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Forum -> Children's Health
7 yo DD, been to the drs- all say nothing
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amother
Coffee


 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 10:44 am
Long story short...
Been going on off and on for close to 3 years with my 7 yo DD. Been to allergist, natropath, gynecologist, urologist and her regular ped, plus an OT.
She is very sensitive, with feelings and body (possible SPD), "can" have a very quick and bad temper (but usually recently not very often, unless related to some other happenings), otherwise a happpy helpful cheerful girl. She can go up to down very fast and the opposite too.
Here is the realy problem, her privates (front and back) almost constantly bother her. All drs say there is no problem. Ultimately psychosomatic. She has a type A personality and one dr said girls she has seen with that personality very often have symptoms in the privates, belly and head. My dd also has stomach aches (though not so often lately) and headaches- probably at least once a week.
She doesn't go to sleep well- complains she hates to sleep but also that she is soooo tired. She wakes up way early and rarely falls back asleep. But drs say she gets enough sleep...She does say in the morning she is tired and late afternoon she is tired. Perhaps that is when her tantrums come to fore.
She has a hard time sitting and eating. She takes a few bites, says she is done- or gets distracted and forgets she is eating. A half hour later "I'm starving". I don't serve meals with no ending... = tantrum...
This is just a small (maybe not so small!) idea of her.
I know I need to bring her to another OT to see about SPD.
I just recently tried a weighted blanket- but she kicks around too much while she is sleeping, not sure it'll be too helpful...
I'm working on myself to be a more patient understanding mother- but it is very draining to be the one always to feel her feelings and help her calm down. (I do have other kids to tend to as well, some who are copying her behaviors lately). Plus, I don't always take care of myself 100% so that I have the energy to deal with her.

So, what are your thoughts? I don't need a diagnosis or anything, but some ideas of what to look for or look in to would be nice. Also, ideas of how to deal and react with her are also very welcome!

My story... not so short!
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amother
Cyan


 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 10:51 am
An OT who specializes in regulation can help, but you need someone highly qualified. She sounds like she has difficulty regulating both emotionally and physically (sleep, eating).

Alternatively, a psychologist can help with the emotional regulation, which may lead to improvements in internal physical regulation as well.
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yogabird




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 11:00 am
You can look into pandas or pans, she has some signs.
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yOungM0mmy




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 11:26 am
Joint hypermobility? Or something sensory? It sounds like she feels all the normal body sensations and functions more acutely than average. Does distraction work when she complains of discomfort? Sometimes dwelling on it makes it feel worse, but if she can get engrossed in a book or watching something it will take her focus off the sensations.
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amother
Tan


 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 11:42 am
Omg. I feel like you're describing my 6 yr old DD to the T. Though I didn't go to any drs, since I didn't think there is something a dr can do. The only thing I did think of is checking for PANDAS as someone mentioned.

I do understand you, it's frustrating. I'll be following for possible solutions.
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gp2.0




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 12:56 pm
I would approach these issues from several different directions. First of all, good job taking her to pros to check it out, and OT may be helpful if she's extra-sensory. Meanwhile, my two cents.

1) it's very common for young children to have soreness in their privates. It comes from not wiping well or excessive sweating or heat rash or a combination of all three. She should wear cotton underwear and nothing else around her privates so they can breathe. Teach her how to apply a dab of Vaseline to her privates using a q-tip or cotton ball. Vaseline helps chafed areas heal. Even if it really is 100% psychosomatic (which I doubt) Vaseline is harmless and will work as a placebo.

2) if she says she's tired, she's tired. How many hours of sleep is she getting every night? Start moving her bedtime earlier a little bit at a time. She may be the kid on the far side of the sleep graph who needs 12 hours of sleep every night. So the doctors will say she's getting enough sleep if she gets 9-10 hours, because a large percentage of kids function well on that amount of sleep. Clearly she doesn't. (Headaches can be due to lack of sleep as well.)

3) is something keeping her from sleeping well at night? I assume you checked for sleep apnea. Does she have nightmares? If she does, you should talk about anxiety and nightmares and teach her some coping mechanisms for dealing with them. I have a great workbook to recommend, if you're interested I will look it up. (Stomachaches and headaches in children can be a symptom of anxiety.)

4) Eating is a little complicated. You want her to have a healthy relationship with food. The easiest way to do that is to work with her normal eating patterns. a) You can give her smaller portions more often instead of one large portion at mealtimes. b) if you want dinner to have a firm start and end time, you can leave easily accessible healthy snacks for her to help herself whenever she's hungry, like cut up fruits and vegetables. c) you can leave her dinner on the table and she can keep noshing from it for hours. d) pick a fun toy she likes and save it for mealtimes. Maybe an activity book or sticker book or iPad. This is probably the least advisable idea...but I guess it depends how desperate you are to keep her seated at mealtime.

