Every therapist says to use rewards

amother

Blonde

Wed, Jun 21 2017, 8:29 pm

So I have taken multiple parenting courses/speeches etc. ..and they all seem to say that you should use natural consenquence as a reward and punishment and definitely not to use charts/bribery etc. . Bec it doesn't teach them anything, they need more and more, they won't do anything just because and eventually it stops working. Especially Dina Friedman. I did her course last year.

Now on the flip side I have spoken to a few therapists (my own, my marriage counselor, and someone who was guiding me with him) and they all jumped right away to rewards. The thing is it does seem to actually work for him.

So my question is why this disparity between the two groups?

My child is obviously not your typical child but according to Dina Friedman she officially gears her course to challenged children too.

amother

Bisque

Wed, Jun 21 2017, 8:40 pm

Parenting courses are for general audiences. One size fit approaches. Our challenging children don't go by these rules. Each child needs her own set of rules, and the general rule for super challenging children is to do what works for the child. Especially if it recommended by a therapist who knows the child, I would trust the therapist over a general parenting course like you mentioned.

amother

Lavender

Wed, Jun 21 2017, 8:53 pm

Great question op . I have a whole theory about this.

Rebbes have been putting honey on aleph bais for a long long time. And I think it is no coincidence that at the same time that there is an abundance of children who need rewards to be motivated, (and simultaneously forms of punishment that have been used for generations are no longer "acceptable"), there is an absolute abundance of cheap Chinese plastic rewards on the market that can be highly motivating for children.

I think that having a child work towards a prize, and then experience the JOY OF SUCCESS along with the joy of the prize is the key. And you have to help the child notice how good they feel to have done the right thing.

Having said all that: The truth is that in a sense- Nothing Works. How your kid turns out is how they were going to turn out. The question is HOW DO YOU AS A parent grow from parenting this way? That's what to focus on.

Any currently recognized system is ok to use, so long as you realize that it is just hishtadlus, and the real key is to daven very very hard that all should be well.

amother

Ivory

Wed, Jun 21 2017, 9:04 pm

no no no. I disagree with rewards! I dont care what dina friedman says. shes not g-d. I care on what has worked for many years and what we are doing to our kids by giving them so many rewards is disabling them!

why? becasue when I asked ds to go something you know what his answer was? "what prize will I get for it?" and it was for something super ordinary. thats what we are creating! the mechanchim from just 20yrs ago are saying that we have yet to see the damage this will do. its creating entitled kids that will do nothing till they get rewarded

when they get into the real world what will happen if they dont get rewarded? willl they just not go to work? will they tell their wife they deserve a reward? what are we creating for our kids? I think we are taking the wrong approach. children should get rewarded but this is way too much!

and also when I was growing up we only got rewarded when we actually worked hard. now every parent knows their child if their child worked hard and didnt get rewarded or acknowledged that is the parents job to show them and tell them with words and a reward how important their hard work is.

but not just because you did something ordinary. ordinary things have to get done. wether we like it or not. we have to get up and get dressed do things in our lives that we must. that doenst need a reward.

I also think that if your child needs more rewards then by all means give it to him. but the general population of kids should get natural rewards. occassionally they should get rewarded when they worked very hard.

amother

Ivory

Wed, Jun 21 2017, 9:17 pm

oops I just realized that. thanks for letting me know. I also just realized its adhd kids.

that just changed my whole perspective. adhd kids need a lot of motivation for things they simply dont have motivation for. they are highly motivated by rewards.

that being said I would give them more rewards then usual. but also tread carefuly. because like I wrote in my other post they also get used to it too much and also begin to get entitled.

so I would put it on things that are very difficult for them and you really need them to improve in.

I still wouldnt reward for getting dressed and the regular stuff.

op what does your therapist want you to reward for? what types of behaviours? please explain. I hope she didnt want you to reward for every little thing.

seeker

Wed, Jun 21 2017, 9:26 pm

Science has empirically proven that the brain's reward mechanisms are wired differently in people with ADHD and certain other learning and behavior challenges, which could explain why some people seem to need more external/"unnatural" reinforcement than others. Of course, as you mention in OP, you need to use a delicate touch to make sure it doesn't backfire if you use it more than necessary. But what I've seen in many kids with difficulties is that once they had the external motivators getting them to do the right thing in the first place, that enabled them to build more natural associations and habits that help them move on without the reward.

I don't know specifics about the courses that you took, but I'm just thinking that if a course advertises that it "also addresses challenging children" - first of all, that doesn't necessarily mean it's true. Secondly there's "challenging" and then there's CHALLENGING.

Different kids need different things and if you've found something that works for your challenging child then that is most definitely better than trying 5 other things that will frustrate both of you. If it results in him getting spoiled or whatever, you can cross that bridge when you get to it.

amother

Ivory

Wed, Jun 21 2017, 9:33 pm

[quote="seeker"]Science has empirically proven that the brain's reward mechanisms are wired differently in people with ADHD and certain other learning and behavior challenges, which could explain why some people seem to need more external/"unnatural" reinforcement than others.

can you tell me where you read this? I would love to see it. as I have a child with adhd and this would help me tremendously.

you say science has proven this. please give us the sources.

seeker

Wed, Jun 21 2017, 9:45 pm

OK I need to get off the computer ASAP so I just grabbed some links without inspecting them, so no refunds or guarantees:

https://www.bnl.gov/newsroom/n.....10998
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/p.....6918/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/p.....6289/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28228718

Please note that the differences in reward processing are not necessarily a cause of ADHD or other issues, they may just be among the symptoms. I haven't heard of any clear evidence either way, but it does seem strongly correlated and experience bears it out as well.

e1234

Thu, Jun 22 2017, 1:58 am

ADHD kids are different
you cannot follow the same ways as regular.

My husband is an ADHD coach - I am really trying to get him to do a parenting workshop as I think it is so needed.

The brain is different and if you know how to talk to it and operate it then you can get the child to achieve their potential (and life can be so much easier!)