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Do you find this profile of Judge Rachel Freier inspiring
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amother
Linen


 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 9:17 am
Mommyg8 wrote:
I didn't check out excelsior yet, but how did you get the accounting classes? Did you take the actual accounting courses through excelsior? I never heard of that option, just wondering.


You could take the classes directly from Excelsior.

Are you asking which of the frum programs that offer courses (through other schools) provide accounting?

Tuoro offers accounting.
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amother
Rose


 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 9:19 am
Mevater wrote:


If not for the unique G-d given gifts, especially her brains, shed be no more remarkable than most.


If not for any person's unique G-d given gifts, they would be no more remarkable than most. Why negate the credit and admiration she rightfully deserves?

Do you apply this concept for a world-class singer? "If not for his unique G-d given singing abilitites, he would be no more remarkable than most".

What about an amazing artist - "If not for his unique G-d given drawing capabilities, he would be no more remarkable than most.

Additionally, even if you're blessed with a unique gift, it still requires an awful lot of hard work on one's part - very very hard work. Ruchy deserves all the praise and acknowledgements she gets - she deserves every bit of it!
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amother
Peach


 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 9:55 am
Like I said I'm not from The USA. So it is not relevant for you Mommyg8. Where I com from it is like College , but you learn from home and make the test/exams at the university. Almost all 18 yo from my old school, are taking the courses like this. It is so good. They even offer the availablity to take the tests from home with a special app and a laptop or webcam. So easy for us moms. You can scedule the exam when baby is in nursery or at evenings. It is also very cheap. Per year it cost like 1000$. And if you are on a special govrn program you pay like 100$. Hands up for the city where I live.
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Mommyg8




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 9:55 am
amother wrote:
You could take the classes directly from Excelsior.

Are you asking which of the frum programs that offer courses (through other schools) provide accounting?

Tuoro offers accounting.


Are you taking the classes directly from Excelsior? Isn't it very hard to take accounting classes online? The people I have spoken to who have tried online accounting courses were somewhat negative, but if there are better options... I know people have asked me this question.
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amother
Burgundy


 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 9:55 am
amother wrote:
Wel I'm not from Brooklyn as I said and there are communities outside of Brooklyn if you wouldn't know I'm telling you now ;-). Even in Israel allmost all of my SILS have BA's in teaching and are from BB, Husbands all sit and learn. BTW my DH does not have any degree and in my community it is rare to see a man with a degree.


Israel is very different because of the draft situation.
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amother
Royalblue


 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 9:55 am
Raisin wrote:
I know male converts who are rabbis, so clearly this is not taken seriously.


It should apply to converts, as well, but it appears to have been selectively applied to women.
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amother
Peach


 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 9:59 am
Mommyg8 wrote:
Are you taking the classes directly from Excelsior? Isn't it very hard to take accounting classes online? The people I have spoken to who have tried online accounting courses were somewhat negative, but if there are better options... I know people have asked me this question.


I didn't say it was easy, it is not easy but if you go with a group it is much easier as you learn together thats what they all do nowadays.
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Mommyg8




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 10:03 am
amother wrote:
I didn't say it was easy, it is not easy but if you go with a group it is much easier as you learn together thats what they all do nowadays.


Ok, sorry, I didn't read your first post carefully enough, and I didn't realize that you're not in the USA.

Yes, there are plenty of online options here too, I just don't know anyone who was happy with any of them, but I would imagine that taking the classes together as a group would make it much, much easier.

I feel it's just too bad that the degrees here are so expensive, and if you do it online the way you are saying it could be almost free if you are eligible for fafsa and/or scholarships. And working as a group does make it much more do-able.
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amother
Azure


 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 10:32 am
amother wrote:
Israel is very different because of the draft situation.


Once a man turns 24, he has no army obligations. He can go to school or work as he pleases.
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dancingqueen




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 10:38 am
Mevater wrote:
She's also remarkably blessed by Hashem to

1- have the very unique remarkable brains she was born with, and

2- have the uniquely supportive husband she has.

If not for the unique G-d given gifts, especially her brains, shed be no more remarkable than most.


I agree she clearly is brilliant. But again, not whole community is filled with women who have done high level grad school while pregnant and/or as a mother with supportive husbands (we don’t do the whole captain/first mate thing described here).

What’s remarkable is her drive and ability to spearhead and make her dreams a reality (founding the Womens ambulance, becoming a judge) yet somehow respecting the norms of her society while pushing the envelope just a little bit at a time. That’s what the Times found remarkable as do I.
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amother
Burgundy


 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 12:00 pm
amother wrote:
Once a man turns 24, he has no army obligations. He can go to school or work as he pleases.


