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DH thinks I am OCD about cleaning help
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Dolly Welsh




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, May 25 2014, 7:16 pm
Actually, you ARE a bit hard on yourself.

Raised all those nice kids and giving yourself a B minus for the house.

Hmm.
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zaq




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, May 25 2014, 8:16 pm
Well, OP, I haven't seen your house, but maybe your dh has a point. maybe you are in fact a little OCD about cleanliness and order. I must say that in a household comprised of 2 adults, 9-5 cleaning help every day for a month before Pesach sounds a bit excessive. When you find yourself telling a housecleaner to take a razor blade to pinhead-size spatters of paint on your bathroom tile, or to use iodine to cover up scratches on the underside of your dining table, you've gone off the deep end and should spend some of that housecleaning money on therapy.

OTOH your children are adults with their own lives and should not be depending on you for handouts. If you really want to spend your money on overly-scrupulous cleaning, that's your business. You're not depriving your children of anything to which they have a right.
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SRS




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, May 25 2014, 8:52 pm
amother wrote:
Quote:
How did you manage when the kids were little?
I totally did not. No, that's not true. If I had help twice a week I could kind of keep it together for the days in between. DH also helped when the kids were younger, as he had fewer other responsibilities then.

But also when you have little kids you can have lower standards. As DH says, nobody lives here now (except when they visit! And make a mess! And leave it!).


You still have little kids around! As my mother has aged, she has become more intense about her clean (never had help and still doesn't), but no one is bring kids over as we all live far, so things stay pretty clean except where my father piles his books and notes.

Perhaps it is time to tell the kids, look, I can't handle a mess and you are going to have to clean it up or I will go bananas. I tell my messy kids that all the time and don't feel a bit bad about it and they aren't near grown.

If you really feel like you can't manage it, maybe you arrange their visits and the cleaning help at the same time. But your house should stay reasonably clean when no kids are there. So I'm thinking there is an element of your own nervousness mixed in with a husband who doesn't see the mess that you see. But I'm thinking he is on to something and it is more than Mars/Venus.
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d l




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, May 25 2014, 8:52 pm
Everything sounds totally normal to me.

You stress about the house being messy and no cleaner- VERY NORMAL- I do it all the time Smile and I'm sure many others do too.

Your husband stresses about you stressing to him- VERY NORMAL- many men can not handle hearing all the gibberish from their wives and have no clue how to respond correctly.

You have a lot of cleaning help - VERY NORMAL- good for you. And you even pay for it from your salary- now that has me very impressed.

You and your husband are both completely in the range of normal. He is allowed to think you are OCD- it's totally not a problem. As long as he doesn't outlaw the cleaning help- he is amazing!

My happiest day is when the cleaning lady comes- of course my husband doesn't understand, he just sees all this waste of $$$ while she is here wasting many hours. I see it as someone else cleaning my house, doing my laundry, helping me make dinner, etc- I am smiling just thinking of it!!

I really hope your new cleaning help turns out good!
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SRS




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, May 25 2014, 8:55 pm
zaq wrote:

OTOH your children are adults with their own lives and should not be depending on you for handouts. If you really want to spend your money on overly-scrupulous cleaning, that's your business. You're not depriving your children of anything to which they have a right.


100%. But I do wonder if your husband is pushing for more support for the kids is there a reason for that or is he trying to say that the cleaning help is costing too much for you as a couple. What is his real underlying concern? I've learned from imamother that just being upfront is a rare quality and I've seen families in real life say they want the money for something when they are concerned about something else.
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amother


 

Post Sun, May 25 2014, 9:52 pm
zaq wrote:
Well, OP, I haven't seen your house, but maybe your dh has a point. maybe you are in fact a little OCD about cleanliness and order. I must say that in a household comprised of 2 adults, 9-5 cleaning help every day for a month before Pesach sounds a bit excessive. When you find yourself telling a housecleaner to take a razor blade to pinhead-size spatters of paint on your bathroom tile, or to use iodine to cover up scratches on the underside of your dining table, you've gone off the deep end and should spend some of that housecleaning money on.


To be honest op you do sound a little OCD about cleaning to me. Maybe I'm just not so clean but I can't imagine what cleaning help does in one house 9-5 for a whole month....
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Learning




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, May 25 2014, 10:08 pm
amother wrote:
To be honest op you do sound a little OCD about cleaning to me. Maybe I'm just not so clean but I can't imagine what cleaning help does in one house 9-5 for a whole month....

I agree. Also why is the fact that people walk through the house make so much mess? They only walk on the floor and I'm sure they don't have muddy Boots. But regardless of that if you are not healthy enough to clean you do need a lot of cleaning help. Just get the help and be happy that you can afford it.
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amother


 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 11:27 am
Quote:
But I'm thinking he is on to something and it is more than Mars/Venus.
No, no, my friends. Seriously, I know what OCD looks like (try my Mom who, if a piece of clothing was within 5 inches of the floor, it went straight into the wash! Which was maybe not her fault after a couple of episodes of boils. Which she attributes to the need for hospital sanitation, while I see it as her being BOILING mad about something that she suppressed.)!

