Bait and switch | Imamother

amother

Violet

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 10:40 am

I am the amother who had guests eat her Purim cookies and had a thread about who cleans for Pesach guests. In the end I heavy cleaned for the guests.

I was told the guests would be the daughter and her 7 kids and husband. Then they switched it to their son his daughter and wife. Right before Pesach they switched it to a stranger. I have warned them before that I don't want any wacky guests.

The guest was a slob and noisy. He kept me up a few nights. He also had a very loud argument with someone and scared my kids. Friday, I heard him going upstairs in an area that I sold off. DH thinks it was kids going through our stuff. Regardless no one would be there if we didn't have a guest. I am entitled to my privacy.

On shabbos I had some guests who went into my bedroom. While this had nothing to do with my neighbor's guest, it was an invasion and further irritated me.

Last night I finally lost it. The guest left late and from midnight to 12:30 the guest and/or friends of his were banging a heavy metal door going on and out around two dozen times. DH was out. I banged on the door between our areas and told him to stop banging the door because he was waking up the kids.

I am now embarrassed how immature I behaved. I don't know whether to apologize for screaming at their guest or tell them how bad the guest was. When DH came home, they apologized 3 times for the door banging. Should I say nothing and just wait until they ask me to host again?

Also what do I do about guests who don't stay in the dining room and kitchen?

Thanks in advance.

vintagebknyc

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 10:45 am

you don't need to apologize for the banging, you were reacting to their extreme rudeness.

the person you need to speak with is the original guests who eat all your food and bring weirdos to your home. you can admit that you feel you kinda lost it with the banging, but that's what's prompting you to talk with her. if you don't like confrontation (personally, I hate it), you can write a letter/email. just don't send it for a few days so you have time to simmer down--me, I always need that time to regroup and sound sane.

you've opened your home to people who've abused your generosity. you're not the bad guy here!

amother

Violet

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 10:53 am

MamaBear wrote:

Stop having guests that are not your own friends or family. I mean it - just say no and never look back. Why put up with all this?

I keep saying no and then people beg because there is no space around here. I had a rabbi call me to tell me to do the mitzvah.[I wrote about it in another thread. ] I know the daughter who was originally supposed to stay here and her situation is bad so I relented. I feel played.

What do I do with my own guests who feel free to explore my home? This is an ongoing problem. Why do people feel they can do this? I don't want to be the police.

amother

Magenta

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 11:02 am

Since I hate face to face confrontation I would write a letter to the woman whose guests were such a problem. I would not mince words either. Then I would tell her I will never ever host for her guests again. She has been given two chances and twice it has gone badly. No more. Then I would send this rabbi who is manipulating you into hosting (and tell her I am going to) a copy of the letter I sent to her and his own that says oif he needs someone to host her family for a giant mitzvah he should look no further than his own front door.

Then later if either one tries to push you into doing it I would say "Sorry, no. We talked about this". Repeat as necessary.

You do not have to host people like that. The whole bait and switch thing...that would have sealed the deal for me.

amother

Magenta

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 11:08 am

amother wrote:

Confront them! If they are somewhere they are not supposed to be say what are you doing here????

I have no problem with in the moment confrontation like that. When the cookies were out I would have said "who ate these special cookies? I didn't put them out for you! I worked ages on those, how are you going to replace them?".

Be firm! It is your house! Say do not go in my room! These areas are for you, do not go anywhere else! Even at my mothers I would never dream of helping myself to rooms not for me. I would never snoop in her closet or go into my brothers room or start digging through things. I would not even eat anything from her cupboards or fridge without asking. And I have been given the gonahead to make myself at home.

amother

Violet

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 11:20 am

amother wrote:

I am so not the type to say that. I wish I were. I feel really bad yelling last night.

The guests, both mine and the neighbors, were also going into storage rooms with chometz stickers on it also. DH makes every excuse to DKLZ these people so he is not sympathetic. He said I should have asked nicely for them not to bang the door.

amother

Violet

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 12:58 pm

Rubber Ducky wrote:

Post your house rules for being a good guest in a prominent place, like on their bedroom door. It will help.

These were my eating guests. DH DKLZs them so I am on my own. His answer is that they were already there so what can be do now. I end up looking like the shrew for not wanting people in my bedroom, etc.

amother

Violet

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 1:02 pm

SRS wrote:

It sounds like people can bait and switch you. Perhaps you can work with someone on becoming a more firm person. Your stories are so crazy they seem like fiction, but reality can be stranger than fiction. Be strong.

I have a lovely house so maybe people want to see it. IDK. I am a private person so my desire for privacy is strong. DH is flattered and thinks I should be also while I feel violated.

zaq

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 2:05 pm

Quit being a victim. Tell your rabbi and your friends and neighbors to stop being tzaddikim on your cheshbon. They love hachnassat orchim so much, let THEM host these characters. Your home is not a hotel and you have a right to decide who does and does not have access. (Went into your bedroom? What the hey??? Who does that?) Your hachnassat orchim should be YOUR hachnassat orchim, not somebody else's.

JAWSCIENCE

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 2:28 pm

The bait and switch is not OK. When people say "Oh DD is not coming but this random guy is" You need to get a backbone and reply "No. I said I could host DD because I am comfortable with her in my home. I have young kids and have had guests behave inappropriately before, putting them and me in danger. We know have a policy not to take any guests we do not personally know. It is not a matter of space." If they push keep saying "The space will remain empty faster than go to someone I do not know. I am not required to put my family in danger to host YOUR guests". zehu. Rabbi calls? Tell him the EXACT SAME THING> He gives you some BS about the mitzvah being more important than your safety? Refer him to a wiser Rabbi and tell him that if he gets that Rabbi to write you a public psak that one should put the safety and well being of their kids behind the non existent mitzvah of hosting people who have homes so that they can eat by their friends for a holiday, then you might reconsider. He tells you he is sure they are safe? Tell him he needs to sign a document stating he is responsible for any and all damages incurred.

As for the guests wandering into your room - it is weird, especially if your door was locked, but if you truy have a beautiful home I can think of a few people who would wander in to "view" it. It is rude and socially awkward, but I definitely see it happening. I can only offer hugs since you were the one to invite these people over in the first place and I would hate to lose the ability to have lunch guests because one wandered into my room. Now if this person actually went through your stuff, that is seriously disturbing.

You sound like you put up with a lot. I would have shuttered my doors long ago...

strawberry cola

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 2:49 pm

Beautiful answer, JAWSCIENCE.
I think a core issue here , OP, is getting you and your dh to be on board with each other. Even if you have different opinions, you can learn to support each other. Is there some wise, qualified person you trust who can help you learn to a. communicate with each other better and b. express yourself in a respectively assertive way - to the neighbor, the guests, whomever-, so that your needs are made clear before you explode in frustration?
Communication skills are a biggie here

geulah papyrus

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 4:05 pm

there were many years where I did everything that people expected and/or asked, including hosting guests I had no desire to host (for many reasons) all because I felt coerced either by individuals, my rabbi, or my community involvement in general. this caused me great distress and made it almost impossible to enjoy times that should have been for family because I was stressed out from having to be the perfect host. when I finally found the strength to stand up for myself and say no, my relief was worth the discomfort of having to say no. you and your family come first, and you don't owe ANYONE an explanation as to how you choose to utilize the space in your home.

amother

Burlywood

Sun, Apr 12 2015, 4:20 pm

my husband is a rabbi and we often get requests for hospitality. While we are happy to host for meals, it is very rare we will host sleeping guests we don't know, or put them up with others. Unless we get excellent references and/or there is a compelling reason they need to stay with a family and not a hotel.