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Any experience with a third cell phone ticket in nj?



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amother
Slategray


 

Post Sun, Nov 19 2017, 10:06 am
Have had zero tickets in the past 7+ years but this is the third cell phone ticket (other two were 8, 9 years ago)...

What should I anticipate?

Advice (aside from making sure I have a spare headset)?
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RebekahsMom




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Nov 19 2017, 11:55 am
From the nj.gov site, within a 10 year period from the first ticket:
Quote:

39:4-97.3 A person who violates this section shall be fined as follows:

(1) for a first offense, not less than $200 or more than $400 plus court costs and possible court appearance;

(2) for a second offense, not less than $400 or more than $600 plus court costs; and

(3) for a third or subsequent offense, not less than $600 or more than $800 plus court costs .

For a third or subsequent violation, the court, in its discretion, may order the person to forfeit the right to operate a motor vehicle over the highways of this State for a period of 90 days.
In addition, a person convicted of a third or subsequent violation shall be assessed three motor vehicle penalty points pursuant to section 1 of P.L.1982, c.43 (C.39:5-30.5).


Now please, stop and ask yourself was that phone call REALLY worth the $600+, the points, and the insurance increases, assuming you don’t lose your license?

My advice? Next time, pull over or put down the phone. People have lived years without the ability to stay in touch for a 20 minute drive.
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naomi2




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Nov 19 2017, 1:13 pm
Op, you are playing with fire. It only takes one second to murder someone with your car, while on an "important" phonecall.
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amother
Slategray


 

Post Sun, Nov 19 2017, 2:39 pm
Two previous posters, your posts were not in any way helpful (or an answer to my question) unless you are particularly trying to "kick me when I'm down" (which perhaps is your goal for all I know). Although actually, posting the consequences from the website was helpful, so thanks for that.

I know it's terrible to talk on the phone while driving, it's inexcusable, I will never do it again and am so grateful to live in a world where apparently no one else ever even considers doing it.

Is there anyone else that this has happened to? What were your fines etc? Did you hire a lawyer?

Thank you
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RebekahsMom




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Nov 19 2017, 5:49 pm
amother wrote:
Two previous posters, your posts were not in any way helpful (or an answer to my question) unless you are particularly trying to "kick me when I'm down" (which perhaps is your goal for all I know). Although actually, posting the consequences from the website was helpful, so thanks for that.

I know it's terrible to talk on the phone while driving, it's inexcusable, I will never do it again and am so grateful to live in a world where apparently no one else ever even considers doing it.

Is there anyone else that this has happened to? What were your fines etc? Did you hire a lawyer?

Thank you


Actually, my post was helpful. It answered exactly what to expect.

And regarding your comment about our perfect world where no one touches their phone, I know of exactly 2 people that don’t use their phone while driving. (Mine can only be dialed while the car is not moving, but I’m not denying being on it, knowing the consequences).

If I sounded negative, I’ve seen firsthand the damages that a cell phone can cause to family/ friends.

You can call a lawyer, but I’m not sure how much help they will offer. I know on the 1st/ 2nd ticket, it’s not worth hiring the lawyer because of costs. However, when points/ risk of suspension come in, it might be worthwhile. Figure at least $200 in legal fees, but if they can knock down the ticket by the same, or take off the additional problems, it could be worth it.
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doctorima




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Nov 19 2017, 9:05 pm
amother wrote:
Is there anyone else that this has happened to? What were your fines etc? Did you hire a lawyer?


No B"H this hasn't happened to me, but from the experience I have had with traffic courts personally and from hearing with others, I would absolutely hire a lawyer in your circumstances, considering the potential fines and ramifications to your license and insurance - total no-brainer.
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33055




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Nov 19 2017, 11:24 pm
amother wrote:
Two previous posters, your posts were not in any way helpful (or an answer to my question) unless you are particularly trying to "kick me when I'm down" (which perhaps is your goal for all I know). Although actually, posting the consequences from the website was helpful, so thanks for that.

I know it's terrible to talk on the phone while driving, it's inexcusable, I will never do it again and am so grateful to live in a world where apparently no one else ever even considers doing it.

Is there anyone else that this has happened to? What were your fines etc? Did you hire a lawyer?

