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Underachiever



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alef22




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 03 2005, 11:38 am
My 8th grade daughter is not responsible when it comes to her schoolwork. A certain teacher came to me today to say she has done enough as a teacher and we need to be on top of her at home. How do I motivate my daughter? I avoid being very strict with her because it becomes such an unpleasant scene.
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gryp




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 03 2005, 12:00 pm
I have heard this scenario so many times before. please dont take what I am about to say as insulting because im just asking to compare your story to others ive heard.

is your daughter irresponsible only about schoolwork or in other areas too? has she always been this way or did it just start? if it just started, what has changed recently that may be causing it? if she has always been this way, it is obviously time for her to take responsibility for her schoolwork. do you think it is a lack of motivation and interest for school only, or does it come in other areas?

what does your daughter enjoy doing? this may be the key to motivating her towards schoolwork and towards other responsibilities.
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alef22




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 03 2005, 12:31 pm
I take no offense at your reply--you were very caring. You are also on target in that she is not responsible in any area with consistency. It is not a new problem at all. I am getting anxious as next year she will have to handle Bais Yaacov and the work load is much greater.
We have tried to encourage her in areas of interest--
In general she is not the happiest camper--I know I should build on the positives. Yet I feel so embarassed when the school (which my husband is a MAJOR part of) sees how no approach with her is kept up. She has resisted therapy to see why there is this whole pattern of behavior. How do you force (or should you) a 13 year old to really change?
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ForeverYoung

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Post Thu, Mar 03 2005, 12:45 pm
It is hard to help w/out details, but
I think there needs to be consistency in her life as well as consistent consequences.

the consequences need to take place regularly

(no h/work - no friends over;
room messy - no going out, etc

the consequences should be logical & enforced even if inconvenient to u.

Also she should be involved & responcible for improvement.
Ask her why? what should be one to change?
How can u help her?

this is very iportant, as if she wil not learn these skills now, she will suffer in adulthood, especially when running her own home.

U might want to considerr a consultation w/ a professional
(whicj your daughter doesn't need to know about)

hope this helps
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gryp




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 03 2005, 12:55 pm
Quote:
I take no offense at your reply--you were very caring.
Thanx- im so glad you didnt take offense. I know very well that a simple written sentence can be read different ways.

I'm just curious, why did you title this thread "Underachiever?" do you feel she is not working up to her potential and could be doing better? has she been consistently working on this same level throughout elementary, and maybe this really is her potential?

I know very well that 13 year olds can be tough, to talk to, to deal with, they have attitudes,... it is a very hard stage of life.

lets build on positives: what is she good at? how is she talented? what does she enjoy doing? what are her interest? lets point them out because if she is going to be learn responsibility in anything, it will first happen in areas she enjoys because she wont need any extra motivation there!

I hear you feel embarrassed, I would too if it was my daughter doing something I wish she didnt, but please please try not to be embarrassed of her. Try with all of your love for her to be proud of her for all the things she does do. I am sure you can think of these things. because the worst thing for a daughter to feel is that her mother is embarrassed of her, and although we think we hide it well, it trickles down and she could feel it in some ways. it will have the exact opposite effect that youre looking for in her...

personally I dont recommend forcing someone into therapy, although some might disagree with me.
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ForeverYoung

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Post Thu, Mar 03 2005, 1:25 pm
forcing into therapy will not help, as if one resists therapy, it will not be productive at all
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hisorerus




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 03 2005, 8:19 pm
I'm like your daughter- inconsistent, sometimes completely unmotivated, etc.

I agree that she should not be put into therapy. She doesn't BELONG in therapy, because there is nothing wrong with her. This is a very typical personality type.

Some ways I've found of dealing with myself when I get impossible:

1) RESIST PERFECTIONISM! Get the job done, even a bad job. Practice doing it a few times; working less than I would like and giving myself credit for just having finished.

2) Why am I procrastinating? Is it because I'm afraid to fail? (see #1) Because I'm not sure how to do it? (ask someone to walk me through it the first time) Because it's boring? (only do it for 15 minutes)

3) Put on some music to put myself in a good mood, eat a healthy supper, do 10 jumping jacks, THEN sit down and deal with my tasks.

4) Make To Do Lists. Yes, they change style every few weeks, that's part of being myself. I'm consistently inconsistent.

5) Have a clean, organized place (preferably not organized by me, because I can't manage to keep it neat) to use as my "home base." One corner of cleanliness can give me the energy to attack the whole house, or at least give me a place where I can work.

Love her, and accept that her greatest talents may not be in being a stupendous student. She may have gifts that are more useful out of the rigid school setting.
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Tefila




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 03 2005, 11:56 pm
Hisorerus wow that takes guts to say what you have just said. Thumbs up to you!

Atchually I don't like to view any kid as an underacheiver yes they may need help in certain areas but no child is an underachiever etc. Exclamation They are very special and just need help to bring out in an obvious way that specialness. Once we know that even in our subconcious we will do as parents all we can to help them! Wink
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hadasa




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Mar 04 2005, 5:05 am
Hisorerus - I could almost have written that!!!

alef - I was also like that, and if it's any consolation, I suddenly picked up somewhat in eleventh grade, and I did grow up to be a reasonably responsible and capable adult, though still helplessly disorganized in certain aspects. I see my daughter now following the same pattern. She's only in second grade, and she consistently(!) leaves in school something crucial to her homework - whether it's the reader, the notebook, the assignment book.... I'm trying to figure out what to do so it doesn't grow into a bigger problem as she gets older.

Actually I wish somebody had cared enough to consider therapy when I was a child. Because if your daughter is anything like I was, punishing is NOT the solution. What she needs is to learn ways and methods to deal with her difficulties in taking responsibiliy. And the only way she can learn is if she is convinced that you truly care about her and understand her.