5) keep your eyes open for other issues that may materialize that will clarify exactly what you're dealing with. Does she have any food sensitivities? How is she doing at school? How's her attention span and distraction in general, when she's doing an activity other than eating that requires staying seated for a period of time?

ETA: distractibilty and short attention span are also signs of sleep deprivation.
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ra_mom




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 1:09 pm
Somehow there's a type of child that exhibits these symptoms. The symptoms come as a package and the medical establishment doesn't know how to help. There's nothing concrete they can find but the children are super uncomfortable. It's very painful to watch. At a certain point you just say this is who our child is and we will just accept it while trying our best to help them. I've been there and I am there. Years of specialists and various approaches. And I've met many parents of such sweet children.

But before you reach that point you need to get her OT help. And get her to a great gastroenterologist right away. She may very well have silent reflux which is holding her back from eating enough in one sitting and sleeping through the night. Another possible symptoms can be stomach aches. And bothersome throat sending you for strep cultures.

Floristor kids helped my daughter with the vaginal issues. It's a probiotic that's proyeast as opposed to probacteria. Speak to your ped about the possibly of melatonin too for helping her get to bed at a good time. Our ped says sleep is essential for growth and health and melatonin is an option.

Work with her way of eating. Small amounts often. (I'm so familiar with my stomach hurts I can't eat more than 2 bites! And then I'm starving and need food now, can't wait the 2 more minutes until we get home! just 45 minutes later.)

Try to get her play therapy for emotional regulation. You really need your own therapy to handle all of her frustration so you can respond properly. Once you learn new tools and how to handle so much stress it will flow down to her in learning how to deal with her stresses as she matures.

I also agree with all the tips from gp2.0.

Hug


Last edited by ra_mom on Fri, Jul 21 2017, 3:03 pm; edited 1 time in total
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amother
Coffee


 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 1:43 pm
Thank you all for the replies!

In no particular order...

She has never had strep, got her tested numerous times RE: pandas.

She gets put to bed about 7-7:30 and wakes up once or twice (usually once) a night to use the bathroom and kvetch about her privates, then wakes for the morning usually about 5:30-6:00 usually earlier than later.

I'd given her probiotics, didn't notice any difference. I do need to buy more though...

I did forget that she went through a time with pinworms for months. I think B"H they are gone.

She definitely has anxiety up the kazoo! About everything, unfortunately...

Eating is a problem because all my kids are similar ages and what goes for one will be for all. But I guess I can just adjust my thinking and feelings on it. Even if I did grow up differently...

She hates me putting cream on her privates. Hates the feeling. We've done meds from the gyno, but didn't seem to really work and she kvetched about me putting it on. She doesn't like me touching her there AT ALL! I can have her put vaseline on herself though, thanks.

She sometimes has nightmares, but not very often at all. My others have more often.

gp.20 I would like info on the workbook, thanks!

She is very distractable generally, as well. She usually only stays put if she's watching a video (though she scared of everything, so she usually gets up to run away) and when she is doing fun school work or projects.

Young mommy- she is defintely distractable from her discomfort, but often just short term. When the distraction goes away, the discomfort comes right back.

And another point- every single boo boo she gets has the almost the same reaction of crying. I try explaining to her there are levels of pain and I can't know when she is really hurt etc... To no avail...

Thank you!
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gp2.0




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 2:01 pm
amother wrote:
Thank you all for the replies!

In no particular order...

She has never had strep, got her tested numerous times RE: pandas.

She gets put to bed about 7-7:30 and wakes up once or twice (usually once) a night to use the bathroom and kvetch about her privates, then wakes for the morning usually about 5:30-6:00 usually earlier than later.

I'd given her probiotics, didn't notice any difference. I do need to buy more though...

I did forget that she went through a time with pinworms for months. I think B"H they are gone.

She definitely has anxiety up the kazoo! About everything, unfortunately...

Eating is a problem because all my kids are similar ages and what goes for one will be for all. But I guess I can just adjust my thinking and feelings on it. Even if I did grow up differently...

She hates me putting cream on her privates. Hates the feeling. We've done meds from the gyno, but didn't seem to really work and she kvetched about me putting it on. She doesn't like me touching her there AT ALL! I can have her put vaseline on herself though, thanks.

She sometimes has nightmares, but not very often at all. My others have more often.

gp.20 I would like info on the workbook, thanks!

