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Son misses bus every single day without fail.
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jewish613




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 9:09 am
amother wrote:
Every conversation so far, once it goes to his issues, runs into an argument, if I let it. That's the reason I dropped it now.
I'd love to get parental guidance specifically for ADD.
Any suggestions?


(Disclaimer: I have no experience--just sharing some thoughts)

Hmmm...what does the breakdown in conversation usually look like? Would he be open to giving suggestions that he thinks could work if you didn't judge them or give your own suggestions? Would taking him out somewhere fun help set the mood for the conversation? (Probably let him know in advance that you plan to talk during the outing.) Maybe the public setting will help you both keep your cool.

Would leaving out your frustration and keeping the focus on how much you love him and want him to be happy with himself help the conversation at all? Not making it a power struggle where he feels you're trying to get him to do what you want and stifling his independence? Sincerely being a sounding board to help him come up with a solution on his own?

It sounds like you're really trying to do what's best for your son, as difficult as it is. Kudos to you!!!

ETA: have you spoken to his therapist about this? It seems like a significant issue in his life, and the therapist who knows him will probably be able to guide you best.


Last edited by jewish613 on Tue, Jul 18 2017, 9:15 am; edited 1 time in total
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 9:12 am
First, you have to have his entire bed time routine made to start earlier than it does. YOu say he has no problem falling asleep but he is obviously going to sleep too late if he is having trouble in the morning.
Second, there are these clocks (I could not find a picture) where each hour is marked in by a different color so that the person will know what task has to be done during that time. Would that be something?
third, what if he has an alarm, after he is already awake, that will beep maybe ten minutes before he has to leave the house so he knows he has to hurry up?
And lastly, you mentioned about add meds. I was wrongly diagnosed when I was a child and ended up taking meds for add for a while. Let me tell you, you think the meds are out of your son's system by bed time. it is very likely that they are not fully out of his system. I know what those meds did to me (nothing good). So the meds might need to be tweeked a bit.
Please, be an advocate for your son. Help him. He needs that help. He has issues and so think of him in that way, that he may need extra help and look at him that way and make things work with that in mind.
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leaf




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 9:14 am
I have a feeling he's probably in good company. Or at least in my school he would be. Plenty of kids getting in late. Some teachers too...
I was trying to come up with ideas for my school to try to solve this problem and thought that the best soln was to make really good incentives for the kids to get there early. I.e. create a basketball team - kids who want to be part of the team need to get in 1/2 hr before school starts, daven then, and have basketball practice while rest of class has davening. Can do the same idea with a drama club or anything else.
Similiarlly - start a small petting area in the school. kid gets responsibility for feeding rabbits every morning on condition that he shows up 15 min. early otherwise rabbits will be hungry and need to give the job to another kid.
Perhaps you can tailor something along these lines for him.
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imasinger




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 9:24 am
You can start a separate thread asking for psychiatrist referrals in your area.

A couple of pointers, based on my own morning/kid struggles.

1. Both stimulants and melatonin don't act exactly as the packaged instructions say, with every child. If he is taking an 8 hour dose of stimulant, you're probably right it's out of his system by bedtime. But melatonin can be tricky. How much do you give him? What time? I have learned the hard way how much it can affect morning wake up.

2. What can you do to stack the deck in your favor? Can he shower at night, lay out his clothes, prepare his school things?

3. The teenage years are coming, and it will be golden to work out some of these issues now. Some areas we as parents need to be super strong -- knowing when and how to say a firm "no", and other areas, we need to be super kind, knowing how to see ourselves as our kids' coach and cheerleader, not critic.

So, yes, walk him out the door. And praise him effusively for getting out on time. Look at all those "corners" where things can slide, and work on them one at a time.

Be firm about keeping conversations from getting twisted into the blame game, and be flexible about as much else as possible.

I am talking to myself here as much as anything. When I have figured the proper solution to horribly challenging mornings, I'll let you know.
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amother
Taupe


 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 9:43 am
amother wrote:
His meds are out by 3 pm, he sais. We aren't sure yet what to do about the rest of the day.
Can you reccomend Dr specializing in twerking add meds? Ty

My social worker's son drinks mountain dew when he gets home as his meds have worn off. It has lots of caffeine and helps so he doesn't drop.
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amother
Mustard


 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 9:58 am
jewish613 wrote:
(Disclaimer: I have no experience--just sharing some thoughts)

Hmmm...what does the breakdown in conversation usually look like? Would he be open to giving suggestions that he thinks could work if you didn't judge them or give your own suggestions? Would taking him out somewhere fun help set the mood for the conversation? (Probably let him know in advance that you plan to talk during the outing.) Maybe the public setting will help you both keep your cool.