Thank you


You should definitely hire a really good lawyer who specializes in this because you may get a 4th ticket. You didn't learn your lesson after the first two. Why now do you believe you will learn it because of the third? I am not judging-just being practical. You risk a 90 day suspension at this this point.
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amother
Papaya


 

Post Sun, Nov 19 2017, 11:44 pm
Squishy wrote:
You should definitely hire a really good lawyer who specializes in this because you may get a 4th ticket. You didn't learn your lesson after the first two. Why now do you believe you will learn it because of the third? I am not judging-just being practical. You risk a 90 day suspension at this this point.


Really good lawyers don't specialize in traffic violations (or what ever this is called in NJ). You just need a lawyer who has experience in this area, and has been successful.

Forget the rhetoric of 'not learning your lesson'. It is what it is.

At this point you need someone to help you convince the judge not to temporarily suspend your licence. It seems like the demerit points aren't arguable.

Alternatively - if a non-guilty plee is an option (I'm not NJ lawyer) you need advice on the likelyhood of that being accepted. You also need advice on what happens in court if the officer who gave you the ticket doesn't show up (again not a NJ lawyer - not sure if that's relevant).
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MrsDash




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Nov 20 2017, 1:47 am
I don’t think putting in a not guilty plea will work in your favor. From the judges point of view, this is your third strike for the same offense. You need to show the court that you are remorseful and will take any defensive driving classes, or similar, in lieu of a suspension.
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amother
Papaya


 

Post Mon, Nov 20 2017, 1:51 am
MrsDash wrote:
I don’t think putting in a not guilty plea will work in your favor. From the judges point of view, this is your third strike for the same offense. You need to show the court that you are remorseful and will take any defensive driving classes, or similar, in lieu of a suspension.


Agree, She can't plead "not guilty - I didn't know the law" she could plead "not guilty, I do know the law and the officer was mistaken in what he saw". This is not advice.
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33055




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Nov 20 2017, 8:28 am
amother wrote:
Really good lawyers don't specialize in traffic violations (or what ever this is called in NJ). You just need a lawyer who has experience in this area, and has been successful.

Forget the rhetoric of 'not learning your lesson'. It is what it is.

At this point you need someone to help you convince the judge not to temporarily suspend your licence. It seems like the demerit points aren't arguable.

Alternatively - if a non-guilty plee is an option (I'm not NJ lawyer) you need advice on the likelyhood of that being accepted. You also need advice on what happens in court if the officer who gave you the ticket doesn't show up (again not a NJ lawyer - not sure if that's relevant).


You are wrong. It is really stupid thing you are saying about those attorneys. I know an excellent lawyer in NJ who because of health issues is in this field. I know of another lawyer in NY who was an honors Ivy League graduate who holds a graduate degree in economics and an LL.M. in Taxation and is independently wealthy who had chosen to work with DMV issues. He worked for a top firm at one point doing estates and trusts work. His other area of expertise is managing the family's wealth. I know a mom who does this work because her husband can be home with the kids in the evenings when she primarily works. It's really nasty of you to discount every attorney who does this work. Some people work in less demanding areas of law for reasons which have nothing to do with how well their synapses fire.

The rhetoric of her not learning her lesson is that it is strongly possible she will have a traffic issue in the future. She needs to clean up things as best she can for future traffic stops.

Again you are wrong about the goal of the lawyer. The lawyer should see if he can get it thrown out on a technicality for instance. Or paper the other side, so they offer a deal maybe a fine and no points.

I have NY friend who is in a similar bind. She NEEDS to be able to drive in NJ for work reasons. She had one ok attorney who was saying pretty much to throw in the towel and take a negotiated deal which included a suspended license and no fine. She switched attornies out of desperation. I have been hearing how this attorney won't quit and is papering the court with motions. She had several tickets dismissed out right because of her attorney's persistence and expertise. There is one on appeal now over a technicality. The court suspended hearing the appeal because there is already a case before a higher court on this issue. I can't remember what the technicality is. But my friend is ecstatic.
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amother
Orange


 

Post Mon, Nov 20 2017, 9:19 am
I don't have any experience with cell phone tickets, or with repeated offenses, but in my experience, the way it worked in NJ is that you and your lawyer meet with the prosecutor at the beginning of your court time if possible, negotiate a guilty plea for a lesser offense. Then you go before the judge and plead guilty to the lesser offense, which might be a fine but no (or less) points. Again, I'm not sure how it works with cell phone tickets or with repeated offenses.
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amother
Lawngreen


 

Post Mon, Nov 20 2017, 9:44 am
amother wrote:
I don't have any experience with cell phone tickets, or with repeated offenses, but in my experience, the way it worked in NJ is that you and your lawyer meet with the prosecutor at the beginning of your court time if possible, negotiate a guilty plea for a lesser offense. Then you go before the judge and plead guilty to the lesser offense, which might be a fine but no (or less) points. Again, I'm not sure how it works with cell phone tickets or with repeated offenses.


