Sharing news of a deceased relative on Shabbat

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Forum -> Yom Tov / Holidays -> Shabbos, Rosh Chodesh, Fast Days, and other Days of Note

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chaos

Fri, Apr 04 2014, 5:39 pm

I am in the USA, where it is not yet Shabbat. DH is in Israel where it is Shabbat now. I have just learned that DH's grandmother died this afternoon. Given that it is Shabbat in DH's timezone, what is the best way to tell DH the news of his grandmother's passing?

I should note that DH is spending Shabbat with a family, not all of the members of who keep Shabbat so if I were to call now, there is a good chance that someone will answer the phone, even given that it is so late in Israel now. I just don't know if it is a) halachically permissible to call or b) a good idea.

pesek zman

Fri, Apr 04 2014, 5:48 pm

Absolutely no reason to. Let him enjoy his Shabbos and call when it is over for him.

ROFL

Fri, Apr 04 2014, 5:48 pm

Does he have a cell phone, leave him a message. A freind of mine was in Israel when his dad died in the US. He was left a message so that he knew when it was motzei Shabbat there.

amother

Fri, Apr 04 2014, 5:53 pm

ROFL wrote:

Does he have a cell phone, leave him a message. A freind of mine was in Israel when his dad died in the US. He was left a message so that he knew when it was motzei Shabbat there.

Your friend learned of his father's death by a voice mail? Ouch!

ROFL

Fri, Apr 04 2014, 6:00 pm

He was able to make arrangements. While it was stil Shabbat in the us

chaos

Fri, Apr 04 2014, 6:01 pm

By the time it is Motzei Shabbat in Israel, it'll still be Shabbat for me. When it's Motzei Shabbat for me, it'll be really early in the morning for him and I'm not sure I would be able to reach him because he turns his cell phone off when he goes to bed.

I could leave a voicemail or send him an email. I feel bad that he should have to receive the news via voicemail/email and not be able to talk to me when he first gets it, but it seems that's the best option. Appreciate the input.

greenfire

Fri, Apr 04 2014, 7:20 pm

it's hard to hear something on shabbos on the one hand - on the other hand it should be heard asap

I think hearing a real voice is the best way ... would he be flying back for the funeral ? if not - then wait till motzei shabbos to call

sorry for the loss Hug

nyer1

Sat, Apr 05 2014, 8:50 pm

My great aunt had passed away erev rosh hashana. We were extremely close. Our family rav told my mother not to tell us until after yom tov

busydev

Sat, Apr 05 2014, 10:15 pm

its obv to late now, but I would have left a voice mail by someone in e"y who can give the news after shabbos.

a friend of mine was in seminary when her father passed away. erev shavuos they knew he was not doing well. he passed away around shkia on the first night of shavuos. motzei shavuos her sister, who lived in e"y and only kept one day, called the hospital in the us and found out that he was niftar. she did not tell her sister (even tho she saw her on y"t) until after the second day, since you cant mourn on y"t, but how exactly are u supposed to not mourn?
im sorry for your/dh's loss.

seeker

Sat, Apr 05 2014, 11:16 pm

ROFL wrote:

He was able to make arrangements. While it was stil Shabbat in the us

You could leave a voice mail with a friend/relative in Israel asking them to break the news in person when they get the message after Shabbos.

shalhevet

Sun, Apr 06 2014, 3:15 am

Why is there this rush to share bad news, lo aleinu? I was taught that even during the week, and certainly on Shabbos, we shouldn't tell people that someone is niftar directly. I am assuming that someone doesn't need to know for a practical reason like booking flights for a funeral.

I know it's too late for the OP, but really, what would happen if he only found out a couple of days later?

seeker

Sun, Apr 06 2014, 3:21 am

shalhevet wrote:

I'm assuming that most people rush precisely because it would affect funeral arrangements and such. Otherwise, you're right, most aren't so eager. Unless the person was very anxious and would possibly prefer to know instead of worrying whether or not it happened yet. Sometimes when you know it's coming it's actually a relief. I don't even feel guilty saying that because I'm sure anyone who's been through the stress of being close to someone who is clearly close to the end and in pain can relate. Sometimes even grief is better than that no-man's-land of waiting for it.

Also, in the case of the time difference, maybe you want to pre-empt them getting a shock by finding out the wrong way. Let's say a person passes away Friday when Shabbos just started in Israel. It's still about 7 hours until Shabbos in NY, plenty of time for, say, community announcement emails or Misaskim notices or whatever to go around with information about the funeral or stuff. Then Shabbos ends in Israel. If you haven't left the relative in Israel a personal message either on their phone or with a good friend, they now have 7 hours until Shabbos ends in NY, and probably more time because you're waiting for morning in Israel so as not to shock them at 3AM, there is a good chance they'll hear through the grapevine and it will be at minimum awkward and possibly worse.

Mama Bear

Sun, Apr 06 2014, 10:40 am

14 years ago, my husband's grandfather collapsed while in Europe visiting kivrei avos. it was on a wednesday. My mother in law made arrangements to fly to Europe on Sunday. Motzei shabbos my husband walked in to the house and told me his grandfather had passed away Friday, right before the zman. (I'm not sure how the message got to his father, as it was Shabbos in Europe already, but I supposed they had a non Jew call my father in law). I'm amazed that my father in law and husband managed to keep this information to themselves all shabbos. My MIL didnt know til Motzei shabbos either.

6 years ago, my grandmother passed away on a Friday morning. My father was in antwerp at the time. We called him and tried to hint to him that things were bad, but he didnt catch on. So we decided it was better for him to have a relaxed shabbos and not know. on Motzei Shabbos someone in Antwerp during a big event approached him & asked him, "Arent you not supposed to hear music now?" My father realized that something must have happened and he hid in his hotel room until and did not talk to anyone until after the flight - he didnt even call home - because if he'd have found out the truth, he'd have had to sit shivah in his hotel and may have even been stuck in Europe. He only found out after he landed and my brother told him. It was horrible Sad

.

I don't know why I'm telling these stories, honestly.

ROFL

Sun, Apr 06 2014, 8:44 pm

If someone will have to sit shiva why tell them a day or so later. Their shiva will be prolonged. T
If one will be in aveliut, better sooner than later.

Mama Bear

Sun, Apr 06 2014, 9:46 pm

He didnt have to sit shiva longer, he was allowed to get up with the rest of his family.
he wouldve had a problem with traveling if he'd have had to sit down in the hotel.

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