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Forum -> Parenting our children -> School age children
Long Vent...How to respond to bullying?



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amother
Cerise


 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2015, 11:14 am
Had a traumatic experience: At a bar mitzvah my socially immature 6 year old DS was playing in a basement with an assortment of different aged children. One child (who had clashed with DS earlier that day and I knew the parents would be of no help AT ALL) came to me saying that DS threw a ball at him. Not AT ALL like DS to get violent, and kid looked fine, so I took my time coming down to check on them. Coming down I saw 1. couch blocking only way out of the room, 2. Bully kid and 3 other kids outside of room clearly teasing children in the room, 3. Group of children huddled together in a corner, clearly afraid, and 4. DS bright as a tomato, tears everywhere, unable to get out due to the others blocking his way. I immediately pushed through and grabbed DS and left the house to help him calm down and find out what happened. DS said that the other kids would not let him get out of the room, he screamed and screamed for me but I didn't hear him (I thought kids were safe in playroom and took too long to check on them... I know...). When words didn't work DS threw a ball at them to try and get out. They then threw a "hockey stick!" at DS in retaliation. That's when I came down.

Long story. Sorry

But now: How can I prevent this from happening in the future. Bullies will be bullies but what can I tell my DS? Self defense is not the answer because I would not want DS hittling the other kids. But DS NEEDED to GET OUT of the room. The other kids WOULD NOT LET him! What should he have done? What could he have said to get out of the room? I thought he handled it pretty well all else considered. I told him if other kids try to hurt him in the future he should go into a corner and make himself small like a ball and wait for a grownup to help. DS was worried about the physical harm these kids were doing. DS had scratches all over his face when I checked...

Of course I feel horrible... I have my parental guilt for not checking on him sooner... Hindsight is 20/20 I guess. Dont trust all the other kids to help your son. They were clearly all unable to get out and unsure what to do... Long vent, looking for ideas and chizuk, Anon because told others this story...
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mummiedearest




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2015, 11:27 am
I would specifically tell my kids that if anyone is trapping them physically and they NEED to get out, no one is around to help, etc, that they SHOULD hit, bite, whatever it takes to get out of there. this is not just bullying. this is physically dangerous. really, they threw a hockey stick? and you don't want your kid defending himself? self-defense is about learning when to use physical force. a good self-defense teacher will make sure the kid understands not to hit unless absolutely necessary.
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Fox




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2015, 11:46 am
This is a tough one -- you want your child to defend himself without playing into the bullies' hands, and you want him to use appropriate self-defense methods without applying them in cases where such actions are really not needed.

I think I would stress the concept of "discomfort." Perhaps talk to your child repeatedly, and in casual settings, about the need (and right!) to leave a situation that makes him feel intimidated.

This is the cornerstone of every women's self-defense program I've participated in: if a guy gets into an elevator with you and stands too close despite an otherwise empty elevator, you get off. You don't second-guess whether he's a nice guy who's maybe preoccupied; a socially clueless guy; a guy from a country where personal space norms are different. You don't take the time to worry about whether you're a racist, a classist, or any other kind of "ist." You get off the $*#(!$ elevator!

I think the same principle can be encouraged with kids when it comes to bullying. Bullies, like other predators, "test" their victims before moving in for the kill. If the potential victim picks up on the subtle signs of intimidation and removes him/herself, the bully can't easily escalate the abuse.

Obviously, this isn't a complete answer. There are circumstances in which kids *can't* remove themselves for various reasons, and there are kids who have trouble picking up signs of intimidation until it's too late. So I'm definitely not trying to claim that we can eliminate bullying by simply teaching victims to make themselves scarce.

Still, I think it's a good place to start, and learning to trust your self-preservation instincts is good skill to encourage and cultivate from a young age.
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amother
Cerise


 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2015, 12:23 pm
OP here: I do want DS to be able to defend himself physically but he is immature socially and I am not sure he would know when it is appropriate to fight physically and when not to. Fox put it very well "you want your child to defend himself without playing into the bullies' hands, and you want him to use appropriate self-defense methods without applying them in cases where such actions are really not needed." (Sorry I cant figure out how to quote.)

mummiedearest - do you think a young for his age 6 year old can learn, even with good teachers, when is ok to hit back and when it is not ok?

In this situation I feel that hitting back would not have worked. He was outnumbered and trapped 3 bigger kids to 1 small kid. He would have ended up worse than a hockey stick and scratches. Also my son said a hockey stick but it is more likely it was a smaller stick or toy of some sort as there was no big bump or sore spot on him. But still possible it was a big stick...

