3 yo resists Jewish things

Peanut2

Mon, Dec 01 2014, 10:43 pm

My 3 year old is very strong willed and very active and is a handful.
She recently turned three and I've upped our Jewish stuff we do. She's often interested the first time I do something (like go over alef bet cards) but then doesn't want to do it. She hasn't been saying Shema with me for a long time (she used to say it with me when she was really little) so I just say it before she goes to sleep. She won't say brachot before eating, she doesn't want *me* to even say modah ani with her. What else? She gets upset when we make kiddush, she wants to light candles by herself, she stayed around for havdallah very nicely last time, but that's it.

Any thoughts or advice?

I end up not saying and doing things with her that I feel I should because she's so resistant and there is so much to do.

EDA this isn't a nachas/high expectation issue, it's an I-don't-know-what-I'm-doing issue. I live in an area with very few frum people and her (pre)school leaves much to be desired. We almost never tell her not to do something on shabbat - we either let her or redirect, because most of her friends do not keep shabbat. All of it has to come from me. Also, if you have a Cd/DVD recommendation please be specific because I'm not familiar with them. thanks!

Last edited by Peanut2 on Tue, Dec 02 2014, 11:47 am; edited 1 time in total

the world's best mom

Mon, Dec 01 2014, 11:40 pm

I see no reason to force a 3 year old to look at Aleph Bais cards. She'll have enough sitting and learning when she's in school, believe me.

In school, they say Brachos together before eating, and if you say your Brachos out loud at home, then she'll have enough exposure to begin saying them on her own when she is ready.

Also, I say Shema with my kids at night and they don't all join in every night. For a 3 year old that's completely okay in my opinion.

The only thing I'm not sure of is whether you should continue to say Modeh Ani for her. I think yes, with no pressure at all for her to join in. She doesn't even have to know you are saying it for her, as long as subconsciously, she is hearing it regularly. But if she's extremely bothered by it, maybe not yet.

modehani

Mon, Dec 01 2014, 11:43 pm

I agree it's normal for the age. My years of singing Shema solo at bedtime are finally paying off, as one or another of my kids will occasionally join in with gusto now. I would just keep doing things in a fun, non-pressured way and don't worry.

seeker

Tue, Dec 02 2014, 12:09 am

Let it go
let it go
Let it go

Worst thing is when religious stuff becomes a power struggle at such a young age. I've seen it happen. Don't go there.

At one point the horsing around during Shema was too much for me so I bought a special sticker book and let DD choose one sticker each time she said Shema nicely. But never any coercion; if she ever said "I don't wanna" it was just like, "OK... but you know my stickers are only for when you do." Usually she wants it anyway. Now Shema is a regular part of bedtime routine but I'm also stuck giving out stickers indefinitely because I can't figure out how to wean off them, especially since my 2-year-old is a little OCDish about routines and freaks out if I try to change anything. Not worth it, viva stickers.

You could also make some Shabbos dessert treat contingent on *one* behavior of your choice during the meal. Again no coercion, but everyone who comes to the table and is quiet for kiddush gets a certain cookie.

Otherwise brachos, modeh ani, etc should be as fun as possible (songs, praise) but optional at this point. She is not allowed to stop YOU from doing anything though. You can say you're saying modeh ani for yourself and if she doesn't want to listen she doesn't have to, but you're going to do what you do anyway.

rosenbal

Tue, Dec 02 2014, 12:16 am

Agree with above posters! One of my kids is almost 10 and I still say shema for her half the time. It's fine. She almost never davens at home (but daven "beautifully" in school LOL)..was told by highly regarded rav I'm close to NOT to have religious coersion going on with kids. If they resist, lay off. Let them see me daven, do mitzvos etc (happily). Not force bein adom lemakom mitzvos. Another of my kids needs davening reminders but I always remind him because I know he wants to daven and isn't at all resistant, just forgetful.

Pet peeve of mine: sometimes after a sit down meal/kiddush in shul I see mothers forcing their very clearly RESENTFUL, YOUNG children to sit down and say all of benching out loud with them while other kids are all playing etc. C'mon...I think a paragraph would be sufficient. You don't want kids to be resentfully about religion.

Or they go crazy when their 3 year old is touching mukza or doing a melacha OMG! They go nuts at practically a baby. (Chinuch for mukza doesn't even start till age 4). Even if they are of real chinuch age (6/7) STILL, tell them calmly that it's a melacha, try to redirect them or maybe know your kids. If your rumbunctious boy I'd gonna play with sticks on Shabbos because that's what he's gonna do...you don't have to see EVERYTHING all the time. Rant over.

Anyway OP, just do mitzvos besimcha yourself and it will be fine.

out-of-towner

Tue, Dec 02 2014, 12:16 am

My DH's parents still talk about how he resisted anything Jewish at that age...and now he is ultra Frum and wears a Streimel (he grew up LWMO). I would not worry about it at age 3, just make sure that YOU show your passion for Yiddishkiet to her and IYH she will pick up on it in the future.

heidi

Tue, Dec 02 2014, 12:22 am

I say that my 4 year old is reform. He eats kosher in the house, but doesn't believe in the external trappings of Judaism. He won't wear tzitzit and wears a baseball cap to gan bcz. he has to. He does say shma but won't say brachot before eating.
Let it go.
If your child feels forced they may very well resist. If they see it's not a big deal to you they will probably come to it naturally, through osmosis at home or from school. You'll see, one day you'll catch her making a bracha on her own.
Three is very very young.

