Shiva for baby, is there anything to say or do I just sit?

amother

Fri, Mar 07 2014, 10:28 am

A good friend lost a baby and is sitting shiva. The baby was very young and I never met them. Is there anything to say when I go pay a shiva call or do I just go an sit quietly. I've never paid a shiva call in this type of situation before and I don't want to cause them any more pain.
I am also bringing over a meal. Should I write a note?

amother

Fri, Mar 07 2014, 11:33 am

I don't see why it's different then being menachem avel for anyone else. I don't always know the niftar so I always just sit and follow the lead of the person sitting Shiva. Whatever they talk about that's what you talk about. You tell them you are there for them if they need anything or you can offer to be there for them after to see if they need anything but who was niftar or how old the person really doesn't matter.

amother

Fri, Mar 07 2014, 12:56 pm

The MISS Foundation is a great collection of resources for families who have found themselves in this horrible situation. They also have a good list of "what not to say" that you may find helpful. What Not to Say

It's a very powerful thing to be able to convey to your friend -- either in words, in a letter, or simply by your presence -- that you honor the life of her child and you are there to listen without judging and help however is needed.

amother

Fri, Mar 07 2014, 1:11 pm

I had a relative who lost a young child.

-They did not appreciate the explanations that people tried to offer during the shiva (she was so lucky she fulfilled her tafkid at such a young age etc)

-They appreciated every person who made an effort to come, especially if they travelled a distance to do so.

-They appreciated hearing peoples stories about their daughter.

-They appreciated when visitors did not stay too long, nor come too late. There can be a rubbernecking element in these kinds of shivas, and it can be overwhelming to the mourners.

-They appreciated people who continued to call after the shiva was over.

-It upsets them that in the years since, many people are uncomfortable talking about their daughter. They want to feel like her life meant something.

That was their experience that they shared with me. I'm sure others feel differently, so do what has been repeated here, follow the mourners lead.

May you and the rest of us know of no more sorrow.

grace413

Sat, Mar 08 2014, 12:42 pm

amother wrote:

I don't see why it's different then being menachem avel for anyone else.who was niftar or how old the person really doesn't matter.

OP, just go and sit and follow the lead of the people sitting shiva.

Quoted amother: I strongly disagree with you.

There is a great deal of difference in shiva for a baby or a young person who died and a person who died in old age. There is a major difference in children sitting shiva for their parents and parent sitting shiva for their children.

Marion

Sat, Mar 08 2014, 1:10 pm

grace413 wrote:

Grace, I think she means the halachot are the same. At ANY beit evel you are supposed to just go and sit until the avelim open the conversation. You are not supposed to speak until spoken to.

Isramom8

Sat, Mar 08 2014, 2:28 pm

There are shivas and there are shivas.

There are shivas where the aveilim are basically functional. They are sad but they want to talk.

Then there are shivas where the aveilim are in a state of utter shock and despair and can barely raise their heads to make eye contact with anyone.

The shivas I have been to where the latter was the case were:

1. The father died suddenly of a heart attack. He was a doctor and tried to instruct his teenage son in saving him but that failed. The son was one of the people sitting shiva.

2. A case of SIDS.

In cases like this there is NOTHING to say. Sit for a while and then LEAVE. With my neighbor who lost her baby to SIDS, I put a note in her hand that offered specific acts of help and my phone number. She told me later that she appreciated that.

mha3484

Sat, Mar 08 2014, 8:57 pm

amother wrote:

From someone who has been there I can not just click like on this post.

amother

Sat, Mar 08 2014, 9:03 pm

Marion wrote:

Grace, I think she means the halachot are the same. At ANY beit evel you are supposed to just go and sit until the avelim open the conversation. You are not supposed to speak until spoken to.

OP here, my question was not about halacha. I know that I can't initiate conversation but in this case I feel like there's nothing to see even after the avel speaks because the child was so young. There are NO stories to tell, no memories for anyone.

Isramom8

Sun, Mar 09 2014, 1:04 am

amother wrote:

If the aveilim do want to talk, you can certainly help move the conversation along. There is a lot to say even about the youngest baby. If you say, "She was so sweet" then the mother and family members can elaborate. "She looked a bit like (insert name)", "She was a feisty girl", "She was such a calm girl", 'She loved looking at lights and stars", "She loved going outside in nature", "I remember the time she smiled at me", etc.