! I swear, she must have thought that there were treat fairies that lived way in the back, and they would only give treats if you watched for them.

(Oddly enough, there often WERE treats hiding in the back, but she never bothers to move the food around to look for them! Apparently, treats only appear at the front of the freezer. LOL

)

She's 13 now, and still does the same thing sometimes. I'll tell her "There's the same stuff in there that was there 5 minutes ago. I haven't been to the store yet! Do you want to help me make a shopping list?"

creditcards

Tue, Aug 02 2016, 11:06 am

What are you trying to say when saying that you always give him a little. I always give my kids a little bid if I eat or drink something I bought for myself in front of them. ex: a fruit shake or special drink...I was talking about something she found in the freezer and did not see me eating. She would never think of asking for it if she wouldn't see the neighbor eating it. I do agree with a lot of posters that hiding things better is a great idea. I hardly eat any food treat or not without giving one spoon for mommy and one for child (thats for baby) and for 5 year old I give her in her own cup or plate a little.
I also didn't like it when my mom would eat something in front of me and not let me have too.
The things that are just for myself are usually eaten late at night when the kids are sleeping.

amother wrote:

creditcards

Tue, Aug 02 2016, 11:13 am

I remember having the same argument when my daughter was a baby and talking like you.
It depends with what child you are dealing with. If your child's automatic reaction when you say something is to try to plead her case with you, and not give up so fast. That means every time you tell her something to do or not or time for ... it takes half an hour. Then the only way to stop this habit is by teaching her that it will never work. Its a waste of her time to even try to change my mind. If I think I made a mistake I make a mental note to myself to be careful for next time not to be so quick in saying no.
It actually is not hard for me to change my mind, its harder for me not to change my mind.

If I would want to admit I made a mistake I would call up the women I was arguing with then, and tell her she was right 4 years ago. People change their parenting style depending on the age and type of child.

The feeling of love to give over to your child, I find is something that you need to daven for too. There are plenty of kids that don't feel there parents love even if their parents give them what they want. Kids need to feel it, and there are lots of ways of making them feel it. Rigidity also has its time and place.

I know what my child understands. If I take her to the store and give her choice of something expensive, she might point to something much cheaper and say she rather wants that. The reason she wanted this particular ice cream was because she has to be like her friend all the time. If her friend would tell her "the ice cream is horrible and she doesn't like it my daughter would say the same. I definitely give her ice cream when I eat ice cream myself. (you cannot understand my child better than I do without ever meeting her and just from hearing one story I told you about her)

Chayalle wrote:

Honestly, I'm not very into the "mommy said no" holds firm under all circumstance type of parenting. While it's true that it's important, in general, to be consistent as a parent, it's also important to teach a child flexibility, humility, and appeasement when one has been wrong. I have no problem telling my child that I realized that my original position was not necessarily correct and that I changed my mind. I don't understand why it's so important to you to teach your child rigidity, and why it has to be so hard for you to change your mind about something that is so important to her.

That doesn't mean that I would just give in to a tantrum, but I don't necessarily always say no and stay that way just because I said no in the first place. It's far more important to me that my child feels my love consistently, than it is for her to hear that NO! loud and clear.

And I can't, for the life of me, fathom having something my child saw that is special, and telling them it's only for me. I don't agree with that whole concept, because my children are so special to me, I would never want them to feel that feeling of something being reserved not for them. Instead, I'd tell the child that the treat they saw is for (Shabbos, Rosh Chodesh, etc...) but not for right now.

I also don't get why you would think that your child does not appreciate the icecream, no matter how expensive it was...it sounds like she has expressed that she gets it alright. Children are often far more knowledgeable, sophisticated, and intelligent than we expect, and as imasinger said so well, as your child gets older you will find many areas where you will have to change your "no"s.

Chayalle

Tue, Aug 02 2016, 1:42 pm

creditcards wrote:

For sure you know your own child better than anyone else. However, my own experience as a child, and what I've heard from my parenting mentors, is that a child that keeps badgering does not stop by being shut down. Or they may stop temporarily, but develop other issues that come out later.

Active listening, validating, empathy, giving the child the feeling that they are loved and special just because...is what fills a child emotionally, and helps them to let go, to feel that there is no need to argue every point to the nth degree. They develop the secure feeling that whatever their needs are, emotionally, physically, etc...will be met.