Freilich - an underachiever is not one who is less successful than others in her class. It is someone who, with the proper help and guidance, can be much more successful than she currently is.
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Tefila




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Mar 04 2005, 6:06 am
Quote:
an underachiever is not one who is less successful than others in her class. It is someone who, with the proper help and guidance, can be much more successful than she currently is


.Oh alright Hadasa, but in certain places it means that.
So thanks for informing me otherwise! Thumbs Up
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gryp




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Mar 04 2005, 8:01 am
alef22- this is what I would try if I was in your situation. again, I dont know your exact situation, so im just suggesting things from other stories ive heard and my own ideas of what I would try to do with one of my children:
(if it applies, take it, if not, leave it...)

1) I see very often that when parents say "my child isnt motivated in schoolwork," one big part of the lack of motivation on the part of the child is because he picks up the same attitude from his parent about his own schoolwork. he says to himself: "my parents dont care about my schoolwork, why should I?" this doesnt mean that they dont push him and urge him through his homework, but in general, theyre not interested in what he's learning in the different subjects. a big step is to start asking, "what did you learn in chumash today?" "what did your teacher say about_____" etc. its not enough to only say things like "is your homework done yet?" "how come you got a 75 on your test?" "maybe we should get a tutor to help you...." these questions are not enough, there has to be a real interest in the child's schoolwork.

Some children are motivated enough on their own and dont necessarily need so much interest, but if you want to "light a fire under them so they start moving" this is the first step I would take.

2) I hear the lack of responsibility is in many areas, not just schoolwork. I would make a list of things she is responsible for on a day to day basis, ie. to wake up at a certain time, to make her bed, to go to school at a certain time, to have her homework done, a certain chore around the house, etc. whatever you feel she should be responsible to do for herself in school and around the house. with each responsibility comes a consequence if not done, and a reward if responsible about it. (big ones for big responsibilites like schoolwork, small ones for responsibilities that arent too tough for her.) you can think of a few consequences and rewards and let her also think of a few, and match them with her to the appropriate responsibility. ie. if her room is clean, she can have friends over, if not she cant. if her homework is done, she can do ______, if not, not.
about the homework being done, is she responsible to bring home the books she needs from school, to write down her homework in school so she doesnt forget what it is when she gets home? does she always have the supplies she needs? are her binders and folders a messy nightmare, or are they organized and neat? these things certain children need to be TAUGHT HOW TO DO, and if theyre never taught, they will have no idea how to do it, and cant be expected to do it and it leads to irresponsibility in homework. I needed teaching in this area and thank Hashem my 5th grade teacher taught me. so if this is the problem, TEACH her!
Does she complain that you nag her too much about certain responsibilities? you can make up with her that as long as she is doing what she is supposed to, you will only give her 2 reminders a day- that means not even one for each responsibility, and if you by mistake remind her more that twice, then each time you remind her extra you will give her ______(something small you would hate to give up and she would love to have, ie. $1.00, an extra hour before she has to be in bed, something like that. im not thrilled about using money but it works Very Happy )

As ForeverYoung said before, these consequences and rewards have to be absolutely consistent. you have to be ready to be firm about it, no ifs, ands, or buts. even if its inconvenient to yourself (!) because once she finds a loophole to get around things she will do what she wants and not what you want her to do.

You have to make her realize that just like it is the parents responsibility to go to work, earn money, take care of the kids, pay the bills, buy the food, etc. it is the CHILD's responsibility, to wake up on time, go to school, do homework, help around the house, etc. Just like the parents have a JOB to do, she also has a JOB. there is no getting around it.

To make this all sweet and pleasant, and to help open lines of communication between you and your daughter, I suggest to take her out on a special trip once a week, or at the very least once every other week. go somewhere special where you both enjoy- it doesnt have to be something big, for an ice cream together, to a special place,... whatever fits the place you live, and your budget. but it has to be someplace special, and I dont suggest you talk about her responsibility list unless she brings up the topic, talk about pleasant things, share with her your own interesting childhood stories, let her talk a lot about things she likes to talk about. ask her about her friends in school because thats who shes with most of the day, and its good to keep an eye on these things anyway, especially at the stage of entering high school.

on one last note, I know what it is like to be a procrastinator. I had this problem until one day I heard a professional say this on the radio and myproblem was solved forever!: "People who are always leaving things for the last minute and in the end dont get them done, it is because they dont realize how long each thing will take them. They think they have enough time but they really dont, because their concept of time is misconstrued. The way to solve this, is one day when not especially busy, time yourself and see how long each chore really takes. It will take surprisingly longer than you think. For the rest of your life you will realize that you need more time that you feel you need and you will stop leaving things for the very last minute!"

I hope this helps.
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alef22




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 07 2005, 11:50 am
I don't know where to begin to thank all of you for all the caring, positive suggestions. There is no question that an approach focused on a child's personality type and strengths is the way to go. I wish the school would back off the pressure on us and recognize we are trying to address the whole neshoma--not just trying to get our daughter to "get with the system" at school. Some children are going to work better in the way school is set up and some just won't. The issue of responsibility is a real one--she does need to learn that there are many things in life that don't meld perfectly with one's disposition and you have to do them anyway.
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ForeverYoung

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Post Wed, Mar 09 2005, 10:15 am
Alef, why not talk this over w/ your husband, a specilist, if u choose to use one, & may be your daughter.

when u have a plan of action, contact the school & request their cooperation.

write everything down - roles, expectations, responcibilities.
U keep a copy of everything & re-evalate weekly.

It will involve lots of effort, but IY'H it will pay off!!
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