Carpool: Tit for tat?

amother

Thu, Sep 02 2010, 11:48 am

For those that do carpool:

Is it tit for tat, meaning you all take equal turns or if someone can't do one week it's okay and everyone pitches in?

I am asking as I did carpool last year with a group and one of the ladies always makes such an issue that it has to be equal and if I do one you do one, even if it's hard for one of the people. What happened to chessed? Does it not apply to carpool? Not everyone drives, and not everyone can arrange their schedule to fit in carpool.

If one can't take their turn they have to make it up regardless so it's fair for everyone, I agree that in a perfect world it should be fair, but it's not a perfect world and due to work commitments me and DH can't always take our turn and if we don't this lady gets so upset, I opted out of the carpool for the time being and wanted to know if I made the right decision, or should I just do the carpool and ignore her if she complains?

what would you do?

Liba

Thu, Sep 02 2010, 12:00 pm

If it is a carpool the expectations are that everyone does their part.

If you carpooling with me and were frequently backing out, demanding chessed from me and not even appreciating it when it was done for you I would do my best to avoid doing carpool with you in the future.

It is highly likely that the other person has their reasons to back out too and is doing their best to fulfill their obligations none the less. If it was so easy for them to get out they would just drive their own child both ways and not try to make their life a bit easier by joining another family and splitting the driving.

Simple1

Thu, Sep 02 2010, 12:01 pm

I think the general rule is that if you can't do your turn you find someone who you can switch with. I do believe in chesed, but I don't think it applies to a carpool. Unless if someone was going through particularly trying circumstances ch"vsh or even maybe just the mother gave birth and is in the hospital etc., then maybe I would consider that chesed. The purpose of carpool is to make it easier for everyone involved and if someone is missing their turns regularly, it makes it harder for the others. Everyone's lives are busy.
I do hope you're able to work it out!

Simple1

Thu, Sep 02 2010, 12:05 pm

amother wrote:

About the bolded - do you not drive? I know a woman who doesn't drive so she would pay someone to do all her turns. Maybe that can work for you.

RachelEve14

Thu, Sep 02 2010, 12:14 pm

I think it's a bit of each. I'm in a carpool with someone, I take and she picks up. This week my other 2 kids didn't start gan yet, so I couldn't take in the morning (not enough seats). I was just going to start next week, but she insisted that if she was going to drive anyway (and had room for my kids), and pick up anyway (and had room), she was happy to take them. Same thing with me, sometimes she might be held up at work or whatever, and I will just pickup. We agreed in general if we know in advance we will switch off and "owe" each other, but things come up. There is a difference between every so often something coming up and needing help, and someone who is constantly backing out and leaving someone else to do all the driving.

mamommommy

Thu, Sep 02 2010, 12:47 pm

Carpool is not a chessed situation. People make up carpools not because they want to do chessed, but because they need something (namely rides for their kids) and they're willing to "pay" or barter for it by way of giving other kids rides in return. It's almost by definition a "tit for tat" situation.

No one should go into carpool expecting to regularly receive chessed from other people in the carpool unless it was set up that way from the start. I've been in a carpool where it was set up from the beginning that one mother had about half the number of turns as everyone else. Everyone was okay with that because we knew going in.

I would personally be very upset if someone regularly need to skipped their assigned turn and didn't offer to make it up. I know that it's near impossible for me to juggle my schedule, and my kids, and my other carpools to accommodate someone else when they can't do their assigned day, so I can only imagine that others in my carpool have the same problem.

I've also occasionally been in the situation where I couldn't drive my day, but I always offered to switch with someone (and gave as much advanced warning as possible and apologized profusely). Sometimes when that happened, I was able to switch and was expected to do a different day, and sometimes I was told "don't worry about it". It's always nice to hear the latter, but I would never expect it. And I certainly wouldn't blame someone for being annoyed with me for backing out of my assigned days (especially if I was doing it regularly).

BrachaC

Thu, Sep 02 2010, 2:10 pm

Carpool is definitely one of those situations where it is hard to always put your best foot forward. We did carpool for one year, and saw that it was just not for us. I expect kids to be respectful, well behaved and to understand that my time is valuable. I want my kids to be able to get in the car in a safe way and get to school on time. When those things were not happening I found it very frustrating. Now my husband drives my kids in the morning and they take a bus home. We are so thrilled that it works out for us and for them. You have to be self aware and know if you can handle carpool or not.

RachelB

Thu, Sep 02 2010, 2:17 pm

Carpool is not a chesed arrangement. I have room for 2 kids (besides mine) and carpool with 2 other mothers. When somebody occasionally asks me for a favor and I have room I will gladly help out. but I drive carpool so I don't have to go out 3 times a day to pick up 3 of my kids and can do 1 pick up a day instead.

Mommy3.5

Thu, Sep 02 2010, 3:28 pm

Carpool is not a chesed. In fact it is done because all parents have schedules, and when you cannot meet your obligation because of work conflicts, someone else may have the same issue. I need to know my kid will be picked up at x, and will be home at z. I work my schedule around my kids, and its the a huge tircha to have a last minute change. Bad planning on your part, does not constitute an emergency on my part.