It does not have to take forever to have a discussion with a child. If the child is taking a long time pleading her case, it's likely that the child does not feel validated and understood. If a child is not feeling their parents love, it usually means that the pipe is blocked. I would be davening for a way to open the channels of love, and I would not be thinking that it will just magically happen without effort on my part.

I respectfully will maintain that consistency has a place in parenting, but rigidity has none.

I agree 100% with your last paragraph. Especially with a child like this, taking them to the store where there are a gadzillion choices is a recipe for disaster. Did you ever hear the song "Never take kids to a store...all your going to hear is Totty we want more!" You give them the store experience, and the only thing they will come away with is the 99,999,999 items they left behind, not the choice that they made. Until you feel 100% confident that they've developed the maturity to be happy with their choice, you are better off making the choice for them and bringing home their treat.

Wishing you much Hatzlacha and Nachas from your child.

Chayalle

Tue, Aug 02 2016, 1:59 pm

One other thing I was thinking of was, you posted alot about the friend and your daughter seeing what her friend has. Welcome to society, where social pressures are what dictate so much in life, especially for girls (or maybe I'm just saying that because I have only girls....)

There are always going to be other kids having other things, and you will need to develop a method for dealing with this. You think this is an issue at age 5? Just wait till she's 10.....

You can't control what other kids have, and what your kid is seeing other kids have. Likely you will need an approach where your child has some of those things, so she doesn't resent you, and not all of those things, or there will be no end to it.....

sweetpotato

Tue, Aug 02 2016, 2:16 pm

amother wrote:

Wow. Some posters here have really bizarro parenting attitudes. Do you really treat your toddlers as adults all the time? It's perfectly normal and healthy for little kids to learn that some things are for kids, some things are for adults. Some things are for mommy/daddy, some things are for the kids. It's not rocket science.

I agree with this. It's critical for a child to learn to cope with disappointment. Sometimes someone else will get a treat and you won't. Kicking and screaming should absolutely not be rewarded by giving in. Just because the neighbors are extremely permissive with treats doesn't mean OP has to change her approach in order to make sure her child isn't deprived. A 5 year old does has the sophistication to understand that she can't always get what she wants, and that some kids get things she doesn't. You shouldn't set up a stumbling block before the child, but I don't think having certain foods that are for adults only, or only for very special occasions, is such a stumbling block. It's not like OP said she was sitting on the front porch eating the ice cream bar right in front of her child and refusing to share, while the child saw the neighbor kids enjoying the same treat as well. All OP's child needed was a "sorry, we're not having those treats right now. End of story."

amother

Ruby

Tue, Aug 02 2016, 8:08 pm

amother wrote:

That is an entirely different situation. It's called gas-lighting, and it is indeed horrible.

mommy24

Wed, Aug 03 2016, 9:33 am

I can totally relate to you OP. It's ok to tell your child, this is special for mommy I can share a bite with you, if u like, but it's special for mommy, like u have your special shabbos ices. Kids have to learn that there are certain things that are only for adults, etc. It's also so important for them to learn that just because their friend has something doesn't mean they can have it to. These are really important lessons you are teaching your daughter, goods for you .

BH, I have 8 kids and every once in a while I also need to get myself a special treat to get me through the day, a chocolate, ice cream, chips, nosh, (I am not particular 😀). I will buy it and hide it, either in my bag, my car, a cabinet, or back of freezer, etc. If the kids find me while I am eating something, I will share little nibbles with them, sorry these things are expensive and add up when u have a family of 10, bH. But, if they just see it in freezer or wherever else I hid it, I explain that this is a special mommy treat, like they have special treats also. And they are fine with that. I have been doing this for years.

I was so amazed when reading the responses that I has to ask my kids how they felt, since they never threw major tantrums about this, and I know I don't hide things too well. I asked my 15, 11, 9, 7, and 5 year olds. I asked how they feel when they see that I buy a special treat for myself or my husband. They all unanimously said they know and it's fine cuz it's not theirs it's mommy's and because there are times when they also get their own special treats every once in a while and that I will share little pieces with them. Again OP, IMO, you are doing fine and teaching your daughter important lessons in life.