I just want normal neat, shoes not sticking to floor etc. Dishes washed & put away daily. Laundry eventually being ironed & in drawers.

Pillows on the couch, not on the floor (which is hard to take care of myself with a bad back, but I am going to work on squatting, but only if DH is home to pick me up if I can't get up myself!). And don't say get rid of the pillows, I need 'em for my back!

Oh, and I have cushions on the wooden kitchen chairs (see above). But when the kids leave they are ALL. On. The. Floor. (Tying them on does not work, the ties rip. I guess I could try sewing on bungee cords, right?)

As for the people walking through, it's not their muddy boots. It's that they have to see exactly how many dishes are on the counter/in the sink. Why is my kitchen organization or lack thereof any of their business?

As to pre-Pesach, don't forget, that includes all normal housekeeping, laundry, cleaning many bedrooms & toys for Pesach etc. And then, a week before, cleaning up after my mad cook who thinks she has to cook for all her married sibs. She should be gebentched. But somebody has to sweep up all the potato peels, wash the mixer, the floor etc.
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JoyInTheMorning




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 11:58 am
You have a cook and a cleaning lady? Wow. I have no help (and I work way more than full time). But I should have help. It's much more efficient. Read this article about how we should outsource much of our lives: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11......html

You are doing things the right way.
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blini




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 2:25 pm
I am in total agreement with Joy. You are doing things the right way. Life shouldn't be the misery Olympics. I do things from scratch, but it's because we don't have the money. You have it; you earned it. Spend it as you see fit.
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mummiedearest




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 2:26 pm
op, continue getting the help. also, put your foot down. your grandkids have to follow the rules of grandma's house: cushions stay on the chairs. drinks stay in cups. toys get put away as soon as you're finished with them. food stays at the table. make a sign and hang it up on the fridge. anyone caught disobeying the rules has to write you letters via snail mail every day for a week (which they will likely enjoy anyway, but they don't have to know that). inform your kids that you expect discipline in your home. and if they don't come as often for shabbos, have family get togethers. go to their houses.

now, about squatting: don't try it, even with dh there to pick you up. you need one of these:

http://www.amazon.com/Unger-92.....abber

that was a random sample, pick one you feel is good for you. I used one of those to pick up after my kids when I was pregnant with my youngest. it's much easier than bending over. in fact, get an extra one for your grandkids to use. my kids loved cleaning up with it.
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SRS




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 2:39 pm
OP, do you actually have the money for this or is it cutting into your future? Still sounds like a lot of help.

How often are the grandchildren over? Daily? Weekly? Monthly? Just tell your children what the new rules are. It is a good lesson for everyone to understand that the way to serve you is to keep the place in a presentable condition.
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amother


 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 2:54 pm
Quote:
my mad cook who thinks she has to cook for all her married sibs

Quote:
You have a cook and a cleaning lady?
No, I have a mad teenager who thinks that if she doesn't cook for her siblings they won't survive. (Guess who pays for the ingredients? And the cleaning lady to clean up after her?)

See, I don't mind helping out my kids. I am glad to do what I can. But my "cook", as you call her, is not in my employ. She is an independent, unpaid, costly child who does what she wants (consult Mom for menu approval? Not likely!)

BH these are my problems. I don't mean to complain. It's just the mess that gets to me....Oh, today DD tried to explain to me what the cleaning lady is supposed to do (as in, clean up her pots and dishes and utensils.)

Um, no. I hired her. I pay her. I want her to clean what I want her to clean. And, I will gladly buy take-out food for YT not to have this mess.

But, this is very difficult to enforce.

The good news is, my back feels much better. Probably since last night when I found out the cleaning lady was coming.
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Learning




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 3:03 pm
It's all good. Enjoy your enthusiastic dd and your cute grand kids. If you don't want dh visitors to see the kitchen get a door or a curtain. You have kids over all the time it has to be messy. I'm sure the visitors don't hold the dishes in the sink against you.
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The Happy Wife




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 3:11 pm
If you have a teenage daughter at home, she should be helping out with stuff around the house.
If she's old enough to cook, she's old enough to clean up after herself. She could also be helping to put dishes away, pick up cushions, and even some heavier cleaning. She should not be expecting cleaning help to do everything (or anything) for her.
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mummiedearest




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 3:24 pm
amother wrote:
Quote:
my mad cook who thinks she has to cook for all her married sibs

Quote:
You have a cook and a cleaning lady?
No, I have a mad teenager who thinks that if she doesn't cook for her siblings they won't survive. (Guess who pays for the ingredients? And the cleaning lady to clean up after her?)

See, I don't mind helping out my kids. I am glad to do what I can. But my "cook", as you call her, is not in my employ. She is an independent, unpaid, costly child who does what she wants (consult Mom for menu approval? Not likely!)

