Home
Log in / Sign Up
    Private Messages   Advanced Search   Rules   New User Guide   FAQ   Advertise   Contact Us  
Forum -> Inquiries & Offers -> Moving/ Relocating
Explain the work situation in London to me please!
Previous  1  2  3  Next



Post new topic   Reply to topic View latest: 24h 48h 72h

amother
Powderblue


 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 9:57 am
I still wonder how much percentage that accounts for of the SH population.

Last edited by amother on Wed, Oct 21 2015, 10:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top

Raisin




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 10:26 am
amother wrote:
You know what you know, I know what I know. Working as a SW in SH/ Homerton means you get to know a lot about people's finances, hence I know plenty.

And who is forced to try to find a job - for goodness sake, it is a normal expectation to work, not to be handed benefits for the privilege of living. No one has the rigth not to work and live off housing benefit and income support, it is supposed to be for those who are looking for work or cant work because of incapacity etc. Not an automatic right because you do the UK a favour by living there paying no taxes. I give up with these attitudes.

In GG, where I live, people work, locally, in the city, wherever. Maybe there are equal numbers of those who expect not to, but bh I don't have anything to do with them. Maybe they are the ones supporting arm wrestling. I don't have anything to do with them either.


If you are a social worker in Stamford HIll I doubt you are meeting the hardworking professionals and business people. It makes sense that people who need the help of social services are not the most stable people. Like wise in NW London you are hanging out with like minded people to yourself.

Its like someone working in a drug rehab centre in Notting Hill and assuming everyone in Notting Hill is a drug addict.

My parents live in SH and afaik have never received any benefits.
Back to top

amother
Powderblue


 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 12:37 pm
You are obviously only meeting with people who need your services and are in a mess for reasons I don't know. but that does not represent Stamford Hill in its majority.

Last edited by amother on Wed, Oct 21 2015, 10:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top

amother


 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 6:08 pm
Ruchi wrote:
And who is forced to try to find a job - for goodness sake, it is a normal expectation to work,

People who would otherwise be still sitting and learning in kollel


I don't want to get into an irrelevant debate, but the UK benefits system, just like the US one, is not actually designed to support people who choose to sit and learn in kollel, that is an abuse of the benefits system.

If you wish to sit and learn in kollel, the honest way to do it would be to have a private support system which doesn't involve taking advantage of a socialist system because one chooses not to finance one's own lifestyle, however simplistic. Living off income support or incapacity benefit, without making any effort to fund yourself, is not an honest way to support kollel as a lifestyle or hashkafic choice.

This may come as a shock: the Western world's social services were not set up to support the kollel lifestyle, or many other abuses of their benefits. It is stealing, and stealing from Jewish taxpayers, not just the "non-jewish government".
Back to top

amother


 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 6:10 pm
amother wrote:
BH we are very fortunate that our family bought us a house. But otherwise there is no way we could have ever bought one. Even earning over £60,000 between us. Just is not enough.

Re the benefits, I am young/heimish and all of my friends and their husbands claim benefits and work. I am extremely honest and would never dream of doing this however much of a struggle it means for us. It really annoys me, and to be honest, these people have much more disposable income than we have! They can afford more that we can since they are earning similar but rent is being paid for them and all sorts of other benefits. If you're on one, they throw them all at you and you can get a lot free!

Also, you can't save up benefits or they'll stop the benefits so it means they live a better quality of life being in a position to spend everything they earn. But this is not a complaint at all (except the honesty part) because at the end of the day we have a house/investment so are in an amazing situation.


OP here
I daven that we'll be able to live honestly like you. DH is not on the same page in this regard and it's VERY frustrating Sad

But you are confirming the information we have found out as well so I guess this is the crowd we're looking at and will be comparing ourselves to.
Back to top

londonn16




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 6:11 pm
"A mother" you are a bag of laughs!!! For goodness sake! Looks like you're living in the1970s! Who on earth sews diamonds into their clothes these days?! For anything it seems to me that you're very familiar with all these crooked ways, and by making you feel better you're slandering hundreds of people. It's not ok to be motzei Shem rah one person never mind hundreds of honest hard working charitable people. And for argument sake without mentioning names plenty of litvish people have been caught lately worldwide 'cooking!!'
And please don't talk for the Golders Green people, talk for yourself because most honest people in Golders Green are in partnership with us people in Stamford Hill
Back to top

londonn16




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 6:34 pm
And now I'm really angry!!!! I reread all the replies, you 'A MOTHER' are no professional worker in Stamford Hill or elsewhere, because other than normal purchases such as household goods etc CANNOT be bought by cash because of some arms and drug law so every penny hasto be accounted for. Get your facts right before accusing others of being crooked cooks!!
Back to top

amother


 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 6:40 pm
londonn16 wrote:
"A mother" you are a bag of laughs!!! For goodness sake! Looks like you're living in the1970s! Who on earth sews diamonds into their clothes these days?! For anything it seems to me that you're very familiar with all these crooked ways, and by making you feel better you're slandering hundreds of people. It's not ok to be motzei Shem rah one person never mind hundreds of honest hard working charitable people. And for argument sake without mentioning names plenty of litvish people have been caught lately worldwide 'cooking!!'
And please don't talk for the Golders Green people, talk for yourself because most honest people in Golders Green are in partnership with us people in Stamford Hill


It is ok, I don't speak for anyone except me. I am being honest, it is up to you who you choose to believe. I am not saying who does what, just that these practices go on.

