Guest Etiquette | Imamother

amother

Sun, Sep 21 2014, 6:17 pm

I am having some guests over for RH and am wondering what the "protocol" is for certain things. I'm someone who isn't good at saying 'no,' and need some help with it. He is an adult family member who's not very socially competent and is very needy. This isn't someone I grew up with, and I don't want to futz with my already sticky family dynamics by discussing this with other family members.

1. He always needs something and always demands it from me, often times not even in full sentences or with a please. I'm constantly being barraged - Is there any soda or ice tea? More ice? Are you serving fish for the meal? (after we've already gone from salads to meat). Will there be any meat in the meal? (on shavuos) Do you have any sea salt instead of regular salt? More water? Ketchup?

I try to anticipate his needs, but I'm not a mind reader. I feel like I'm constantly hopping up and down when he comes over. I'm normally happy to get a guest what they need, but with him I can't actually relax because I'm bopping up and down. He's done this even when I had a broken arm. He always asks me to get whatever he wants - not dh or his wife. At a certain point, can I say, "The mustard is on the fridge door" or if he says, "More water," can I say "Feel free to fill up the water pitcher." I want to come across as polite and a good hostess.

2. This guest will ask, 'Do you have any ice cream,' etc. And some of the time, I will have that thing but it won't be for that meal or I'll have something expensive that I'm not serving everyone, like my special wheat-free crackers. I always have plenty of good food. It will be like, I'll make a cake but he'll really want ice cream or vice versa. Sometimes I make 3 desserts and he wants something else. How do I not lie, but also not have to give him something I'm using for a different meal?

3. He'll sometimes make observations that come across as disparaging. Like, "Oh, this ice tea is warm" etc. Do I just smile or say, "uh-huh," or am I supposed to fix it?

amother

Sun, Sep 21 2014, 6:25 pm

amother wrote:

I am having some guests over for RH and am wondering what the "protocol" is for certain things. I'm someone who isn't good at saying 'no,' and need some help with it. I'm having issues with an adult family member who's not very socially competent and is very needy. This isn't someone I grew up with, and I don't want to futz with my already sticky family dynamics by discussing this with other family members.

1. He always needs something and always demands it from me, often times not even in full sentences or with a please. I'm constantly being barraged - Is there any soda or ice tea? More ice? Are you serving fish for the meal? (after we've already gone from salads to meat). Will there be any meat in the meal? (on shavuos) Do you have any sea salt instead of regular salt? More water? Ketchup?

I try to anticipate his needs, but I'm not a mind reader. I feel like I'm constantly hopping up and down when he comes over. I'm normally happy to get a guest what they need, but with him I can't actually relax because I'm bopping up and down. He's done this even when I had a broken arm. He always asks me to get whatever he wants - not dh or his wife. At a certain point, can I say, "The mustard is on the fridge door" or if he says, "More water," can I say "Feel free to fill up the water pitcher." I want to come across as polite and a good hostess.

2. This guest will ask, 'Do you have any ice cream,' etc. And some of the time, I will have that thing but it won't be for that meal or I'll have something expensive that I'm not serving everyone, like my special wheat-free crackers. I always have plenty of good food. It will be like, I'll make a cake but he'll really want ice cream or vice versa. Sometimes I make 3 desserts and he wants something else. How do I not lie, but also not have to give him something I'm using for a different meal?

3. He'll sometimes make observations that come across as disparaging. Like, "Oh, this ice tea is warm" etc. Do I just smile or say, "uh-huh," or am I supposed to fix it?

I wouldn't invite this guest to go into your fridge to get the ketchup because he is liable to come out with something you don't want to be serving. It is easier to never take out your wheat free crackers than to put them back when your guest spots them. This is about more than your food.

I would stop obliging him. I would tell him we are having cake for this dessert and not run and fetch. Why

If his request is reasonable and something you would fix for someone else like warm ice tea then do so.

Why do you need to invite this person so often?

Raisin

Sun, Sep 21 2014, 6:25 pm

oh boy. We have one guest that will make comments like: Why aren't you serving soup? etc etc Luckily its not a relative so we don't invite him that often.

But the requests sound out of hand. I think just learn to smile and say no nicely half the time. (say if he wants a different dessert) If it is a reasonable request (ice cubes) and you can accomadate, do. And no reason YOU have to do it - get your husband to.

amother

Sun, Sep 21 2014, 6:28 pm

He's family and they only come a few times a year.

MaBelleVie

Sun, Sep 21 2014, 6:34 pm

If there's kibud av involved I would try to be more patient and accommodating. Otherwise, push yourself past your comfort zone for the sake of hachnasat orchim, but don't let it get to you.

imasinger

Sun, Sep 21 2014, 6:50 pm

I have a family member like this, and after one occasion where I blew up at him, I have succeeded with this strategy.

