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Forum
-> Judaism
-> Halachic Questions and Discussions
amother
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 8:10 am
DH and I were arguing about this.... is a firstborn son still considered the bechor if his mother suffered a miscarriage or stillbirth before he was born? Obviously, he would not have a pidyon haben, but would he still be considered a firstborn? AFAIK, a boy born by C-section doesn't get a pidyon haben either, but he would still be considered a bechor if he was the first child.
DH doesn't want to ask his rov about it.
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grace413
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 8:18 am
While I'm frequently the last to say ask a Rav, I don't know what other options you have here. Without even pretending to give a psak, I think a child born after a full term stillbirth is not a bechor and regarding a miscarriage I believe it may depend on how far along the pregnancy was.
Is this a question that has practical implications for you at this time?
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Lady Godiva
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 8:21 am
I think that if a woman had a miscarriage very early in the pregnancy then the couple still makes a pidyon haben.
I'm not sure how far into the pregnancy that is. This is definitely the type of question to ask a Rabbi!
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amother
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 8:29 am
My oldest was born after a 16 wk m/c. No pidyon haven but still considered a first born in terms of fast of first-born before pesach. Not sure if that is what your asking about specifically or where else the issue of being first born comes into play.
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amother
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 8:31 am
my mil lost her first baby within a few hours of birth, and got a psak from a gadol that my dh is the bechor.
not saying this is across the board psak, but it obviously does exist.
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amother
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 8:49 am
My brother had pidyon haben in his late forties after it was discovered that my mother had a very early miscarriage (around 8 weeks)
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amother
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 8:57 am
I lost two pregnancies, both during the 1st tri., and were told that IYH with this baby we will be able to have a pidyon haben. I think the 2nd one only 'didn't count' because it was a blighted ovum, there was no fetus at all. It's about the size and age of the fetus, afaik.
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Hashem_Yaazor
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 9:36 am
Pidyon Haben goes after the mother's first baby, while the rest of the halachos of a bechor go by his status as his father's child, and therefore there is no slam dunk correlation between the 2.
Besides for fasting, it also comes into play about yerusha...
I have definitely heard piskei halacha where someone who was ineligible for a pidyon haben was the bechor (and vice versa -- when it was the father's not first child but the mother's), so it's something that must be asked. It's not a shaila to feel any shame about when asking.
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Tova
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 11:57 am
My husband was once the Cohen at a pidyon haben where the mother had a previous miscarriage and it was paskined based on the exact situation that a pidyon was needed but should be done in a quiet minimal way. The father of the baby was in our kollel, so on that day during bein hasedarim they gathered a minyan in the corner of the room, did the pidyon, and passed out some pastries. I'm not even sure the female relatives were present.
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DrMom
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 12:09 pm
I learned the way Hashem_Yaazor did.
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Shuly
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 1:37 pm
I had a miscarriage before my bechor was born. My miscarriage was at 10 weeks, but the fetus measured 7 weeks. Our Rav paskened that we should have a pidyon haben and mentioned that if the fetus would have measured 10 weeks, we would also have one, but without a bracha.
Since each situation is unique, you really have to ask.
If your DH doesn't want to ask a rav, you can call by yourself.
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clowny
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 1:47 pm
I recently heard about a first born son but a second child who had a pidyan haben bec his older sister was born via c section so that makes him a bechor. My question is- if the first born would also be a boy, who is the bechor??
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Hashem_Yaazor
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 1:55 pm
That doesn't make much sense to this uneducated mind, clowny. C-section does not invalidate one's existence as a bechor of the father. It just doesn't make one the first fruit of the womb or whatever of the mother for pidyon haben...
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Leahh
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Thu, Feb 20 2014, 2:37 pm
clowny wrote: | I recently heard about a first born son but a second child who had a pidyan haben bec his older sister was born via c section so that makes him a bechor. My question is- if the first born would also be a boy, who is the bechor?? |
That is very interesting and would like to hear a source or rav if possible. I had a girl via csection then a boy naturally. A pidyon haben wouldn't apply to me anyway because we are not yisroel but I am curious about this.
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