The essence is that there are many minimally overlapping kehillos in GG, anc they each think their own thing is the normal. So I said which kehillos I know, mostly the litvish/ ashkenazi/ yekkish ones, and the normal is that people work, don't live on benefits and are modest in their lifestyle, even the v v wealthy (except they have fancier homes). Most of us don't have much to do with SH, totally different type, except I have close connections socially and worked there.

Other parts of GG are much more part of the "Union", their ways are closely aligned with SH and they think whatever they think of the rest of GG. It is a big rift, defined by your shul and your heritage. I am not slandering chassidish v litvish, it is not anything like that, just different overlapping kehillos living in the same area with different outlooks on lifestyle etc.
Back to top

londonn16




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 6:45 pm
A mother, you are weirder than I thought, you have zero to do with us Stamford Hill people only 'professionally' yet you know soooo much! Don't know another person like you in GG, you sure you live there???
Back to top

amother


 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 6:49 pm
Raisin wrote:
If you are a social worker in Stamford HIll I doubt you are meeting the hardworking professionals and business people. It makes sense that people who need the help of social services are not the most stable people. Like wise in NW London you are hanging out with like minded people to yourself.

Its like someone working in a drug rehab centre in Notting Hill and assuming everyone in Notting Hill is a drug addict.

My parents live in SH and afaik have never received benefits.


As I said earlier, but everyone chose to ignore, there are many honest people living in SH, some of whom I know socially. They are like people from anywhere else, some are good, some ok, some fun, some not, etc.

There are also many who live on benefits, not just the odd few, it is an acceptable way of being. These are not people in crisis, this is living off benefits as a way of life. There are multiple ethnic groups and areas where this is an issue, I have now moved on to another area with a different ethnic group with similar issues, it is not exclusive to any religion or group, it is a UK wide cross cultural issue in certain areas.

I'm not particularly bothered if you all want to deny it, but there it is. It is not a defining factor, it is a factor. It is pretty irrelevant here, so I think it is better to leave it alone, rather than getting everyone upset over issues that are nothing to do with the op wanting to move to GG.
Back to top

amother


 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 6:58 pm
londonn16 wrote:
And now I'm really angry!!!! I reread all the replies, you 'A MOTHER' are no professional worker in Stamford Hill or elsewhere, because other than normal purchases such as household goods etc CANNOT be bought by cash because of some arms and drug law so every penny hasto be accounted for. Get your facts right before accusing others of being crooked cooks!!


I don't know what you are talking about? Lots of people deal cash in hand for many services/ purchases. Some declare it, some don't. That isn't specific to any area.

I am sorry that you are so upset by what I have said. I would give you my address, which you would instantly recognise as in GG, but I don't think it would help.

I will make sure I smile at you if you tell me when you are next in Kays or KK, or Shefa, or at the next housecoat sale at the Soroh F hall, and you will know who I am ;-)
Back to top

mirah2




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 7:15 pm
amother wrote:
I don't know what you are talking about? Lots of people deal cash in hand for many services/ purchases. Some declare it, some don't. That isn't specific to any area.


I also couldn't work out what she was talking about. To clarify (although this is now well off topic) anti-money laundering laws require businesses offering certain goods/services to id their clients and report suspicious transactions (which can include large or unusual cash transactions). I am struggling to think of how this would stop ppl paying in cash for most goods/services in person rather than online. Of course, there is the question of accounting for VAT on cash transactions where no VAT invoice is produced but I doubt this is what was meant...

Anyway. Public education attempt over.
Back to top

amother


 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 7:44 pm
UK benefit advisor here, and just so you know, you CANNOT receive benefits unless you work a minimum of 16 hours per week. Many benefits require 24 hours per week. From my experience I can tell you that more than majority of people in SH work at least 24 hours per week. The reason they are still entitled to benefits is because their earning thresholds are high due to their large/r families.
Back to top

Mrs Bissli




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 8:34 pm
Just pointing out the obvious, more for the benefit of OP. If you/DH is on employment-sponsored visa or similar termed/restricted visa (as opposed to permanent leave to remain without conditions), you are not entitled to receive benefits (except for NHS, to which you/DH will contribute via PAYE). Also they seem to have tightened the rules recently so UK citizens returning from abroad will NOT be eligible to receive benefits for the first 3-6months or so.

Also as the other posters commented, Jobseekers Allowance has rigid requirement (frequent interviews, risk of getting benefits slashed if you turn down reasonable job prospects etc). The focus is on getting people back into work force, and provide top-up payments for 'working poor'.

