Will I fit in, or will I be miserable? (Lakewood)

amother

Blonde

Thu, Aug 25 2016, 9:40 pm

I am OOT, not yeshivish, but not modern. I am in my late 20's with one kid (a 2.5 y.o.). I am totally not into fashion, and I am not at all outgoing, but much more of an introvert. I am used to a simple, economical life, and we don't have a lot of money. I'm the type who doesn't dress fancy, and barely wears my sheitel, preferring snoods/pretieds. I have a really hard time making new friends--almost all of my friends are people who I've known and been friends with since elementary school.

My dh for some reason really thinks that Lakewood is the place for him (he's never lived there and has only been there a few hours a few times either for weddings or to visit/help his younger sibling move there). I am scared that I will not fit in there, and will be friendless, lonely, and miserable. I have no friends there and no family there (the only family either of us has there is just that one younger sibling of dh's who doesn't even like it there), and I feel like I will have no one there for emotional support, or to help out with dc and future children. So far everywhere else we have lived, we have either had most of my family or most of his family around. I am worried about feeling like a total outcast, since dh isn't in yeshiva there, and is working, and we're not the typical young Lakewood family.

Do you think that there is a place for me in Lakewood? Do you think that it's possible that I will fit in and be happy over there? I really don't want to move there Sad

Please no l"h.

amother

Apricot

Thu, Aug 25 2016, 9:57 pm

My dh works in Lakewood. We are also not yeshivish and not modern. We don't live in Lakewood but most of his co-workers do. We have spent Shabbos there many times and attended many simchas. Lakewood is a big place and not everyone fits the stereotype you described. We very seriously considered moving there, cheaper housing, less commuting for dh, and we knew we'd manage socially even if we're a bit out of the box because we knew where to go. The one deciding factor against that was the deal breaker was the school situation. They're not exaggerating about that. It really is that bad and we didn't want to put up with it, and anyway, none of the schools there would meet our standards for secular education. I would recommend anyone thinking of moving thoroughly investigate the school situation and if there are any options that appeal to you, be ready to go in guns blazing to get a spot.

L K

Thu, Aug 25 2016, 11:04 pm

tigerwife wrote:

Lakewood is huge. I am certain you can find a neighborhood that you will feel comfortable in. It sounds crazy but every neighborhood and development varies.

I do not have kids in school yet, but I think this is the bigger challenge you will be facing.

[Op sounds similar to the way I would describe myself, only I'm a bit older, and with some kids in school already.]

Maybe there is such neighborhood, and maybe there isn't.
Besides, if you just move to a random rental not knowing where you're landing - and later figure out its not the right place, you can't just pick up and move and keep moving in hope of finding that good dream place. Moves are costly, rents tend to get higher when you move as opposed to as when you stay in place for a longer time.

Btdt, I moved to Lakewood (no regrets) and ended up in a neighborhood that was not a good fit for us (took me quite a very long time to admit that and realize I wouldn't make friends there, if I hadn't succeeded in say 5 years). I was stuck, as we couldn't find an appropriate neighborhood or shul for many years, And moving to yet another random place was not guaranteed to solve my "misfit" problem, so we just stayed put for 6 years total. It was quite hard.

We ended up moving to Jackson, no immediate Jewish neighbors yet but we're not misfits either. I'm just recuperating from feeling inferior and miserable for years. The one frum neighbor that's closest to us met us with open arms, as were the closest frum yidden to him, and he happens to be warm, and said he's "sooo happy to have good yiddishe neighbors". In our previous neighborhood we were nobody and nothing, not noticed much when we moved in and not missed after we moved out.

people say now lakewood is not a small oot place but is more city-like, and it may be easier to fall through the cracks without anyone noticing. We moved here w/o any family, and it was painful to watch everyone having their families over, sisters and sis-in-laws coming and going, tons of families socializing with their extended ones, and you're just on your own.

If Lakewood is nogea, maybe look in younger simpler crowd areas. You can probably guess by where smaller homes are (they're not small, just not expensive or mansions). Maybe brookwood parkway in Jackson, or one of those "state-name" streets? I don't know what's the crowd there but maybe someone on here could chime in. Maybe Brewers bridge area is gonna be simpler crowd, just for the fact that housing is cheaper than Lakewood.

amother

Lime

Fri, Aug 26 2016, 12:08 am

This was our situation as well--my husband got it in his head that this was the best place ever and I was highly skeptical, given my experience being and OOTer in a very in town camp for a bunch of years. Frankly, the mentality grosses me out. I convinced my husband to give an OOT place a one year trial. THANK GOODNESS, he is liking it very much and sees why I like it so much. I told him that if he is really serious about wanting to try it out and is unhappy where we are, we can start slow before making any commitment. That would mean doing first a shabbos, then a few shabbosim, then visit the schools, then do a month trial, etc. If we found that we really saw this as a possibility, we would commit to try it out for a year. When choosing a mentality/culture that is very different from what you are used to, it is just plain stupidity to think it will all be rosy right away. I have a bunch of OOT friends that found Lakewood to be a very bad match. Yes, there are probably some non-gashmius, laid back, real, thinking, inner-peace, confident people walking around, but the majority of the city follows the reputation they have. If you are fine to weed out what you are looking for and look past the mishigasim, great. If you find the mentality of looks/reputation/money as a first value repulsive to be around all the time--even if it is not you or your close friends, then don't go.

