Out of town Wedding. Who pays travel expenses?

imasinger

Tue, Jul 15 2014, 11:44 am

amother wrote:

Now every conversation becomes a battlefield even though it's one sided as there's nothing to discuss.
I really want to focus on the simcha not DD's guilt trip.
She's wearing me out to a point where it's easier to just go into more debt just so she'll stop...
Not that I'd do it & never had in the past either and she knows it.

Listen to yourself.

DD has pressured you in the past, and knows it doesn't work.

But she is turning the subject into a "royal battle" every time you talk these days.

What has caused her to act this way now? Hmm, let me guess...

Do they live near to you? If you can, have the conversation in the same room. If not, insist that BOTH of them get on the phone with both of you.

Tell them that you are sorry you came across as exclusionary. Of course SIL is one of the family. As an adult member of the family, you are sure he understands that sometimes, we can't afford everything we' d like. This is the amount you are offering towards their journey. They can decide whether it will be a part of further outlay on their part, or whether DD goes alone and stays in a hotel room with family. You apologize for assuming that they would choose to have DD go alone; that is what the two of you would have done, but they are completely free to make their own choice.

Then, tell them that this is not open for any further debate. They have until X time to either buy their tickets and receive the money to defray costs, or have you buy a ticket for DD. If the topic comes up again, you will just say firmly, "The subject is closed. End of discussion." And hang up if necessary.

Since when did you ever listen to the argument, "everyone else does it"? That's for children, not those old enough to be married.

Mazel tov. May the rest of your plans go smoothly.

Last edited by imasinger on Tue, Jul 15 2014, 12:24 pm; edited 1 time in total

Tablepoetry

Tue, Jul 15 2014, 11:46 am

amother wrote:

Wow. I guess I really am lucky. I have ILs AND parents who treat both DH and I as if we are both their children.... If one of us gets $$ for a birthday, the other gets same amount. If one if us gets a ticket somewhere the other does of course. When making a Simcha DH gets the same amount towards clothing as my brothers (and my SILs get the same as me and my sisters). This is not to say adult children are treated the same as the younger ones. There have been many times that the family still at home went away in a trip/to a simcha and we weren't invited (ie- they didn't offer to pay for us) We don't expect it. We don't feel as if it's"coming to us" but we ARE treated equally and as a unit. To only invite/offer to pay for one of us and not the other. NEVER. That is really, gosh, I can't think of a word. If you couldn't afford to pay for both of them you should not have offered to have either of them. At this point you have dug yourself into a hole you may never get out of. Sorry, but you are officially a candidate for the worst MIL of the year award.

And you are amother for this nasty post because......?

hotmom

Tue, Jul 15 2014, 12:08 pm

I had many overseas siblings weddings on either side. My in laws would always pay all our tickets (my dh, kids and myself) but then she could afford it. However on my side, most of my brothers married abroad. Yet my parents didn't give us tickets nor money. So I went to 2 and that was it. I couldn't afford the rest. My parents would never give one and not the other. It's either both or nothing. I think that makes most sense. B"h, I'm now marrying of my child in Europe. I'm not paying any siblings but whoever wants to attend can pay themselves. If I had kids married already I would Definitely feel I need to pay their tickets. it's Only fair.
You have to do what you can and can afford. But I think giving one ticket especially to a newly wed is a little unfair. Rather give an x amount of money towards fares or nothing. Giving one a ticket will make the other feel an outcast.
Good luck on your decision and Mazal Tov!

amother

Tue, Jul 15 2014, 12:18 pm

I had sibling-in-law get married overseas. Dh was the only married sibling at the time and there were no grandchildren.

Ils paid tickets for all the siblings as well as dh and I. We were told very clearly that right now they can afford it but in the future when more sibs will iyh be married and grandchildren they may not be able to afford to fly in the whole family for a simcha. We were told to appreciate it now but not expect it in the future if they make another wedding overseas.
Ils paid our airline tickets but we paid all our own other expenses including accommodations and food, clothes for wedding including shaitel updo, traveling expenses to/ from airport in both directions, day trips while overseas

out-of-towner

Tue, Jul 15 2014, 2:01 pm

amother wrote:

I know someone who lived in another country to her parents. Her sibling got married in her hometown. Her parents insisted they ALL attended (including several kids) but did not offer any money towards tickets. It was very hard for them since they were very short of cash.

Then she should have put her foot down and only sent who she could.

It's a two way street here: If you want someone to come, you pay. If not, then fine, but don't be insulted when they don't come.

OP please don't let your daughter push you into spending more than you want/can afford. If her DH wants to come that badly then let them pay his way. And if she doesn't want to come without him and they don't want to pay for his ticket? Thats her loss not to come to her brother's wedding.

amother

Tue, Jul 15 2014, 2:06 pm

Quote:

amother wrote:
I know someone who lived in another country to her parents. Her sibling got married in her hometown. Her parents insisted they ALL attended (including several kids) but did not offer any money towards tickets. It was very hard for them since they were very short of cash.

Then she should have put her foot down and only sent who she could.

It's a two way street here: If you want someone to come, you pay. If not, then fine, but don't be insulted when they don't come.

OP please don't let your daughter push you into spending more than you want/can afford. If her DH wants to come that badly then let them pay his way. And if she doesn't want to come without him and they don't want to pay for his ticket? Thats her loss not to come to her brother's wedding.

Yes, that what I said. Not my business however so I stayed out of it. Alas not all parents (or kids) are reasonable people.

ora_43

Tue, Jul 15 2014, 2:26 pm

oliveoil wrote:

I don't see all the fuss. Obviously it's more important for the sibling to be at the wedding, rather than the new brother in law who has known the guy for less than a year. And yes, even in shana rishona she can go to the wedding alone. I think the OP has been more than generous by offering a full ticket.