Would leaving out your frustration and keeping the focus on how much you love him and want him to be happy with himself help the conversation at all? Not making it a power struggle where he feels you're trying to get him to do what you want and stifling his independence? Sincerely being a sounding board to help him come up with a solution on his own?

It sounds like you're really trying to do what's best for your son, as difficult as it is. Kudos to you!!!

ETA: have you spoken to his therapist about this? It seems like a significant issue in his life, and the therapist who knows him will probably be able to guide you best.


It's good that I get all these questions because it orients me.
So.
Our conversations are about anything and everything. Fun and humorous. He is very bright, has insight and depth about a million subjects and a pleasure to have conversation with.
Last night he wanted to know why he was created with this nature. He read the book Awareness and found himself to be a type 4. I told him It's ok. We can change that to type 8. We were both rolling. At this point, he's aware that natures aren't changeable, they are only workable.
He's extremely self aware which only adds to his issues of having to make sure everything is perfect before leaving the house etc.

His issues conversations are usually stated by him. He comes to me, asks me, what do you think I should do about getting up late? It's getting to me. I'm embarrased every day. I don't want to grow up a laxt adult who'll come late to kollel and Job. I'm afraid I'll be a failure.
From experience, I lve realized that just saying my opinion is like saying I'd love to fly to space. So I respond some thing like;
What do you think? What needs to be done? We have spoken about this numerous times. Is there anything we need to reevaluate? I think You are going to be very successfull. I think if you do the things on the list, you can be out of the house in less than 20 minutes. What do you think?
And here the argument begins. He has better ideas. I can't. Or, you dont understand me. He gets all emotional and responds very heated. Also, he has a very powerful way of presenting his opinion. Like, if I walk him to his room he can say; I feel like I'm in house arrest!!
And now, for the past 2 weeks, I officially told him I'm taking a break from these arguments.
And meanwhile, I'm searching for guidance, advice, maybe a change in therapist and Dr.
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amother
Mustard


 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 10:02 am
shabbatiscoming wrote:
First, you have to have his entire bed time routine made to start earlier than it does. YOu say he has no problem falling asleep but he is obviously going to sleep too late if he is having trouble in the morning.
Second, there are these clocks (I could not find a picture) where each hour is marked in by a different color so that the person will know what task has to be done during that time. Would that be something?
third, what if he has an alarm, after he is already awake, that will beep maybe ten minutes before he has to leave the house so he knows he has to hurry up?
And lastly, you mentioned about add meds. I was wrongly diagnosed when I was a child and ended up taking meds for add for a while. Let me tell you, you think the meds are out of your son's system by bed time. it is very likely that they are not fully out of his system. I know what those meds did to me (nothing good). So the meds might need to be tweeked a bit.
Please, be an advocate for your son. Help him. He needs that help. He has issues and so think of him in that way, that he may need extra help and look at him that way and make things work with that in mind.


I'm trying to be an advocate for him. Im really trying to learn the difference between advocacy and parental responsibilty.
Thanks for the idea of the clocks, never heard of it.
We tried making his bedtime earlier. So far, no success. I'll discuss with Dr about meds. I just got a referral from someone new. Thanks for making me aware of that.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 10:04 am
amother wrote:
I'm trying to be an advocate for him. Im really trying to learn the difference between advocacy and parental responsibilty.
Thanks for the idea of the clocks, never heard of it.
We tried making his bedtime earlier. So far, no success. I'll discuss with Dr about meds. I just got a referral from someone new. Thanks for making me aware of that.
When you say no success for an earlier bed time, what does that mean? He literally doesnt go into bed?
Does he like reading? Can you think of something that wil help him unwind? Does he like puzzles?
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amother
Mustard


 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 10:04 am
leaf wrote:
I have a feeling he's probably in good company. Or at least in my school he would be. Plenty of kids getting in late. Some teachers too...
I was trying to come up with ideas for my school to try to solve this problem and thought that the best soln was to make really good incentives for the kids to get there early. I.e. create a basketball team - kids who want to be part of the team need to get in 1/2 hr before school starts, daven then, and have basketball practice while rest of class has davening. Can do the same idea with a drama club or anything else.
Similiarlly - start a small petting area in the school. kid gets responsibility for feeding rabbits every morning on condition that he shows up 15 min. early otherwise rabbits will be hungry and need to give the job to another kid.
Perhaps you can tailor something along these lines for him.


Truth is. This child needs to live in a farm. Or at least be in gym every day. Or have a good ball game. You don't even know how on target you are about this.
I don't know how to explain this, but these ideals are nowhere in sight at the time being. Crying
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amother
Mustard


 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 10:09 am
shabbatiscoming wrote:
When you say no success for an earlier bed time, what does that mean? He literally doesnt go into bed?
Does he like reading? Can you think of something that wil help him unwind? Does he like puzzles?