He is still learning how to "use his words" to express his needs, not just wants. I feel teaching him how to "fight back" may hamper his learning to express verbally. Any thoughts?

Also should I have been down there with the kids? There were around 12 kids down there and no parents. I thought I was able to hear the kids since I was near the stairs, but I was wrong... When is it ok to enjoy the "adult time" and leave your kids to make their own "safe play" decisions." If there was any problems he SHOULD HAVE been able to come upstairs and get me. I was right there...
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mummiedearest




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2015, 12:32 pm
amother wrote:
OP here: I do want DS to be able to defend himself physically but he is immature socially and I am not sure he would know when it is appropriate to fight physically and when not to. Fox put it very well "you want your child to defend himself without playing into the bullies' hands, and you want him to use appropriate self-defense methods without applying them in cases where such actions are really not needed." (Sorry I cant figure out how to quote.)

mummiedearest - do you think a young for his age 6 year old can learn, even with good teachers, when is ok to hit back and when it is not ok?

In this situation I feel that hitting back would not have worked. He was outnumbered and trapped 3 bigger kids to 1 small kid. He would have ended up worse than a hockey stick and scratches. Also my son said a hockey stick but it is more likely it was a smaller stick or toy of some sort as there was no big bump or sore spot on him. But still possible it was a big stick...

He is still learning how to "use his words" to express his needs, not just wants. I feel teaching him how to "fight back" may hamper his learning to express verbally. Any thoughts?

Also should I have been down there with the kids? There were around 12 kids down there and no parents. I thought I was able to hear the kids since I was near the stairs, but I was wrong... When is it ok to enjoy the "adult time" and leave your kids to make their own "safe play" decisions." If there was any problems he SHOULD HAVE been able to come upstairs and get me. I was right there...


I do think that a six-year-old should be capable of learning when to and when not to use hands. a good self-defense teacher will discuss different scenarios and how to know what to do. I think it would help you to speak to a really good karate teacher and get his/her opinion. since your child is socially immature, it might be worth it to discuss this with a therapist as well, just to see what you can expect of him. I don't think learning to defend yourself hampers the ability to learn to express yourself vocally. and I do think you should accompany your child downstairs when playing with these kids. I think it's safe to leave them alone when you know they're already friends and your son is socially comfortable with this particular group.
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Fox




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2015, 12:41 pm
No guilt, Cerise Amother! I absolutely forbid it!

I don't know whether in this specific instance you "should" have done something different. Maybe. Maybe not.

But even if you are the absolute most perfect mother on the planet, you are not going to be able to protect your child 24/7. No matter what you do, he is going to have some frightening and disturbing situations. The fact that you *were* there means that he will likely be able to learn from this experience without being too traumatized.

Talk to him about it; emphathize with how frightened he felt, and let him know that those feelings are normal and are experienced by almost everyone.

Discuss ways to avoid such situations in the future, and give him permission to listen to his instincts when it comes to people. I think it's important not to demonize anyone -- then you're making him be responsible for guessing people's motivations and intentions. Just keep it simple: some people don't know how to behave, and when we begin to feel uncomfortable, we need to leave immediately or get an adult.

If you're able to help him develop and tune his instincts, he'll not only be better able to avoid bullies, he'll also be better able to avoid molesters, manipulators, and miscreants of all descriptions.
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Dolly Welsh




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2015, 12:49 pm
1) this is just kid baloney. let it pass.

2) leaving any kids alone in a mob is asking for Lord of the Flies (a book). Sorry OP that's not stupid, it is criminal. Some bored adult has to make the sacrifice of being on Kid Duty. No adult present means you are lucky it wasn't much, much worse. Bad puppy.

3) as for advising your son how to cope with his life in general, I think consulting a professional would be useful. Your curl up in a ball advice may have value or may not, I don't know as I am not a professional. But too much is at stake to wing it and make it up as you go along. You are not a professional. Get at least one professional opinion.

Do not be amazed by this incident. It is entirely expected considering the circumstances.

This will not permanently traumatize your kid.

He had an incident. He has learned. However he seriously needs skilled help.

I wonder how YOU would like being left alone in an enclosed basement with a large group of adults who could not read, had never heard of law, and had hands. Think about it.

Really.
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Dolly Welsh




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2015, 12:52 pm
I am disagreeing with Fox. How can this be? This never happened before.
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