Does a worker give a boss mishloach manot first or visa vers

tichellady

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 10:37 am

I felt it was not professional to give my boss mishloach manot. He is my boss not my friend. I also didn't particularly want to go out of my way to see him on my day off.
Btw, I give 13 mishloach Manot, I don't give everyone that I am friendly with or related to. I don't want to spend my whole day running around delivering mm. I probably received 10 total and we were totally fine with that. We worked on truly not caring who didn't give us mm. It's a stressful day that flies by quickly and the point of the day is community unity, not singling out why people didn't give you something and questioning your relationship.

you should expect your employee to be good at work, that's all. She doesn't need to give you any gifts.

21young

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 10:41 am

As a boss you should be showing your appreciation by giving mishloach manot to your worker. You don't have to go to his/her house, you can give it to them at work. It would be nice if they gave you as well, but it's your job to keep your employee happy and show your appreciation. We had something delivered to our boss' house, and they gave us at work, but they give us something really nice at work every year, regardless of whether we send to them.

amother

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 10:53 am

OP here
I thought it was the other way around because over the years when I would drop off my mishloach manot at friends homes they would show me their beautiful mishloach manot they prepared for their husbands boss. I thought it was weird they were spending way over one hundred dollars on it. But I would think a worker should show some hakores hatov to the boss and even drop off their two dollar theme mishloach manot. They definitely don't have to give it on Purim day and take away from their family time.

Scrabble123

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 11:08 am

It really depends on what type of a worker-boss we're talking about. If it's a worker who let's say gets commission on deals that he brings the boss and wants to encourage the boss to offer him leads, it's appropriate to send MM. If you're talking about a secretary that comes in, takes her salary, and goes home, I think that neither need to exchange MM, although it would be nice for the boss to show his appreciation towards his worker. I also think that a Purim Bonus is appropriate, but then again, maybe the boss wants to save the bonus for Pesach.

m in Israel

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 11:23 am

I'm not sure about MM "rules", but the general workplace rules for things like holiday gifts is that you "gift down" the food chain, not up. Meaning the boss should give the employee, not the other way around. So actually, you should be giving her "out of decency". Maybe when your friends made MM for their husband's bosses it was because they knew the boss would be giving something nice and wanted to have something to give back.

I am a little surprised that you actually had something prepared but wouldn't give it because you thought it was her job to give you first! Even if she was in the wrong, why wouldn't you give her what you prepared anyway, to create more "ahava and achva" between you, which of course is the goal of MM!

m in Israel

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 11:32 am

I just googled it to see if the rules I learned about not "gifting up" are considered standard, and it does seem to be the general "rule" according to etiquette experts:

http://www.emilypost.com/on-th.....faqs-

http://money.usnews.com/money/.....wered

Scrabble123

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 11:35 am

amother wrote:

OP here to make it clear my friends husbands were going to their boss's home on Purim day. They were not bringing it to the workplace. I was not bringing mishloach manot specific for this worker on Wednesday to work because many non jews work for me and I was not planning on giving the non jews too. And I didn't want it to look like I was playing favoritism. I do give holiday gifts for non jews and Jews on New Years.

I gave non Jewish individuals that I work with MM this year. They knew that it was purim, and who doesn't appreciate chocolate and wine? It's a nice gesture, and I even gave something to the mailman as well. It's not a requirement, but a personal choice.

Someone told me that he was planning on buying an expensive MM for his boss. I told him to forgo it because of standard workplace etiquette, but since he is new on the job and since all of the other employees gave MM, he did not want to be the only one who did not. It's understandable because he wants to gain favor in his boss's eyes, so the "etiquette" changed because of his place of work. Employees gifting to bosses is not standard: partners, 1099 employees, or offices that regularly interact with one another (attorney and title) often gift one another. Employers should be the ones gifting their employees, but it is not a must with regards to MM IMO.

Maya

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 11:53 am

I'm very familiar with women who make huge, expensive mishlaoch manos for their husband's bosses, but I think it's petty and immature to dwell on the fact that you didn't receive one. Besides, if you're in New York, he or she had perfectly good reason not to come deliver this year; we gave and got half of what we usually do because of the bad weather.

FWIW, my husband gave his Jewish employees expensive bottles of wine, but requested that they do not come to the house or deliver anything, on Purim or after.
As another poster said upthread, it's a day off, no one wants to spend it sucking up to their boss. And as a boss, the same holds true. It's family time, not employee time.

ra_mom

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 4:56 pm

amother wrote:

OP here. Sound like none of you are bosses. I just spoke to a friend whose family owns a business and she said every year all the frum workers come to their home some time over Purim and drop something off. It can be on Tanis Esther or even the day after. Btw I wasn't sitting in my house all day waiting. Question

I'm sorry you put so much emphasis on this and set an expectation for yourself and continue to set that expectation.

tichellady

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 5:00 pm

I am not a boss but neither is your employee so I don't see why that is relevant. My father and husband are both bosses and both thought it was inappropriate for an employee to gift a boss with mm. I asked them when u first started working what they thought about it. I did give my boss a baby gift but that was more for his wife/ baby and it was more about expressing my joy for them thank feeling obligated to give something fancy.
There is obviously no rule about this. Different people have different notions about professional relationships. The point is you should judge your employee in the best light and assume she simply felt it was not professional to give you a mishloach manot. Don't take it personally. Don't hold it against her. Move on. She doesn't owe you anything other than being a good employee.

amother

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 5:14 pm

amother wrote:

I'm a boss. I give to my subordinates.Never to my higher-ups. Giving a gift to your boss, unless it's a farewell gift because she's leaving, can be construed as a not-so-subtle attempt to influence her decisions vis a vis your fate in the company. IOW, BRIBERY, something specifically prohibited in the Torah. In fact I have had subordinates try to give me gifts and I have thanked them for their thoughtfulness but explained gently that I can't accept gifts from people I supervise. That your friend's employees bring her MM doesn't change the basic principle. And for you to be miffed and expect your employees to give you a gift out of "common decency"--are you for real? The correct thing would have been for you, as the boss, to send MM to your employees as a sign of appreciation for the work they do for you. It's called "good labor-management relations".

amother

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 5:18 pm

My DH gives his bosses an expensive M'M on Purim. I can't imagine them coming to our house to give him.

During the holiday season I give my bosses something small and have never gotten back from them.

when my DH used to be in a job where he hired contractors for large jobs they would give us something nice on taanis esther, we would never give back.

Maya

Tue, Mar 10 2015, 5:19 pm

amother wrote:

As I stated, my husband is a boss. Seems like your friend is not a boss either, so if our opinion is not relevant because of that, why are you taking hers so seriously?

I stand by my claim of it being petty and immature to dwell so much on this. I pity your employee because it seems you may be looking at him/her differently now, and he/she doesn't deserve that, certainly not for this.