Jewishmom8

Tue, Dec 02 2014, 4:04 am

yeah my daughter is reconstructionist then :-)
she says mode ani for her bentching.
she dosnt want to wash before she eats. and makes up her own brachos.
who cares. they are so little.
dont make an issue about this or most things for this age I think.
why are you even doing aleph beis flash cards?

Peanut2

Tue, Dec 02 2014, 8:17 am

Thanks everyone! Just for context, we live off the beaten (Jewish) path and her preschool, while Jewish, doesn't do some things that we thought are pretty basic even for her age. So I know I need to make up some of the difference at home but I'm not always sure how.

Like I said, she stopped saying Shema with me forever ago, and she won't say anything else with me. She used to play "davening" when she was little but won't. You are all of course right that this is so normal for three and I will happily let it go, but since she can sing all of "Let it go" by herself it makes me sad that she can't/won't do the same for Jewish things, or that she tantrums when it's time for Kiddush because she doesn't want Kiddush.

I just feel like she's not getting it by osmosis the way she would in some other places so I worry. But you are all of course right that she is only 3. (And the alef bet she actually liked - at least the first time - it's just everything else she won't say and do.)

Chayalle

Tue, Dec 02 2014, 10:19 am

I have a type-2 independant 6 year old. At 3 I was glad to keep tantrums at bay (B"H we've made loads of progress there) never mind getting her to do Jewish things. At 6, we are working on these things and making some progress.

One thing I've been told by my Rav - do not make an issue of these things. You saying Shema for her is the right approach, and even there, make it positive. I sit in the rocker with DD every night and I say Shema for her while she snuggles, and now at 6 she usually joins in unless she is not "in the mood" and I don't make an issue of it.

On Shabbos, if she washes for Challah she gets a special treat. We have a game where I hide something small around her seat (like a jelly bean or a small taffy) at some point during the meal if she has washed and sat nicely. I don't know if I'd have done this at age 3 though.

She makes berachos, but mostly because peer pressure in school led to that. I don't think she did that at 3.

Three is still very young. At that age, you do the "frum" things and she will follow when she's ready. Children are not Nachas machines.

amother

Tue, Dec 02 2014, 10:56 am

Chayalle wrote:

what does type 2 mean? I thought type A was difficult.

Peanut2

Tue, Dec 02 2014, 11:49 am

this isn't a nachas/high expectation issue, it's an I-don't-know-what-I'm-doing issue. I live in an area with very few frum people and her (pre)school leaves much to be desired. We almost never tell her not to do something on shabbat - we either let her or redirect, because most of her friends do not keep shabbat. All of it has to come from me. Also, if you have a Cd/DVD recommendation please be specific because I'm not familiar with them.

I looked up the my first siddur cd and it seems great (except for the ashkenazi pronunciation but no one is perfect) but they seem to be out of stock???

Frumdoc

Tue, Dec 02 2014, 5:47 pm

What about some fun puzzles or toys with aleph bais or jewish themes for her to
Play and read with, if she enjoys it? It is all about making it fun at that age, and she will pick most things up by osmosis from you.

The more you show signs of stress or react, the more she will find ways to provoke you. It is just that age!

mummiedearest

Tue, Dec 02 2014, 6:16 pm

you can have some fun activities:

bake aleph bais cookies

cut out felt letters and glue a large piece of felt over a piece of cardboard. the letters should stick on the board. just let her play with this set, don't try to educate her. once in a while, you can say something like, "oh, I see you're playing with the lamed. lamed is for leah!"

get her some cds and play them constantly. my three-year-old loves "shalom shalom aleph" and "torah island." she also loves the "boruch learns" cds by shmuel kunda. she sings along with them now. you may want to see if you can get a bedtime cd to incorporate into your bedtime routine if she really resists singing with you.

as for muktza, you can try to put away muktza stuff before shabbos. if your dd sees you doing this, consider getting "special shabbos toys." tell her you're putting away the muktza stuff to make room for the shabbos toys.

brachos: eat with her and say the brachos out loud. we love "boruch learns his brachos" around here. my three-year-old doesn't want to say brachos yet, but she'll sing them along with the cd.

miami85

Tue, Dec 02 2014, 6:36 pm

I agree that for the most part that you shouldn't sweat it just yet, it could be that in her own way is telling you that she's not ready for more. May I just throw out another possibility, from personal experience, that there may be other reasons based on what she's associating the various things with. Ex. Shma=bedtime, don't want bedtime; Brachot= I need to wait to eat my food, don't want to wait; I tried davening with my 3y/o son, and he said "no, no" I think b/c I'm not his teacher, those were his teacher's songs, or I was singing them out of order. And with Alef-Bais--just emphasize the letter her name/names start with, it will become more personal and exciting. It will also see if she's ready to grasp the concept. Or do s/t like "Alef"= Ima/Abba, or whatever association you want to make. Beis for "boobah" (doll). Also for brachot, you may want to start making brachos out loud and model that that's what you are supposed to do.