Its also wrong to make me wait 10 minutes while your kid eats breakfast/gets dressed, because you thought he needed to sleep late. Its also wrong to come to the house at 9:15, when school started at 9. my time is just as important as yours. Its also wrong to pick the kids up 25 minutes early because you felt like it, and then complain when I am not home to greet you 25 minutes before you are scheduled to arrive. Oh, and threatening my kid is also not a good thing to do, even if he was misbehaving.

Anyway, my one year of carpool was such a nightmare, I never did it again. By the end of that year I was driving my kids to and from school, and still picking up the carpool 2 days a week.

busydev

Thu, Sep 02 2010, 3:51 pm

carpool is not a chesed- unless there is a reason for it (like new baby, hospital etc- as someone else said)

if you need to miss a day- you call other carpool members and make a switch (ill do your day next week if you do mine this week) try to call as much in advance as you can.

amother

Tue, Sep 06 2011, 12:07 pm

I just want to add now that we are on this topic (and this is why I'm anon-she is on this site) that I live in Jacksonville florida and this very lovely lady is doing me a CHESED and bringing my dd home from school for me, every single day! (and no we don't live near each other). THANK YOU SO MUCH!

Tue, Sep 06 2011, 12:33 pm

I don't mind driving other people's kids if it is on my way and I would be going there anyway. I have taken multiple children for afterschool activities on a regular basis without reciprocation, and that's fine with me.

I do mind if carpoolers cancel at the last minute, or forget and never apologize, or make my child late, or think carseats are optional.

So it isn't tit for tat, exactly, as much as being reliable and considerate of others.

amother

Tue, Sep 06 2011, 1:01 pm

Here's my problem with carpools. I did a carpool with someone. I drove one way, she drove the other, except there were times when school let out early and she couldn't pick up, so I did. Those days, I drove both ways. This happened several times and was not a problem for me. I could do it, so why not? Some days if I was going to be by the playgroup at pickup, I just called stam and said I could drive home that day because it wasn't any trouble. It was my pleasure.

But, during the year I got sick twice (once was me for two days and once by baby was in the hospital for four days). When I was sick, my DH drove carpool.

When my baby was in the hosptial, I asked carpool partner if she could find someone to drive. She told me no, it was my responsibility. So I made arrangements from the hospital room--between tehillim and making sure my baby wasn't spiking a fever or having labored breathing--for a friend to do my part of the driving. My carpool "partner" still said LH about me to the replacement about how irresponsible I was about missing carpool.

I am now VERY careful to only carpool with people I really trust and who I know have good middos.

Monsey Mama

Tue, Sep 06 2011, 2:51 pm

I find when I do carpool, I end up driving more often than my "fair share." I just opted out of a carpool explaining to DH that I was driving three times more than the other family. DH could not understand why I would not just take home the other families kids since I was going home anyway. I am a sahm for benefit of my family not my community. I don't feel free to run errands. I can't invite my children's friends to come in my car for a playdate. While the other children live close, it is still five minutes each way. The kids also rub each other wrong. This went on last year also. People will see how far they can push. BTW if someone was sick, had a baby, wanted a day off with spouse, I would still drive. I just don't want to be committed to a long term situation without near equal benefit to me.

morah

Tue, Sep 06 2011, 2:55 pm

I don't know much about carpool- I grew up in the city, my kid isn't old enough for school, and I don't have a license. However, from what I understand, the carpool system depends on the parents involved taking turns and contributing their fair share. Now, we all know that stuff happens, and there will be times where, even though Tuesday is your day to drive, you can't, so you beg and plead, switch to Wednesday or find some alternate arrangement for that day, and it's not the biggest deal in the world. Chessed may come in where there is an emergency, or maybe there were 5 times over the course of the year when you couldn't do your turn, and you made up for 4 of those times, maybe the others will let that one time slide instead of keeping an exact score sheet. But you can't miss your turn 5 times, make up for it once or twice, and expect to be off the hook for the rest. You can't be completely unreliable and expect everyone else to do "chessed" for you.

realeez

Tue, Sep 06 2011, 3:44 pm

It depends on the carpool - I have a carpool with another family and we stipulated at the beginning that this is for convenience only and we can cancel our day without making it up which works for both of us. It does help that we both live in the neighborhood of the school. I'm part of another carpool of 5 children where each mother does an afternoon home and it's more official that if someoen can't dO it, she finds another mother to trade with so it's even at the end. But when a mother had a baby, each mother took that mother's day each week so she had the next 4 weeks off.

Barbara

Tue, Sep 06 2011, 3:46 pm

Most people aren't sitting with their feet up on the coffee table, relaxing, during carpool time. If they're not driving to their son's school, they may be driving to their daughter's. Or that may be the day they schedule early meetings, or when their husband takes the car for his errands. One person not driving may mean rearranging multiple schedules.

Emergencies do happen, and whomever it was that was resentful of changes when a baby was hospitalized should be ashamed of herself. But unless the other people are well aware of conflicts in advance, one should never enter into a carpool if there are likely to be a large number of times one cannot drive.

amother

Tue, Sep 06 2011, 3:54 pm

Whenever people were unreasonable about carpools, my mother would remind me of the saying she first heard when she lived in Baltimore that you didn't truly know a person until you dealt with him "b'kiso (financially), b'ko'so (drunk), b'ka'aso (when he was angry), u'b'carpoolo."