How to earn trust | Imamother

amother

Ginger

Tue, Jun 13 2017, 7:49 pm

My DS recently did something that broke my trust in him. Soon after he requested a phone which is something that we had been discussing beforehand. I was shocked that he asked and didn't even seem to show any shame in his dishonest behavior. I told him he needs to earn my trust back, he agreed and wants to make a deal. I'm looking for suggestions as to how he can prove this to me concretely without just an open ended "be honest" type of thing, anyone have any ideas for me please?

MagentaYenta

Tue, Jun 13 2017, 7:54 pm

amother wrote:

Do you have other indicators other than shame that show you he isn't remorseful? How would you prefer him to exhibit his own remorse?

I'm asking these questions because a persons feelings are uniquely theirs. Over the years I've learned that arguing about how another feels isn't very productive. Discussing how they think can be a path to learning.

amother

Ginger

Tue, Jun 13 2017, 11:40 pm

I can tell he's not remorseful because as soon as he got caught lying to me and my husband he immediately started to get angry about not having a phone. I even said to him, you're not upset about what you did or about lying only that you got caught and he agreed. Either way, I'm looking for practical advice as to what he can do to prove that he can be trustworthy

Fox

Tue, Jun 13 2017, 11:52 pm

A lot of people disagree with my approach, but I never found it helpful to link causes, effects, and consequences that aren't naturally linked. To the immature mind, it seems capricious and arbitrary, and they tend to dig their heels in deeper.

So if the offense had to do with a phone -- perhaps he was caught with an unauthorized phone, say -- then it makes sense to link the consequence to the new phone. But if he were caught cheating on an exam, for example, it doesn't really have anything to do with the phone. A better "punishment" would be to make him retake the exam or even the course.

Kids learn by discovering that the derech hateveh is midda keneged midda -- that actions have inevitable consequences. So any punishments have to come as close as possible to any real-life consequences.

Hatzlacha!

MagentaYenta

Wed, Jun 14 2017, 12:01 am

amother wrote:

Anger at being caught is normative for a teen and a lot of adults as well.

Have you considered having a dialog with him? You want him to prove he can be trusted. It's going to be up to you to determine where and when that line is drawn. I can't draw it for you, I don't know the circumstances of his fall from grace. Nor do I know what you want. So solving the problem is identifying the behavior that would fulfill your need and then seeing if it were possible to get the young man to sincerely replicate that behavior.

Many parents use incremental lifting of restrictions as a means to showing sincere intent by their children. Are you comfortable with using that technique?

MagentaYenta

Wed, Jun 14 2017, 1:11 am

amother wrote:

Magenta, can you please explain the idea you bring up in the last part of your post, I don't quite understand what you mean

You mean this:Many parents use incremental lifting of restrictions as a means to showing sincere intent by their children. Are you comfortable with using that technique?

Well I'll give it a try, even though I don't know what kind of consequences you used with your child under the circumstances.

Let's say I caught one of my spawn hanging out at a place that was unacceptable to me. My child already knew I didn't think it was an ok place to be. I'd restrict their free ranging for a period of time based on the offense and then expand their free ranging as they showed a higher level of responsibility and respect. This would all be discussed at the time I handed down the consequences. (BTW, I would not hand down consequences without some time and thought. They would not be done in the moment. And I would thoroughly discuss them with the child, that means a back and forth dialog. And if the father was in the equation, he too would be a part of this process..)

Shame would never be a consequence nor would I use it as a vehicle for teaching a child appropriate behavior of any kind. Shame seemed very important to you in your first post. Tell me why you think it would work or why you want him to be ashamed?

amother

Ginger

Wed, Jun 14 2017, 10:58 am

It's 2 separate things and I don't know if shame is the right word but I was surprised that he got caught doing something he wasn't supposed to do and then lied about it and got caught about that too and didn't even seem to show any natural reaction of even pretending to be embarrassed that he just got caught. Then there's the issue of the consequence, I don't want the shame to be the consequence I just feel like if somebody did something wrong they would at least realize that it's not acceptable to right away ask for something. but I'm still trying to figure out what the consequence should be and I'm more upset about the lying than the action so what is a good consequence for lying how can I gauge someone's trustworthiness?

MagentaYenta

Wed, Jun 14 2017, 1:26 pm

amother wrote:

I have no idea what a good consequence for lying would be for your son. I've no idea about your parenting style or discipline style or your lifestyle. I have explained on how I would generally handle the situation with my own children if there was a breach of trust. But now you are shifting gears. You want strategies to deal with lying and not breach of trust, you need to make up your mind. I do know that you have an expectation of behavior that is unrealistic. It is human nature for a teen (and most people) to deny they did something wrong. Without more info from you there is little I can add to the conv. Move on to acceptance. Listen to Mick Jagger, 'you can't always get what you want'.

Perhaps this is a convo you should be having with your husband.

imasinger

Wed, Jun 14 2017, 2:40 pm

You should read my favorite book about parenting teens -- "Get Out of My Life, But First Could You Drive Me and Cheryl to the Mall."

It discusses teen lying at some length.

IME, many teens are not mature enough to either actually feel, or offer the pretense of, remorse. That's because they are very good at rationalization, and can think that if they find the rule meaningless, that it is OK to break it and lie about it.

You would probably do better to insist on proof of compliance with the rules, and to have a good conversation about why the rules exist. Let him state his perspective first, then explain why it is not how you see things. Impress on him that this is not a choice he gets to make. Help him understand the expression, "biting the hand that feeds you."

After that, I agree with Fox about letting the punishment fit the crime. We can't help you with details unless you share details about what happened.