Internal vs external beauty

amother

Slateblue

Sun, Nov 05 2017, 5:10 am

Was going to post this under tznius but that wasn't quite the right place so I'm putting it here although I'm not sure your could call it "interesting".

When I look at myself in the mirror, I see a woman who is getting uglier and uglier. It's not just the weight gain, there is something objectively very ugly about my face that was not there 10 years ago. And it's not really about "wrinkles", as I think for my age I'm not doing too badly in the wrinkle department. Even when I smile it is there, although not as bad.

Now internally I do think (sometimes) that I am becoming a better person. It is certainly something I strive towards every day (almost every moment) of my life. But I do have a lot of challenging people around me, so in some ways I certainly don't look like a better person, because although I am , say, more patient than I would be without the challenge, I am not as patient as I should be, given the situation. The way I see it is that I have been given challenging people in my life to make me a better person, and although I have improved somewhat, I have not improved as much as I should have done. I think that this is why I am starting to look extremely ugly as well. I am very fortunate that my DH still tells me I am beautiful sometimes, but I am sure that it is objectively correct that I am getting very ugly.

My question is - is it true that my external ugliness is a reflection of my internal failure, and if so, what is the best thing to do to improve both the internal and external aspects? When you look at great Torah teachers, they tend to shine with external beauty from the internal beauty that is within them, don't you think? I am the exact opposite of that.

I realize the question itself is pretty self indulgent so I'm guessing that as a big part of the problem. Any other ideas?

amother

Gold

Sun, Nov 05 2017, 5:43 am

I think if a person is internally at peace with him/herself that gets reflected in their face as inner beauty.
There are two other aspects to beauty - one is genetic, the face shape and structure we are born with. The other is natural ageing.

I don't know you, op, but if you used to think that you looked okay in the past, your "genetic" face structure can't be all that bad and it doesn't usually change with life.

Natural ageing is just that, natural, and it's a mistake of modern Western society to overly glorify youth.
A mature face can look beautiful and dignified as well and show much more character than a smooth pink bland "baby face".
A mature face can also project authority and wisdom much better than a young face.

That leaves the third aspect - inner peace. I don't know which troubles and challenges you face in your life, but I hope you can find a good way to "face" them.

Wishing you all the best.

edit: just one thing. If you notice that some parts of your body, such as especially nose, hands and feet objectively "grow" out of proportion within a few months, that could be a sign of an endocrinological disease and needs checking. But I assume that's not your problem. Just saying ...

PinkFridge

Sun, Nov 05 2017, 8:52 am

I remember a lovely older couple, long-married relatives of mine, who were crazy about each other, and I asked a cousin, when they look at each other do they see the kid they married, or do they see who they are now, the product of all their years together. She said, both.

We have every right to feel beautiful. The wrinkles, the body rolls, we've earned them honestly and have, b"H experienced enough and lived long enough to have them.

I am not sure what this ugliness you see is. You can see stress on your face, you can see all sorts of things, but why be so hard on yourself?

Do you have the resources to dress the way you'd like? Head covering, shoes, etc.? If not, can you at least accessorize, put on makeup, so when you pass yourself in the mirror you can see someone who has style and her act together?

Oh, and Dr. Fridge is prescribing getting some humor into your life, at least once a day. Subscribe to RD.com, GCFL.net, Jewlarious on Aish, pick your poison. Add in, if possible walking in natural daylight (talk to your doctor about vitamin D).

Lots of hugs and be well!

zaq

Sun, Nov 05 2017, 9:08 am

Where did you get such an idea and who put it on your head? I feel awful for you believing this or even just thinking it’s a possibility.

Time and genetics wreak havoc on our figures and faces. Some people have the means and desire to repair the damage as far as possible and preserve the illusion of youthful freshness, and some don’t. Some people are gifted by their DNA with good bone structure, pearly straight teeth, thick hair, a rapid metabolism and long bones that persist into old age, and some aren’t.

You mean to tell me you don’t see “beautiful people” who are utterly depraved? You don’t see tzaddikim whose looks are, let’s just say “unfortunate”? Don’t you know the story of the very ugly Tanna who was mocked by the daughtet of a high ranking Roman official?

She asked him how could G-d put such a great mind in such an ugly container? He responded by asking what her father uses to store wine. She said “clay jars”. He told her that that wasn’t appropriate, that wine deserved to be in silver vessels. So she decanted all the wine into silver and it promptly spoiled.

When she returned to the rabbi, incensed, he explained the point: just as storing wine in humble clay vessels preserves it and fancy silver spoils it, so would his learning spoil if he had a handsome appearance.

Yes, there are people whose goodness shines from them but it’s never about their features or their complexion. It’s about their serene smile, their gentle eyes, their sever panim yafot. SEVER panim yafot, not just panim yafot. The EXPRESSION on the face, not the face itself.

Don’t see yourself as the Picture of Dorian Grey. That was a work of fiction.

amother

Aubergine

Sun, Nov 05 2017, 9:08 am

I absolutely relate to what you are talking about. I am at a very stressful point in my life and childrearing, big kid problems, elementary school age problems, and being kept up all night by teething toddlers, while juggling a community role. When I look at a young "kallah maidel" I think I look like her, then I look in the mirror... And I'm shocked! Getting close to middle age, not as thin, not as fresh, tired and stressed etched all over my face...