Anything that is intresting, will only keep him from walking into his bed. Yes. He literally doesn't go into bed. Just reminded this, then this then oh! I wanted to take those cookies also for recess! And I wanted to read some thing still!
You know? It's hard to explain it. I don't even think I'm not firm enough. I think I'm depleted at this point from this already.
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Iymnok




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 10:11 am
Can you make a chart or prize system for getting out of the door 10 minutes before the bus?
Work to a big prize with small ones to keep him going.
Big prizes could be a trip to an amusement park, museum, ball game or concert. A nice bike, game, new suit, the "in" shoes, a watch.

Also some incentive for going to bed before xMadx time. (A reminder 1/2hr before may help)

Discuss with him and come up with a list of incentives and clarify the details. Write up the "rules" if that makes it easier for him. Let that list force him.

Some kids do well with those ticking egg timers.
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amother
Mustard


 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 10:11 am
imasinger wrote:
You can start a separate thread asking for psychiatrist referrals in your area.

A couple of pointers, based on my own morning/kid struggles.

1. Both stimulants and melatonin don't act exactly as the packaged instructions say, with every child. If he is taking an 8 hour dose of stimulant, you're probably right it's out of his system by bedtime. But melatonin can be tricky. How much do you give him? What time? I have learned the hard way how much it can affect morning wake up.

2. What can you do to stack the deck in your favor? Can he shower at night, lay out his clothes, prepare his school things?

3. The teenage years are coming, and it will be golden to work out some of these issues now. Some areas we as parents need to be super strong -- knowing when and how to say a firm "no", and other areas, we need to be super kind, knowing how to see ourselves as our kids' coach and cheerleader, not critic.

So, yes, walk him out the door. And praise him effusively for getting out on time. Look at all those "corners" where things can slide, and work on them one at a time.

Be firm about keeping conversations from getting twisted into the blame game, and be flexible about as much else as possible.

I am talking to myself here as much as anything. When I have figured the proper solution to horribly challenging mornings, I'll let you know.


Thanks imasinger. Good points. I appreciate and will look into it.
So far I got the encouragement to search for a therapist geared to ADD.
Thanks everone gotta go!!
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amother
Mustard


 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 10:14 am
Iymnok wrote:
Can you make a chart or prize system for getting out of the door 10 minutes before the bus?
Work to a big prize with small ones to keep him going.
Big prizes could be a trip to an amusement park, museum, ball game or concert. A nice bike, game, new suit, the "in" shoes, a watch.

Also some incentive for going to bed before xMadx time. (A reminder 1/2hr before may help)

Discuss with him and come up with a list of incentives and clarify the details. Write up the "rules" if that makes it easier for him. Let that list force him.

Some kids do well with those ticking egg timers.


I'll try the reward for few minutes before idea. Thanks!
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 10:19 am
amother wrote:
Anything that is intresting, will only keep him from walking into his bed. Yes. He literally doesn't go into bed. Just reminded this, then this then oh! I wanted to take those cookies also for recess! And I wanted to read some thing still!
You know? It's hard to explain it. I don't even think I'm not firm enough. I think I'm depleted at this point from this already.
My point about things that interest him, what if you tell him that if and only if he is finished with xyz by this and this time can he read in bed. And only in bed. And then after half an hour you go to him and tell him to turn the light off.
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amother
Taupe


 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 11:00 am
What does the pediatrician say about melatonin. My child like this can't settle down without it and our pediatrician said sleep is super important and melatonin or benadryl should be used in such cases.
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jul 18 2017, 11:21 am
Regarding the chart and money system. Try turning it around.

I love watching shows like "Nanny 911" and "Jo Frost". She tells the child that he will have X amount of money at the end of the day, if conditions are met. Conditions are laid out on a chart, and each one has a monetary value. For each expectation not met, that amount of money is DEDUCTED.

The difference is, a kid might not be motivated to earn money, but if they know they have it coming, and then see it TAKEN AWAY it has a different psychological effect.

Expect push back and arguing. Decide how much arguing you are willing to put up with, and exactly when you will make it into a deduction of money. The line has to be very clear, or the child will be confused. Give a warning first. "If you continue to argue, there will be a deduction. I expect you to be dressed and at the breakfast table by 7:00."

Enforce a strict bed time, but don't insist he sleep. Tell him to rest his body. He can read quiety, but confiscate all electronic screens from his room.

Follow through no matter what. I'm willing to bet that within a week or two you will have a whole new kid.

(Also, the money he gets is HIS money. You don't get any say in what he spends it on.)
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