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Forum -> Working Women

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amother

Lawngreen

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 1:16 pm

Hi, I'm trying to figure out which program language I should choose to become a professional programmer.
I know a little bit of C sharp and visual basics.
I don't know if I should choose a language based on how quickly I'll get a job, or how easy it's going to be to learn the language.
I think it's boiled down to C sharp vs. Java.

C sharp - being a simple language that I know a bit, and is good with desktop applications which I love creating.
And
Java - being an on demand program language compatible with all devices.

My passion is to create desktop application.
However, I want to make money out of it, so maybe I should do something else.

I don't have the guts to work with big businesses.
What is on demand for small businesses?
I will probably not attend a class.
I only do online free courses.

I would really appreciate any advice.

qwerty4

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 2:05 pm

Following. OP, can you share what online courses you found helpful for C#?

amother

Forestgreen

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 2:14 pm

my dh does c#. He has worked for startup businesses primarily and is now currently starting his own business where he is creating a software program to sell.

amother

Lawngreen

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 2:29 pm

qwerty4 wrote:

Following. OP, can you share what online courses you found helpful for C#?

Here is a link below.
He's so good I couldn't believe it's free.
They even provide a quiz afterwards.
And the certificate!

https://mva.microsoft.com/en-u.....18949

amother

Lawngreen

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 2:31 pm

amother wrote:

my dh does c#. He has worked for startup businesses primarily and is now currently starting his own business where he is creating a software program to sell.

Good to hear
Did he go to school? Or did he learn online?
How long did it take him to become a professional?

amother

Forestgreen

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 3:38 pm

my dh has a degree in computer engineering. I actually e-mailed him your question and this was his response

"Wow, that is a big question. Programming language matters far less than what you know in terms of basic programming concepts. In the past 15 years of programming I have used C++, Java, PHP, C#, Ruby, Perl, Python and Javascript. All of those are on demand for small business, depending on the business. And all of them you can make money with.

When interviewing people, I generally ask them to code in pseudo-code for the direct reason being if they can do a simple problem then they can probably translate it into code. You will never know everything a language has to offer.

I am not recommending a language but I do recommend the following skills: 1) Learn programming basics and how to troubleshoot code, 2) learn how to create a basic algorithm and then expand on it, 2) learn how to search on StackOverflow.

In terms of C# vs Java, another way to put what you said is: C# - good for windows machines and not compatible with anything. Java - write once, test on every device. Java says it is compatible, but unless you write the hello world program, it is not.

If you know some C# already and like it, then continue with that until you don't like it. There are 2 things you can do to learn programming really well. 1) pick a small problem and write some code to fix it, then make the code better and make it do more stuff. 2) join an open source project. The best thing to start with is look through the bug list for very small stuff( like editing comments or small text fixes) so you can figure out the codebase and how to code. Then start branching out in that project by taking on harder issues.

While you are at it. I would look into debugging procedures, unit testing and version control. Those concepts are needed regardless of language."

amother

Forestgreen

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 3:41 pm

my dh's experience is in the non frum world.
in terms of finding a job without a degree he said
"if she is a contributor to open source project and can say she did a lot, and prove it, and then she interviews well, she can get a job"

amother

Wine

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 3:48 pm

As a fellow programmer, I have to say that Forestgreen's husband gave excellent advice. Recommend you read every sentence a few times.

qwerty4

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 5:24 pm

amother wrote:

Here is a link below.
He's so good I couldn't believe it's free.
They even provide a quiz afterwards.
And the certificate!

https://mva.microsoft.com/en-u.....18949

Thanks!

Did you learn basic programming from this course or did you come in with prior knowledge in the programming field?

amother

Lawngreen

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 6:44 pm

qwerty4 wrote:

Thanks!

Did you learn basic programming from this course or did you come in with prior knowledge in the programming field?

I learned everything from this course.
Maybe I knew one or two things about programming before. But it wasn't necessary.

amother

Lawngreen

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 6:50 pm

amother wrote:

Wow wow!
Thank you so much for the reply. I appreciate your putting so much time into my question. It means so much for me. I don't understand everything you're saying because I'm still a newbie in programming, and I used Visual Studio to help me out a lot. But I'll make some research based on what you're saying.

amother

Forestgreen

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 7:16 pm

my dh said anytime Smile

I just copied and pasted your original question and e-mailed it to him It actually didn't take him long-that was an off the cuff response for him Wink

If you have any more questions he said he's happy to help. You can either post here or if you prefer to pm let me know and I can give you a mod to ask for my screenname would just rather not out myself Smile

amother

Crimson

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 7:18 pm

What about data structures? Normalization? These are part of theory that you need to designa database properly. But then again, I have an antiquated degree that's about 25 years old. Maybe nowadays that memory is so cheap nobody cares if your database is oversized.

amother

Ginger

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 8:11 pm

I agree with the other posters. I used to program (now I do the business analysis side) and over the course of the years I used C#, Perl, JavaScript, Java, VB, and PHP to name a few. If you understand the basic concepts then you can pick up new languages along the way. Another thing I used a lot was SQL because often I was reading/writing to a database.

amother

Forestgreen

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 8:28 pm

to the amother who asked about data structures etc. my dh replied the following

"Those are definitely very important. One of the first places I look when there are performance problems, is at the database and the queries. At that point, I hope that indexes fix it, because normalizing and optimizing data is really hard. There is a reason that a senior programmer and senior dba usually are in charge of database design(provided a company wants their program to work). It is a good thing to learn but it is not a newbie topic.

Memory is cheap today but when we talk about bad databases, we are talking about a lot of memory. At a previous company, because the database was so terribly designed, we spend almost $10,000 on 2 TB of storage. That is not a lot of storage for a lot of money. Someone like Google does not have enough money to spend if they didn't have very optimized data.

In terms of the a degree being obsolete, my take on this is that computer programming hasn't changed very much in 25 years. The only 2 big technologies to come in the last 25 years was internet technology(which started more then 25 years ago and has just developed to be more efficient) and multi-threading technology. All the underlying concepts and programming techniques are the same."

amother

Magenta

Wed, Aug 23 2017, 9:02 pm

The main thing is to fully understanding programming principles. Programming is not just about learning a language; it's the theory. Syntax will only get you so far.

Do you understand the basics, such as
-pass by reference vs. pass by value
-abstraction
-inheritence
-data encapsulation
-efficiency of various sorting methods
-data structures
-database design
Etc.?

You should definitely know the basics of sql and web development theory (I.e. even if you don't actually code javascript, you should have an understanding of how the technology stack fits together.)

The bottom line is this: there is no system that uses one technology or language exclusively. To be an excellent programmer, you have to be able to understand and integrate all the pieces.

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