I think, if I could just get a handle on my diet and exercise - I have been on top of my looks at so many other times in my mothering, but I can't seem to now! Stress eating and no time for toning workouts, its just my reality. Not enough brain space to remember enough water drinking, vitamins, etc...plus I sacrifice the extra money for my teen daughter's clothing needs, so I do feel a bit out of date.

I look at women my age with large families and wonder: how do they still look fresh, thin, and up to date and wonder, what's their secret? Do they have more money, more cleaning help, a nanny? Less of a role in the community, less constant guests?

But I definitely don't think they are more beautiful than me on the inside. My stress and exhaustion are humbling and refining me, that's for sure. I've never been less judgemental and more accepting of others in my entire life.

amother

Chocolate

Sun, Nov 05 2017, 9:15 am

aubergine and slateblue, I have had those exact same thoughts in the past few days!

I know I used to be pretty, thin, etc. and now, when I look in the mirror - I just don't see that. And I'm not even that old. I feel that I'm under a huge amount of stress, that I can't take away no matter what I do. I don't have the time to go to the gym, sleep 8 hours a night, etc. and I have gained quite a few pounds from my last two babies, and other pregnancies. I look at other women my age, and some look just so beautiful and thin, and I wonder - what is there secret? And does this say something less than wonderful about me, that I aged so badly?

amother

Aubergine

Sun, Nov 05 2017, 9:18 am

amother wrote:

Thanks for this, even though I wish you and op felt better than me, the commiserating feels very good. I hope everything gets less stressful for both of you (and me), and we have more time for self care soon!

zaq

Sun, Nov 05 2017, 9:26 am

amother wrote:

You’re guilty of stacking the cards against yourself. You notice the women who look exceptionally good and not the vast majority who look ordinary, and you’re really ignoring those who look terrible.

That you aged badly in your opinion just says that you care about other things more than your looks. Maybe you have more challenges and less emotional support or money than the beauties, maybe they were more beautiful to begin with, maybe they place a higher priority on looks than you do, maybe they have demanding husbands who coerce them into staying slim and young looking and threaten to divorce them if they gain weight.

And remember that your assessment of your looks is always going to be more critical than anyone else’s. Nobody else looks at you with a magnifying mirror.,

amother

Chocolate

Sun, Nov 05 2017, 9:34 am

Thank you zaq, that was very kind of you.

The women that I was comparing myself to actually spend zero time on looking good and beauty. I understand someone like Melania who prob. spends hours a day on looking beautiful will look beautiful, and I'm not comparing myself to someone like her. But these women wear almost no make-up, very tznius dressed, etc. I'm jealous.

zaq

Sun, Nov 05 2017, 10:03 am

You need to start loving yourself. Remember the T shirt that read “I may not be perfect but parts of me are excellent”? There’s more to looks than a perfect figure, and there’s more to you than looks.

Your dh calls you beautiful. By your own admission you’re faced with many challenges and somehow you’re coping with them. You say you’re a better person than you used to be. All this is something to be proud of. Why tear yourself down?

Were you very into looks when you were younger? Was that your top priority, or what you prided yourself on the most? Then I can see how aging can be more distressing to you than to someone who depended less on her looks and more on other traits.

Maybe it’s time for you to give up your looks hangup and start priding yourself on your other accomplishments. Would you really rather be admired for your looks as opposed to your brains or character?

Still, if the mirror really offends you, there are things you can do. You may not be able to make yourself look 20 again but you can make yourself an attractive 40 or 60 or whatever you are. Color your hair or have it styled, shed a few pounds, pay attention to posture, buy a stylish new outfit or two, or find new combinations of items you already own. Get your shoes fixed and polished, wear your jewelry, replace the tarnished buttons on your coat. Put on a little discreet makeup. Even just a veil of “translucent” loose powder and some lipstick will do. When you like what you see in tbe mirror, you automatically smile, and that is the true beauty.

amother

Slateblue

Sun, Nov 05 2017, 11:30 am

Thanks to those who wrote on here. Zaq you ha some interesting things to say, I'm going to have to find that story about the wine in the silver. The thing is for me as a younger person I never was concerned about my looks or clothes or fashion or makeup or any of these things, in fact I found, and still find them, shallow. And I think that I actually look "young" for my age. Young, but ugly in a way I never noticed before. Not old and craggy, just puffy and ugly.

The other strange thing is that people recently have tod me that I am ALWAYS smiling. Like comments of you always look happy, you always smile even through difficulties (from those who know me well). Guess they are just trying to make me feel better

I think it is sad that others feel the same way. If one I you had started the thread might have said to you something like "you are not objective/you can never really see your own face except as an images (mirror or photo) so maybe you don't really know what you look like or how others see you". But I don't think.that applies here, lol.

leah233

Sun, Nov 05 2017, 12:50 pm

As a teacher in seminary once put it. "For all we know Avraham Avinu had a beard that didn't grow properly and other physical deformities. Haman on the other hand was almost certainly a good looking super charismatic person"

As far as internal beauty shining through, as the saying goes "there is no make up a girl can wear nicer than a sincere smile"