She is very distractable generally, as well. She usually only stays put if she's watching a video (though she scared of everything, so she usually gets up to run away) and when she is doing fun school work or projects.

Young mommy- she is defintely distractable from her discomfort, but often just short term. When the distraction goes away, the discomfort comes right back.

And another point- every single boo boo she gets has the almost the same reaction of crying. I try explaining to her there are levels of pain and I can't know when she is really hurt etc... To no avail...

Thank you!


Was she ever tested for sleep apnea? Also, is her room cool enough at night? Many people can't sleep in a warm room. Does she wake up on her own or is a different child waking her up early? She's already going to bed pretty early so if shes waking up on her own then the sleep length isn't the issue. But if she's waking up in middle of the night every single night it's probably disrupting her sleep patterns. The question is what's waking her up...

This is the anxiety workbook. It was really helpful for us and there are more workbooks in the series as well, dealing with nightmares, tantrums, negative thinking patterns etc.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d.....2HFB4

Anxiety can be causing several of these issues, so if you help her manage the anxiety a lot of the issues may disappear.
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ra_mom




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 2:07 pm
For the record Floristor is a different type of probiotic. Yeast instead of bacteria. Refuah Shelaima.
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gp2.0




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 2:20 pm
ra_mom wrote:

I also agree with all the tips from gp2.0.



What a coincidence, because I agree with you too. 😉 Probiotics may be helpful and silent reflux is a good catch, that may very well be the culprit. Something is waking her up at night but it's anyone's guess what that is, could be anything from sleep apnea to reflux to nightmares to anxiety to her being too hot to pinworms to a habit that developed when she had pinworms...
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ra_mom




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 2:36 pm
gp2.0 wrote:
What a coincidence, because I agree with you too. 😉 Probiotics may be helpful and silent reflux is a good catch, that may very well be the culprit. Something is waking her up at night but it's anyone's guess what that is, could be anything from sleep apnea to reflux to nightmares to anxiety to her being too hot to pinworms to a habit that developed when she had pinworms...

Hi gp2.0! Tongue Out 👋
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amother
Chocolate


 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 2:42 pm
She needs to have an evaluation from a trauma therapist to check for it. Everything you mentioned can easily point to trauma.
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amother
Peach


 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 3:03 pm
Can you read up on the power of the microbiome. Intestinal health can cause very real issues including headaches and behavioral. Taking probiotics is not enough.

Diets like SCD and GAPS may be very helpful

For quick relief in privates, try plain unflavored yogurt with LIVE cultures such as Mehadrin yogurt for a few nights.
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amother
Aquamarine


 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 4:17 pm
This sounds a lot like my 6 yr old daughter! Especially the challenges getting her to eat or sleep, even or especially when she's tired or hungry.

And sadly in some ways like me too... can an ot work with an adult? I've been to several shrinks but they don't really help, I feel like my neuroticism, for lack of a better word, is rooted in low blood sugar (caused by not eating) rather than the other way around.

And once I go down the rabbit hole, it's hard to remedy.

The "plus" is that I really understand my daughter... I know that she needs to eat more frequently, for example.

Harping on the food thing a lot because I goofed in a lot of ways today, kind of lost my cool, and all possibly simply because I did not eat breakfast.
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amother
Vermilion


 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 6:55 pm
Try reading this book by pain specialists Lonnie and Paul Zeltzer https://www.amazon.com/Pain-Ch.....r=1-1
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amother
Magenta


 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 7:36 pm
amother wrote:


And another point- every single boo boo she gets has the almost the same reaction of crying. I try explaining to her there are levels of pain and I can't know when she is really hurt etc... To no avail...

Thank you!


This jumped out at me. I remember reading something about this. There's a name for it. And there's a therapy that can help it. I'm rushed before shabbos right now but I'll try to come back if I find the info I remember reading.
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amother
Tangerine


 

Post Fri, Jul 21 2017, 7:57 pm
If she's anxious maybe the private discomfort may be centered around memories from the pin worms. Ot and maybe a child psychologist could help?
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amother
Denim


 

Post Sat, Jul 22 2017, 3:54 pm
Just a few suggestions to check.
Could she be on the autistic spectrum?
Does she have creative and athletic outlets for her energy and emotions? Perhaps try dance, zumba, drama.
Check for trauma.
Could she have chrohn disease? Or coeliac?
Have you cut out ready made food and additives?
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amother
Emerald


 

Post Sat, Jul 22 2017, 9:11 pm
I would try a series of craniosacral treatment. It can calm her nervous system which is likely in sympathetic state most of the time.
Could she be picking up other people's anxieties?
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