Given the fact that it was so long between violations, an attorney may be able to negotiate a deal for a fine with no points and/or no license suspension.

If I were you, I'd be in a position to state that you immediately went out and bought a hands free device that you intend to keep in the car at all times.

You want someone who knows the court, knows the ADAs, and is familiar with the judges. That will get you further than the best attorney in the state who doesn't know the system.
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doctorima




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Nov 20 2017, 10:19 am
In addition to the legal route and hands-free device, I would also go out and take a 5-hour defensive driving class, which will lower your insurance, take points off your license, and go on your record that you can show the prosecutor and judge as proof that you're taking this seriously and working to improve.
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amother
Papaya


 

Post Mon, Nov 20 2017, 10:25 am
Squishy wrote:
You are wrong. It is really stupid thing you are saying about those attorneys. I know an excellent lawyer in NJ who because of health issues is in this field. I know of another lawyer in NY who was an honors Ivy League graduate who holds a graduate degree in economics and an LL.M. in Taxation and is independently wealthy who had chosen to work with DMV issues. He worked for a top firm at one point doing estates and trusts work. His other area of expertise is managing the family's wealth. I know a mom who does this work because her husband can be home with the kids in the evenings when she primarily works. It's really nasty of you to discount every attorney who does this work. Some people work in less demanding areas of law for reasons which have nothing to do with how well their synapses fire.

The rhetoric of her not learning her lesson is that it is strongly possible she will have a traffic issue in the future. She needs to clean up things as best she can for future traffic stops.

Again you are wrong about the goal of the lawyer. The lawyer should see if he can get it thrown out on a technicality for instance. Or paper the other side, so they offer a deal maybe a fine and no points.

I have NY friend who is in a similar bind. She NEEDS to be able to drive in NJ for work reasons. She had one ok attorney who was saying pretty much to throw in the towel and take a negotiated deal which included a suspended license and no fine. She switched attornies out of desperation. I have been hearing how this attorney won't quit and is papering the court with motions. She had several tickets dismissed out right because of her attorney's persistence and expertise. There is one on appeal now over a technicality. The court suspended hearing the appeal because there is already a case before a higher court on this issue. I can't remember what the technicality is. But my friend is ecstatic.


Wow. I'm wrong, stupid, and nasty all in one post. Amazing.

Perhaps you could offer to connect OP to the excellent lawyer in NJ who practices in this field because of health issues.

What does learning her lesson.. because she might get a fourth violation.. have anything to do with the current task, which is to minimize the consequences of this ticket.

I never claimed to have listed out all the courses of action regarding this ticket - thank you for adding another one - getting it thrown out on a technicality. Something that a lawyer who has been successful in this area of practice would know.
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amother
Tan


 

Post Mon, Nov 20 2017, 12:20 pm
doctorima wrote:
In addition to the legal route and hands-free device, I would also go out and take a 5-hour defensive driving class, which will lower your insurance, take points off your license, and go on your record that you can show the prosecutor and judge as proof that you're taking this seriously and working to improve.


Just to clarify, I haven't gotten any tickets (at all) in the past 8 years. I have never had any points on my license (the cell phone tickets I got years ago didn't come with points at that point), I'm driving 30+ years and have never gotten into an accident. I own a hands free device which I usually use, at the time of the ticket, I was driving a different car (which now has a "spare" headset in it).
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33055




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Nov 20 2017, 2:29 pm
amother wrote:
Given the fact that it was so long between violations, an attorney may be able to negotiate a deal for a fine with no points and/or no license suspension.

If I were you, I'd be in a position to state that you immediately went out and bought a hands free device that you intend to keep in the car at all times.

You want someone who knows the court, knows the ADAs, and is familiar with the judges. That will get you further than the best attorney in the state who doesn't know the system.


The attorney I speaking off took local counsel in with him, but he is the brains.
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