Working chareidim | Imamother

ChossidMom

Sun, Mar 15 2015, 3:14 am

amother wrote:

I didnt realize that chasidishe girls try to have good professions. Thats not exactly the case in my community of satmar as girls dont go to college. What chasidish community are you referring to when you say that?

When I say "my community" I'm not necessarily referring to my Chassidus. I live in a predominantly Litvish community but it's pretty much the same for Chassidim and Litvish in Israel. Girls generally finish high school and do another 2 years in their (or another) BY seminar. Some complete their education when already married. The idea is always to have a good profession so that they can bring in as much money as possible. Some learn computers, graphics, architecture, bookeeping, special ed, secretarial stuff etc. As the years go by there seem to be more and more interesting fields open to Charedi women. For the record, the Bais Yaakovs here are on a very high level and they really push the girls academically. Too much, in my opinion. My daughter attends a BY in Yerushalayim where there are Litvish, Chassidish, Sfardim - everyone. She will IY"H finish 12th grade with some kind of certificate as a secretary. In 9th or 10th grade they offered 3 tracks in her school. One is a teaching track. One is bookeeping and one is HR/secretarial, which she chose because she just didn't want the other two. I'm amazed at the stuff she's learning and I think it's great because everyone needs these skills. The idea behind these tracks is that if the girl gets married at the end of high school (which alot do in all the communities) she has something in her hand.

I belong to Amshinov, by the way.

Another clarification - Charedi girls don't go to "college" either. But every BY seminar has another 2 years where a girl usually continues in order to get certified in something while remaining in a Torahdik atmosphere. Charedim don't go to college. Also, the certificates they receive are not college degrees.

ChossidMom

Sun, Mar 15 2015, 3:17 am

Another something that may interest you to know is that hi tech companies have opened women-only departments with appropriate hours for charedi women with children. The pay isn't as high as in the regular secular sector but it's nice for women to have women's only places where they can work and provide for their families. We have quite a few of them here in my city. Especially in the Litvish community, women are highly encouraged to work because many are supporting husbands in kollel.

ChossidMom

Sun, Mar 15 2015, 3:22 am

Frumdoc wrote:

I am, well, frum. I have family who are chareidi, who are MO, who are Reform, who are lifelong kollel learners, who are 5 year kollel learners, who are DL Hesder etc etc. So I don't really have any assumptions about the correct order or inclusion of various options in life, such as graduation from high school, or college, or business school, or whatever. Everyone does their own thing.

I am still interested in what your boys think about their lifelong self sufficiency, or if this is not a subject discussed at any point within your family.

I know some families where it seems that to even be considering some kind of financial future is verboten - this is not about some perceived proper order of secular or career orientated education and marriage, children etc, just about planning and the idea of taking on board financial adulthood.

I assume if there is intention to learn full time forever, one must also actively and personally plan how to fund this, and the options. I know some people who do so via savvy investments since they were teens, and are still going strong with limited time input required. But that took some planning and parental advice at a young age (and a smaller startup fund than you might imagine!).

I just wondered what your boys and their friends think, if they do, about what will be when they are all grown up and have a big family of their own, which will happen before they know it, especially if, as you say, your boys get married young.Or is it something that they and you consider doesn't need to be dealt with until it becomes a pressing need, which is also a valid choice?

We don't actively and personally plan how to fund anything. No savvy investments. We take things as they come and trust in Hashem. It all comes together and our kids build beautiful families and find appropriate professions. There are plenty of loans available for schooling.

And for the record, all my kids know that they will be self sufficient. Noone's planning on living off Mom and Dad. Noone can in Israel! We do our hishtadlus and Hashem does the rest. So, yes. I would have to say that professions are not something that we need to deal with until it becomes a pressing need.

Frumdoc

Sun, Mar 15 2015, 6:14 am

ChossidMom wrote:

Thank you for answering so openly! I will leave you in peace....

ChossidMom

Sun, Mar 15 2015, 9:16 am

amother wrote:

Very interesting. So what I gather from this is that most of you are telling me that there is very little need for a secular education either in elementary nor in high school in order to gain employment.

I don't recall saying that. I will say that my boys all attended/attend cheder. Our cheder doesn't teach English at all (I try to make sure they get English tutoring) and they only teach math till about 7th grade. After that - that's IT. From grade 7 they learn only limudei kodesh.

If someone wants to go to a Charedi college and study law, for example, he is going to have to make up certain secular studies. If someone wants to study something for which he needs math, he'll have to make up the math. Luckily, boys who spent years learning kodesh subjects usually pick up the other stuff rather fast. Many charedim attend these Charedi colleges and learn things like psychology, computers, architecture etc. None of these guys learned secular studies in cheder. None of them. Our boys make up for "lost" time and material and can go far, should they wish to. Some go into business or become plumbers. Whatever floats their boat and gives them satisfaction and brings in the bread.

finallyamommy

Sun, Mar 15 2015, 9:22 am

ChossidMom wrote:

I gotta say, ChossidMom, I don't know you, but this kind of bitachon is amazing. I'm in awe. I'm not anywhere near that parsha (no kids yet), but you are an inspiration! I hope I can raise my kids iy"H the way you're describing in this thread.

ChossidMom

Sun, Mar 15 2015, 9:41 am

esheschayil wrote:

Thank you.
We seriously do live on another plane here.

By the way, I'm doing a workshop in Positive Thinking given by Chaya Hinda Allen. She comes to my neighborhood but she also does them over the phone and internet. This workshop is a life changer for many women. Google it if you are interested in increasing your positivity/emuna/bitachon.
Here is her site: http://www.jpthink.com/program.....hinda
This is Chaya Hinda: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmCgQ4FA4iE

I have never heard anyone teach stuff that is so not heeby jeeby but based completely on Torah sources. Good stuff.

finallyamommy

Sun, Mar 15 2015, 10:09 am

ChossidMom wrote:

This looks amazing! Thank you so much!

amother

Sun, Mar 15 2015, 3:40 pm

esheschayil wrote:

Its nice that chossidmom has bitachon but I cant help wonder if neglecting to provide your kids a proper education goes against Torah itself. Why would you make your kids struggle?
Shulem Deen is coming out with his book, read an excerpt of his book that talks about this very struggle. http://m.forward.com/articles/.....yesh/

MagentaYenta

Sun, Mar 15 2015, 3:46 pm

amother wrote:

I was just reading the article when you posted this link. It will be interesting to hear what other's think of it. Perhaps you would consider a spin off?