Interesting..So why do so many Israeli men not go to school or seek employment, and rely on the women?
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Mommyg8




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 12:04 pm
dancingqueen wrote:
I agree she clearly is brilliant. But again, not whole community is filled with women who have done high level grad school while pregnant and/or as a mother with supportive husbands (we don’t do the whole captain/first mate thing described here).


It's extremely different when, like you say, your entire community is doing it, then when it's just one person who's breaking the mold... It would have been much more difficult for her. Which is why she deserves every single compliment headed her way!
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Mevater




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 12:26 pm
Mommyg8 wrote:
It's extremely different when, like you say, your entire community is doing it, then when it's just one person who's breaking the mold... It would have been much more difficult for her. Which is why she deserves every single compliment headed her way!


Thats true.

But if she hadnt been been blessed by Hashem with very very very unique brains, even with the best of guts, courage, fearlessness, ambition, and zealousness, etc she wouldnt have gone very far.

I know lots of people who were either tossed from law school because as hard as they tried, they couldnt meet the minimum grade requirements, or who left law school on their own because it was too stressful for them to be studying around the clock, and not sleeping, and without studying around the clock, they couldnt get the needed grades.
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Mommyg8




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 12:34 pm
Mevater wrote:
Thats true.

But if she hadnt been been blessed by Hashem with very very very unique brains, even with the best of guts, courage, fearlessness, ambition, and zealousness, etc she wouldnt have gone very far.

I know lots of people who were either tossed from law school because as hard as they tried, they couldnt meet the minimum grade requirements, or who left law school on their own because it was too stressful for them to be studying around the clock, and not sleeping, and without studying around the clock, they couldnt get the needed grades.


Yes, I agree, law school is extremely rigorous! Not everyone is cut out to be a lawyer.

But you do realize that in order to be a trailblazer, which she is, you have to have a unique sense of circumstances - which in her case meant unique brains, unique support from her family, and also... to be honest, unique drive.

Let's say that you will categorize someone as brilliant only if they fall into the top 2% of the population, IQ-wise. How many women in Boro Park would fit into that category? If there are 50,000 frum women in Brooklyn, then that translates into 1000 women. But only one women did it. That's what makes her, I guess you might call it, EXTRA unique.
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Mevater




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 1:33 pm
Mommyg8 wrote:
Yes, I agree, law school is extremely rigorous! Not everyone is cut out to be a lawyer.

But you do realize that in order to be a trailblazer, which she is, you have to have a unique sense of circumstances - which in her case meant unique brains, unique support from her family, and also... to be honest, unique drive.

Let's say that you will categorize someone as brilliant only if they fall into the top 2% of the population, IQ-wise. How many women in Boro Park would fit into that category? If there are 50,000 frum women in Brooklyn, then that translates into 1000 women. But only one women did it. That's what makes her, I guess you might call it, EXTRA unique.


Good point, but those 1,000 women have to have an interest in being lawyers, and not businesswomen, which many very frum women are.

Also Rachel had the Mazel of getting a job as a young woman in a well known Lawyers office, when I believe she had zero intentions of becoming a lawyer. Ive heard that this lawyer told her shed make a very good lawyer, and when in law school she was already familiar with legal work, having worked for a lawyer for many years.

Im eagerly awaiting to see a Chassidish women who goes to med school. Although I think the entrance requirements and the studying in med school is even harder than law school.
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zaq




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 8:59 pm
I wouldn’t say the article is “inspiring” to me, because inspiring means it gives me the desire to follow suit or do something similar. It’s a bit late in the day for me, but I hope many young women are inspired by Judge Freier’s example. I do, however. ADMIRE this woman tremendously.

But she is setting the bar exceptionally high, and I wish that she weren’t quite such a Superwoman. I wish she had hired a cleaning lady or bought takeout food. I fear for young women who will kill themselves trying to emulate her in every way, right down to the homemade challah. The message “Don’t let being frum make you think you can’t have a nontraditional career” is terrific. The message “You can have an important career and do all the things a sahm does, too,” not so much.

Judge Freier is obviously blessed with the energy of three normal women. Most women CANNOT do it all, it’s unreasonable for them to expect to, and there’s no reason why they should have to. If you’re in school, why NOT get cleaning help? Why NOT buy bakery challah? It’s not necessary to kill yourself. If it means that much to you, you can go back to homemade when you finish your degree.
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amother
Royalblue


 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 9:29 pm
Where does it say that she did/does not have cleaning help? Or childcare? Or that she doesn’t buy other foods (even if she continues to make challah)? Or that she continued to hold down a job, while she was in law school?