I won't be able to comment on tax avoidance in GG vs Stamford Hill. DH gives tzedaka to similar kollelim in NW11 and N16, and he very often has to chase after the latter (which is actually a larger and should be better organised institution) to get receipts whilst the former promptly acknowledges donation and send receipts. But then again, there's a popular shop in NW London where you get discounts on certain days of the week if you pay in cash (but then again it could be because shops get less after cc companies charge handling fees).
Back to top

amother


 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 8:56 pm
Mrs Bissli wrote:
Just pointing out the obvious, more for the benefit of OP. If you/DH is on employment-sponsored visa or similar termed/restricted visa (as opposed to permanent leave to remain without conditions), you are not entitled to receive benefits (except for NHS, to which you/DH will contribute via PAYE). Also they seem to have tightened the rules recently so UK citizens returning from abroad will NOT be eligible to receive benefits for the first 3-6months or so.

Also as the other posters commented, Jobseekers Allowance has rigid requirement (frequent interviews, risk of getting benefits slashed if you turn down reasonable job prospects etc). The focus is on getting people back into work force, and provide top-up payments for 'working poor'.

I won't be able to comment on tax avoidance in GG vs Stamford Hill. DH gives tzedaka to similar kollelim in NW11 and N16, and he very often has to chase after the latter (which is actually a larger and should be better organised institution) to get receipts whilst the former promptly acknowledges donation and send receipts. But then again, there's a popular shop in NW London where you get discounts on certain days of the week if you pay in cash (but then again it could be because shops get less after cc companies charge handling fees).


OP
Thank you Mrs Bissli. DH is EU citizen, although what that will get us, I'm not sure yet.

This argument is interesting because if you'd read my OP, you would notice that this is exactly the information we were told when we looked into the financial situation over there. So no, you can't identify a whole community as crooks but it obviously is prevalent if this is what outsiders are getting told. (Not talking about diamonds in clothes, lol but claiming benefits illegally). Perhaps it's the people we asked, true, but a family member who visited London recently noticed the same thing (and overheard a conversation that went something like: in America they can't have chuppahs in the afternoon like here because people work. Obviously that's a totally skewed view but it's just an indication of the attitude SOME people have.)
Back to top

londonn16




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 9:17 pm
That's exactly why most Stamford Hill weddings are like in the USA with the Chupa being in the evenings!! Lol
Back to top

londonn16




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 09 2015, 9:20 pm
And btw Please check out the school acceptance policy BEFORE you leave the USA, and make sure your kids are accepted in some school as you might be home schooling them!!
Back to top

amother


 

Post Tue, Mar 10 2015, 12:33 am
londonn16 wrote:
And btw Please check out the school acceptance policy BEFORE you leave the USA, and make sure your kids are accepted in some school as you might be home schooling them!!


Sigh. Please make sure you read my posts before making subtle digs in righteous indignation.
Oh, and where did I say anything about USA?
Back to top

amother


 

Post Tue, Mar 10 2015, 4:07 am
wow

just wow

what a row!

we left london for eretz yisrael a few years ago and I am SO pleased we left when we did. sorry OP I realise this doesn't help you.

GG is very nice if you can afford it. you're limited to there as you want to be near the little family you have, but maybe it's better to live somewhere more affordable where you can have more living space and afford to run one or two cars and so are able to visit family often, maybe even stay with them for shabbatot if their houses are big enough.

it's very hard to get a place in a jewish school in london so if I were you that would be my first concern even before deciding where to live.

b'hatzlacha x
Back to top

amother


 

Post Tue, Mar 10 2015, 4:39 am
Ok, tell me something. This might be something more for outsiders to answer, and I admit, a bit off topic:

Does GG have a reputation as being snobby, cut off, exclusive or similar? This is not something I've been told specifically but just a vibe that I've been getting in the midst of all this research, and may be wrong.

If the answer is yes, then why? Is it because it's notoriously expensive and so people living there are either considered wealthy or live as if they are? Is it any different say to Boro Park - different crowd, I know, but the sentiment may be similar?

Therefore, if I move to GG and then will tell another Londoner, "I live in GG", are they going to get an instant perception of what I'm like? And what would that perception be?

Or does that maybe depend on where in GG I live, how I dress, which shul we go to etc? (In which case I'd probably feel more comfortable about it, strange as that sounds, because I have some control over it, whereas otherwise it is more about identifying a whole group of people by their postcode...)
Back to top
Page 2 of 3 Previous  1  2  3  Next Recent Topics




Post new topic   Reply to topic    Forum -> Inquiries & Offers -> Moving/ Relocating

Related Topics Replies Last Post
Please explain to me what wanting woman to Lein Megilla is
by amother
268 Yesterday at 9:10 pm View last post
Home situation of DD's friend
by amother
39 Yesterday at 10:04 am View last post
Please help me find a work bag
by amother
9 Tue, Mar 26 2024, 10:37 am View last post
Should DH go to school or work?
by amother
22 Tue, Mar 26 2024, 10:05 am View last post
Can anyone explain the Israeli chareidi school system?
by amother
7 Tue, Mar 26 2024, 5:21 am View last post