BH these are my problems. I don't mean to complain. It's just the mess that gets to me....Oh, today DD tried to explain to me what the cleaning lady is supposed to do (as in, clean up her pots and dishes and utensils.)

Um, no. I hired her. I pay her. I want her to clean what I want her to clean. And, I will gladly buy take-out food for YT not to have this mess.

But, this is very difficult to enforce.

The good news is, my back feels much better. Probably since last night when I found out the cleaning lady was coming.


your mad teenager needs some serious rules:

1) you cook, you clean it up. all of it. if you think the cleaning lady should clean up after you, you pay her for those hours. no ifs, ands, or buts.

2) your sibs are capable of cooking. if you want to cook for them, do so on your own dime. the sibs already get $x/month from us. that is what we budgeted for. if you feel they need more, use your own money towards tzedaka for them. taking random ingredients from the pantry without consulting mom/dad on this is not ok. that food is meant for the occupants of this household. if your sibs need more than their own salary + our contribution, they can come discuss it with us. we will help them create a financial plan. we will not baby them.

3) since you are feeling so magnanimous, start helping your own mother. chessed needs to start at home. mom can't do all this cleaning. instead of cooking for sibs who should be independent, clean up the house you live in. this is helpful to mom, and it is appropriate. living in a house means taking part in its day to day upkeep. this is what family members who live in the same household do for each other.

difficult to enforce is not a good excuse, op. your cleaning help is just fine, but letting your teenager do this is not. this is one thing that constant cleaning help does for kids: it teaches them that others clean, kids don't. I have nieces who will take a toy broom and say, "I'm the cleaning lady!" they don't realize that people clean up their own homes. if my house happens to be orderly when they come over, they ask if I had a cleaning lady come today. a cleaning lady cleans their rooms for them, etc. kids who grow up with no home responsibilities are set up for difficulties once they're on their own. it's ok to have the help with home maintenance, but the kids need this area of chinuch.

btw, does this teen also cook for you and dh? I hope so.
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SRS




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 3:24 pm
Each time we get deeper, we get more insight. Sounds like you have a boundaries problem. Yeah, we all have those. But, seriously, get your teenage daughter cook to understand what she is can and cannot do in your home.

And since it seems like everyone feels married children need support, what's up with that.

**Dad pays rent and tuition and wants Mom's salary to go towards more support and less cleaning help.
**Mom has them over more than she can handle and isn't insisting on some standards.
**Teenager daughter cooks for them because she things they won't survive.

Really, what is going on?
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amother


 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 3:56 pm
Don't compromise on your cleaning help. It keeps you sane. Do with out a new Sheitel, clothes, shoes, eating out, vacation, etc,but keep your cleaning help.

We were always on a tight budget. We could afford the basics. Shelter, food, utilities, insurance, car, tuition. All extra monies went for cleaning help. I had help 3 times a week. I worked all day, while the kids went to school. It was great coming home to a clean home. The kids appreciated the fact that as soon as we got home, my attention was on them and getting dinner on the table. They were proud to bring friends over to a clean home.

In order to afford it, I went without. I did not buy a new Sheitel for 10 years. And when I finally bought one, it was the Yaffa 2 for 1. I made sure to take care of my clothes and shoes to last me a long time. We never went out to eat, not even pizza. We ate healthy on a budget.

But it was all worth the cleaning help to not be so stressed.

I also suffer from back, hip, knee problems that makes it difficult to do these tasks myself.

DH needs to appreciate all you do for him.
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Dolly Welsh




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 4:18 pm
As the daughter cooks, let her recruit siblings to stack and unstack the dishwasher. She can be in charge of that but it should happen, and you do indeed get to say what your cleaning lady does.

However you seem to not get listened to?

Declare that the kids have to help their sister.

You need to get your husband to back you up, back up your authority. Inform him of that, in private. Very much in private.

Do not be weak. Get some firmness into your manner. In some way, your sensitivities have turned into social weaknesses. Not so good. Nobody listens to Mom because Mom is too busy fussing over the crumbs to be anybody you have to listen to. She's busy. "Little things upset her, so she's weak."

It is more important, meaning, it must BECOME more important, that you get respect in your family, than, that your house be clean, or your husband's guests think well of the house. That will require you to learn to NOT CARE about these wrong things, so you will have authority over the RIGHT things.

This will come out right in the end, because your cook daughter will take responsibility for her food production. That always includes getting the area back to normal. If YOU have social authority, then she will, also. But yours must come first. And, your husband is the headwaters and source of that.

Yes, get therapy.
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Queen6




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 26 2014, 4:22 pm
I don't know why you're listening to anyone's comments on if you should or shouldn't have cleaning help. This is YOUR home and YOUR business. Stop discussing it. I personally have full time help and I don't even work - it becomes a round table discussion wherever I go. Everyone loves to comment. I close my ears. When they ask me "Why do you need so much help?" I answer "I don't need it - I want it, why should I not have it? Who benefits from me not having it?" The discussion usually closes there. It's very nice of everyone else is SO capable.... I'm not interested - this is what works for me.
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