She married into a very wealthy family, and she did not go back to school until her husband was working.

It doesn’t take away from any of her accomplishments which are considerable and very admirable, and I’m sure she worked very hard for all she achieved, but I don’t think she’s quite the superwoman everybody is making her out to be, and I don’t think everyone needs to feel inadequate in comparison. I think she’s a lesson in making the most of what is given to you (whether wealth, capability, etc.) and putting it to good use. In that sense she can be a role model to us all.
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Mevater




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 23 2017, 11:45 pm
amother wrote:
She married into a very wealthy family, and she did not go back to school until her husband was working.


Afaik but I didnt hear it from her directly, the whole law school idea wasnt hers, it was hér boss' idea because he thought she was very bright.
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amother
Royalblue


 

Post Fri, Nov 24 2017, 7:51 am
Mevater wrote:
She's also remarkably blessed by Hashem to

1- have the very unique remarkable brains she was born with, and

2- have the uniquely supportive husband she has.

If not for the unique G-d given gifts, especially her brains, shed be no more remarkable than most.


I don’t think she has such a unique, remarkable brain. I was in school with her, and if you had asked me to name the smartest girls in the class, she would not have made the list. And she still wouldn’t. Bright? Absolutely. Capable? Definitely. But a genius? I doubt it.

What’s remarkable about Ruchie is her attitude. It’s her determination. And her perseverance. It’s her refusal to give up in the face of obstacles or conventional wisdom that she is attempting the impossible.

True she was handed a unique set of circumstances in her (good enough) intelligence, money, and (most importantly) supportive spouse, but she decided what to do with it. She chose to make the most of whatever HaShem gave her - and that is something we can all emulate.
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amother
Blue


 

Post Tue, Nov 28 2017, 6:01 am
iluvy wrote:
Fox, I try to be polite on the Internet, but I am literally shaking with anger at the specious garbage you just wrote. I apologize for the strong language but your post is so incredibly damaging and harmful to women while trying to to coopt the language of people care about women.

Our community desperately needs women in positions of leadership and power. We need women rabbis, whatever you want to call them. We need gender parity on the committees to choose the rabbis. We need women on school boards (Bais Yaakov and yeshiva), mikvah boards, tzedakah boards. We need frum female politicians and frum women liaisons to politicians. A community run by men is barren, dysfunctional, and frighteningly vulnerable to abuses of power.

How dare you use stories of women of being harmed to advocate for harming women? Almost every story of s-xual harassment that has recently emerged is a story of power imbalance. When women have the power, almost all of these stories would disappear.

How many of these gvirim and machers do not have female secretaries? For so many of these people who ch"v can't sit around a table with women and respectfully listen to what they have to say, mingling with women is suddenly okay when the woman is paid by them, several socioeconomic steps beneath them, and dependent on them in many respects. Which of course is not at all conducive to harassment and assault. Thanks so much for keeping the bottom of the ladder a "safe space" for women Rolling Eyes Banging head


Alert! Hold it... We need women rabbis? This is fake frum. Ad kan!
s_harrasment? Who goes alone to hotel rooms of directors? Every baby know this may be a S trap? Plus if you are frum there will be ychud.

Quite hard to go thru7 pages. I'm stopping. I am a wife and mother and hold a job. No time. My job gives medical insurance which is my goal and I don't aspire to go much higher. If I can go up in my own field a tiny more I'll do but no I'm not trying to become site admin. I make quite little now but I was able to guarantee being earlier home unlike the other that I arrived home 5:30 or 6 . With this my ydish home is not shaky anymore. In my new company I'm less than a year and was offered and moved to a more sofisticated room and job duty Boruch Hashem because of my qualifications. I'm proud that my family does not have to fake income to have horrible Medicaid coverage. (I actually changed jobs recently and earn less because Hashem sent the opportunity my way and the previous job was with nasty people. I was there many years and had bonus retirement etc. -but it was a sour place)

Here is about Freier: #1 I go with Ms fox here. She's True Torah!

And #2 Freier did a lot of damage when helping and giving lawyer services and support to Yoel Roth cult leader at the time he was still in diapers, when he was instigating teens to aleniate their families. Well now 8 years later he is different but he built his name by ripping kids from their family. His practice was 8 years ago like Scientology. I know he changed recently and is encouraging to keep up with family. I didn't have time to read 7 pages just don't think she is loved by all.
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