Before the yt, I go over the menu with him. I ask if there is anything he will like, like ketchup, extra ice in the water, or a different dessert (if it will be easy to accommodate). I say, "Once this conversation is over, and we have a plan, it's not changing. I am too busy serving everyone to take extra requests at the table. I'm sorry I'm sensitive, but I don't want to get stressed out. That's why I am asking you now what you might like."

Then, if requests come (and after an initial testing period, they don't any more), I smile sweetly and say, "remember what we discussed the other day? Be sure to make a note to add that into our plans for next time you come, but right now, this is what is available."

Done.

Hatzlacha; please let us know how it goes!

amother

Sun, Sep 21 2014, 7:04 pm

Part of the issue is that I don't want other people to see me acting like a waitress for him, I'm not comfortable with that. I actually told his wife, my cousin, in detail, about the menu and asked her to go over it with him. I also told her that he should eat before coming so that he doesn't burst in, put his feet up, and then demand to be fed when I've barely gotten back from shul. -OP

amother

Sun, Sep 21 2014, 11:45 pm

Any more advice?

DrMom

Mon, Sep 22 2014, 1:09 am

I think it's strange that neither your DH nor his wife nor ANYBODY else present has ever attempted to modify his behavior, or to volunteer to fetch the items he asks for. Esecially when you had a broken arm.

Perhaps next time he demands water, ketchup, Dijon mustard, gherkins, etc. you can pre-arrange with your DH to say, "My wife works so hard preparing yom tov meals, why don't we let her relax and eat her meal? I'm sure we can all find something to eat among the lavish spread my wife has prepared. We won't go hungry." *smile*

Why exactly do you need to invite these people?

DrMom

Mon, Sep 22 2014, 1:42 am

amother wrote:

He's family and they only come a few times a year.

On your side of the family or your husband's side?

amother

Mon, Sep 22 2014, 12:00 pm

He married into the family and is my cousin's husband.

amother

Mon, Sep 22 2014, 1:16 pm

To me it sounds like he is somewhat 'on the spectrum'.
Unfortunately he probably won't 'get' anything you say to him and will persist with his unreasonable, brusque demands. Do continue to be gracious though, for the benefit of others at the table. Just ignore him as much as you can without being overtly rude.

spinkles

Mon, Sep 22 2014, 3:53 pm

ValleyMom

Mon, Sep 22 2014, 8:18 pm

"Do you have any Ice"
"Yes."

--And then let him figure out that you're done with serving him.

"Do you have any ice cream for dessert?"
"Yes. But not for this meal."

"Do you have sea salt."
"Yes. But I'm sitting down to enjoy the meal. You will have to wait a bit."

This man AND his lazy wife sound problematic.

amother

Mon, Sep 22 2014, 10:47 pm

A lot of the time he'll just say something like: "Soda." I really want to pretend that I have no clue what he's talking about, and just pretend he said "light" "action" "camera" or something like that..

Also, how would you respond if he said: "Is this dessert?" in an incredulous way when I bring out, say, fruit salad and not ice cream? Do I just ignore him? When I have ignored him, he'll snap his fingers at me or bang on the table and keep saying my name until I respond to him!!!!

amother

Mon, Sep 22 2014, 10:54 pm

We actually had a neighbor like this. Not only was he very demanding every time he came over, he'd call in middle of the week to ask for a "sammich" or money to buy pizza etc. My husband would usually grant his requests and think he was doing chesed. But that's a separate story...

The difference is that this person clearly had an intellectual disability and now lives in an adult residence. Is your guest otherwise functional?

amother

Mon, Sep 22 2014, 11:34 pm

He's got a learning disability (he mentioned it once), but does have a decent job and is totally able to communicate his needs and emotions (obviously..), and has opinions on current events, Torah, etc.

amother

Mon, Sep 22 2014, 11:45 pm

amother wrote:

In my mind behavior like this is just not compatible with having a "decent job." How does he treat people at work? Or does he not have to interact with people?

ValleyMom

Tue, Sep 23 2014, 1:47 am

Just answer the question.
Is this dessert?
YES.

Soda!
I don't understand you?
SOOODA!
What does that mean?

I want soda!
We aren't serving soda at this meal. If you want soda you'll need to bring your own we don't drink soda anymore it's not healthy for us.

Etc

rainbow dash

Tue, Sep 23 2014, 4:07 am

amother wrote:

im sorry but my mouth is hanging open, are you serious???? This is disgusting behavior!!!!!!!!!!! Either stop inviting them or ignore him, hes only making himself look like the idiot he is. Tell them that sorry but this year there is a change of plans and we cant have you over. You deserve better this this.

Nebach his wife.