I agree. I can kind of see what people are saying about treating a married couple like a unit, but I can't imagine being offended if my in-laws offered to pay for DH and not me to attend a simcha for someone in his family. I wouldn't have thought it was rude to imply that it's more important for a sibling to attend.

Not that previous posters didn't have a good point about offering a lump sum instead of a single ticket, just to reaffirm to OP that she's not the only one who wouldn't have realized that the way she handled things could be considered offensive.

observer

Tue, Jul 15 2014, 2:50 pm

Although it does sound like the daughter has a sense of entitlement, it also sounds like you do not know how to relate to adult married children.

Firstly, you do not expect one spouse to go to a family wedding, and not the other. Aside from sending a message that they should separate for x amount of time, which many couples dont do (especially in shana rishona), you are also sending the message that your son in law is not really part of your family. It's one thing if you said "Here's $1000 towards tickets" or "Here's $1500 toward tickets". That would have been very different. Its not just the wording, its the message behind it.

Additionally, it surprises me that you would even remotely entertain the thought of having her sleep with the little girls on mattresses and have him sleep in a room with boys. They are a married couple and should be treated as such. That doesnt mean you have to pay for their accommodations, but you should be of the understanding that of course they will need a private room. It sounds like your whole mindset is that your daughter is still single, with a tagalong husband. I think this mindset will only cause more and more issues down the line.

That doesnt mean you have to pay for their accommodations, but you should definitely not have expectations of them to sleep separately.

For the sake of all your married children, please change your mindset toward grown married children and treat them with appropriate expectations.

aussie2

Tue, Jul 15 2014, 3:04 pm

I did not read all the replies but I just got back yesterday from travelling alone to my sister's wedding. My parents could not afford to bring in me, my husband and 2 kids. They paid for my ticket and expressed that they wished they could pay for more and of course e/o was invited but there was no way they could pay for all the tickets.. Bh my husband was fine with it and I worked out babysitting arrangements but obv a lot of the childcare was on him as well.. But I can def hear spouses being upset about it. My husband was very understanding of my parent's financial situation and we are not the only ppl they would have to bring in from abroad. (and we just brought ourselves in for Pesach so we didnt feel like it made sense for us to spend so much on airfare again).

Raisin

Tue, Jul 15 2014, 3:20 pm

My parents are very inclusive of all their children in law. But they still don't have money to pay for 2 tickets. And yes, its pretty obvious that its more expensive to provide a whole room rather then a single bed. I don't think it is wrong to not provide two tickets.

As to the mattresses, clearly the OP is not spending a lot of money on accomodation. I don't think a married person needs a proper bed any more then a single person of the same age.

I know some families/cultures where when they have a simcha, all the men sleep in one room and all the women in another, married couples included, so they don't need so many bedrooms.

HonesttoGod

Tue, Jul 15 2014, 3:24 pm

When my siblings got married out of town I am the only sibling who lives a plane ride away from my parents and the weddings.

For one siblings my parents did not offer to pay, it didn't even come into question, and my dh, myself and kids flew out there on our own costs. It cost a fortune but I wasn't about to miss my sisters wedding. My parents wanted us there, all of us. It broke our bank but we went.
For another sibling we told my parents we love you and we would love to be by the wedding but there is no way in the world we can pay $2000 plus for tickets. We were in a difficult situation financially and physically and we just couldn't break ourselves. They kept saying they want us all there but we were strong and said we cannot. Not because we wanted them to pay but because we couldn't pay. We just couldn't any way we looked at it.
I was devastated. My in laws nearly offered to pay for me to go and that was mortifying. Then my father realized the situation and offered to pay a certain amount and we managed to get tickets for that price for an extremely short trip (think 3 days, leaving the day after the wedding). It was definitely better than nothing.

I am really torn about these situations. On the one hand I can understand how expensive weddings are and tickets are and your kids are independent so why pay for them. On the other hand from the kids point of view, you want everyone to be there, you want your immediate family to celebrate a family simcha but you won't pay it makes for some uncomfortable situations.
I dislike when people say tickets for family are part of the wedding expenses but as a child, it hurts badly when your parents either a: don't care enough whether or not you come or b: they are desperate for you to come with your entire family but don't want to chip in at all.

OP I don't think your wrong but I do understand your dd is hurting. It is hard for her to be alone at a family simcha (especially if she is newlywed) but she wants to be there. Stay strong. Maybe give her an amount. Tell her you will give them $1400 (or a couple hundred more than a ticket price) for this wedding and they can choose to spend it how they want.

Perhaps she can use the time as a vacation and go away with her dh while she is in town for the wedding so she won't feel like she 'wasted' $$ on tickets for something she had to be by anyway.

Again it is hard from both sides of view but having been in this circumstances, it was really really depressingly horrible. I felt terrible for my parents that they gave us so much money when they had to pay for a wedding as well but honestly, you want me, you fund me. To an extent it is true, that when budgeting a wedding it is only fair to budget in your oot children who would otherwise not be able to afford to come.

Tablepoetry

Tue, Jul 15 2014, 3:34 pm

ora_43 wrote:

I agree. OP's offer seems pretty natural, and many people I know would not raise an eyebrow.
Obviously there are more sensitive people out there, so she should word it as a bulk sum for the two to split on travel fees as they see fit. But in of itself, it's not offensive or weird IMO.

Also, some people seem to have misunderstood. OP was not planning on putting a married couple to sleep on mattresses with little kids. She was planning to only put her married dd there, which seems fine to me as she's still a young woman. The problem was if the new spouse came along too, they'd have to then pay for a separate room for them, an added huge expense.

OP, make sure sil knows he's loved and valued in general. Other than that, don't beat yourself up over this. You were generous.