PinkFridge

Fri, Aug 26 2016, 8:50 am

OP, what is your husband missing where you live? Does he have a shul, rav, rebbe, etc. he's close to?
Is this a big distance from where you live? Will you have parnasa, options to buy a home?
It sounds like you would both be happy in a thriving out of town (not necessarily too far from the east coast, but those are good too) community.

ETA: if you were asking a different question, e.g. my husband has a new job and geographically it makes the most sense for us to move to Lakewood, how do we make this work, you might get entirely different answers.

Chayalle

Fri, Aug 26 2016, 10:02 am

Lime amother mentioned something very important. I know someone who rented a house for a summer in Lakewood before moving here. It's not a bad idea to try out a community before actually moving there.

Also will say that I found the first winter in my house rather lonely. No one's out in the winter, and it's not an easy time to meet people. Spring came and it was much better.

LK mentioned the Brookwood area in Jackson. My sister moved to that area and loves it. She says it's a mix and very friendly. However she (and her DH for that matter) is an extroverted, fun-loving personality, so take it from that perspective.

debsey

Fri, Aug 26 2016, 10:56 am

I agree that Lakewood is super heterogeneous - it's just a matter of choosing the right neighborhood. Based on what you posted, you might like the Raintree area (super-diverse, many JPF people), the Spruce Street area (but it's become desirable, hence expensive, recently) or the more egalitarian (not high-income) areas of Jackson. All of those have a mix, and don't have super-high standards of living.

I LOVE the idea of renting to get a sense of what living here would be like.

The key in Lakewood is finding a realtor who you connect with and feel "gets" you. He or she will serve as a "shadchan" between you and the area you are looking in. I didn't think of my neighborhood till a realtor explained why it's perfect for me. Now I'm so happy - and when I lived in a development that wasn't a good fit, I could not have HATED it more. So picking the right area is super critical.

I also am not sure you will have school admissions difficulties. Schools are opening to deal with the influx to Lakewood. You said your DC is 2? In 3 years there will probably 10 new schools.

amother

Blonde

Fri, Aug 26 2016, 11:43 am

PinkFridge wrote:

We were living in a city where we had outgrown our current living space and anything larger wasn't really affordable for us. We really didn't have much of a place in that community either and I was pretty much friendless and miserable there, but I was able to bear it because I knew it was temporary because we'd never be able to afford to buy a house there and would have to leave soon.

amother

Blonde

Fri, Aug 26 2016, 11:44 am

debsey wrote:

What is JPF? Is it just plain frum?

PinkFridge

Fri, Aug 26 2016, 2:18 pm

amother wrote:

And Lakewood makes sense as far as parnasa goes?

amother

cornflower

Fri, Aug 26 2016, 2:40 pm

As a fellow OOT I remember growing up and not understanding or believing that in Boro Park someone can live five houses down from you or even directly across the street from you for five years and you don't know them. Now living in a large Lakewood development I'm in that exact situation myself.

But I'm in a large development with a lot of politics. Most places in Lakewood would probably be better suited for you. Had I known then what I know now I would have looked for a neighborhood that has a shul and Rov that is a neighborhood shul and Rov.

I'll add that I'm probably not innocent in why don't I know all my neighbors. If I was friendlier and more outgoing myself things would be different. When I moved in everyone else only dressed in black.(Not anymore BH) I knowingly didn't go along. etc.

mommyla

Fri, Aug 26 2016, 2:51 pm

amother wrote:

This this this!

Stay out of the developments. I've found that it's the worst place for an OOTer.

debsey

Fri, Aug 26 2016, 4:11 pm

mommyla wrote:

This this this!
Stay out of the developments. I've found that it's the worst place for an OOTer.

Developments are the worst place for anyone who doesn't exactly fit the box for that development. I lived in a development for 10 years and I was miserable. Looking back, I can't imagine how I stayed so long. I think I just didn't realize how much of my misery was related to the mismatch between me and my neighbors. Developments are susceptible to group think and high-school type politics.

amother

Slategray

Fri, Aug 26 2016, 4:39 pm

MrsDash wrote:

I'm modern. I don't fit into any specific box. When living in Lakewood, I never felt weird or out of place(why would I? I had been living there longer than most of the people walking around me.) the thing that got me was the awful driving and constant traffic. It was like living in the city, but no city benefits, including SPACE for all the people and cars. Otherwise, I think pretty much anyone would feel comfortable there.

Interesting. By "modern," do you mean "Modern Orthodox?" All the MO people I know in Lakewood felt compelled to move.

amother

Slateblue

Fri, Aug 26 2016, 6:02 pm

About a realtor who gets you, YES! One DDIL had an old friend who kept showing her 600k houses. This was not at all in her budget but the lady couldn't dream of showing some "small nebby place".

My kids would go drive down a block they were considering & see how the kids & mothers were dressed. They were able to tell right away when an neighborhood was not for them. (Nobody fancy!) And BH they found. But they're living here for several years, so they did kind of knew what they wanted.