All Who Go Do Not Return

amother

Violet

Fri, Apr 17 2015, 8:39 am

PinkFridge wrote:

I can't help you with the chaser quote but re the burd quote, there's a famous story involving Mike Tress, zt"l. A chosid asked the Rebbe how he could give Mr. Tress such kavod as he didn't have a beard and the Rebbe said, "When Mr. Tress reaches 120, he will be asked, Jew, Jew, where's your beard? But some people will be asked [maybe the Rebbe said, you will be asked, I don't know], Beard, beard, where is your Jew?"

Ironically, that quote is now the chorus of a song by Lipa... an anthem for Modern Chassidim based on words from the Satmar Rebbe... Twisted Evil

Just to add to puce's comment, I was told the rebbe didn't designate a successor because he wanted Satmar to be a movement based on the shittah, not a rebbisteve based on a personality.

The Bnei Yoel faction implemented that idea by rejecting the previous Satmar Rebbe, and their group doesn't have a rebbe.

Maya

Fri, Apr 17 2015, 10:15 am

amother wrote:

Ftr, the Satmar rebbe was actually quite supportive of critical thought and making your own decisions. Was often quoted that people must think for themselves, a rebbe has too much power to mess people up... And wasnt impressed by exteriors. Quotes include burd, vee is dein Yid? If a rebbe eats chazer.. Don't remember exact words...

Lol.

Maya

Fri, Apr 17 2015, 10:18 am

PinkFridge wrote:

And yet, his biographer proudly writes of a story where the rebbe refused to give a bracha to a modern boy until he shaved off his "chup" (hairdo).

a jewish woman

Fri, Apr 17 2015, 10:28 am

amother wrote:

Right. Thats why satmar girls dont learn chumash, dont take regents or even graduate with a high school diploma, dont go to college, dont drive, wear seams, dont date, and shave their heads after marrying a stranger because they are all thinking critically about it and making their own decisions which the satmar rebbe supported. And I have a bridge to sell you.

Maya

Fri, Apr 17 2015, 10:29 am

amother wrote:

Right. Thats why satmar girls dont learn chumash, dont take regents or even graduate with a high school diploma, dont go to college, dont drive, wear seams, dont date, and shave their heads after marrying a stranger because they are all thinking critical about it and making their own decisions which the satmar rebbe supported. And I have a bridge to sell you.

Plus he shared his power with many other decision makers and thinkers, right?
I don't know where that amother came up with these ridiculous "quotes."

gp2.0

Fri, Apr 17 2015, 11:14 am

amother wrote:

Hey, I am 100% sure all of these girls and ladies thought critically about all those decisions. After all, just because they came to different conclusions doesn't mean they didn't think critically!

Twisted Evil

PinkFridge

Fri, Apr 17 2015, 11:25 am

Maya wrote:

And yet, his biographer proudly writes of a story where the rebbe refused to give a bracha to a modern boy until he shaved off his "chup" (hairdo).

I don't know the story. I'd like to think that he might have known a bit about this kid. If not, maybe he felt differently about a chup (when was this? 70s?) than a 40s era hero and tzaddik.

Maya

Fri, Apr 17 2015, 11:30 am

PinkFridge wrote:

I don't know the story. I'd like to think that he might have known a bit about this kid. If not, maybe he felt differently about a chup (when was this? 70s?) than a 40s era hero and tzaddik.

No, sorry. All these stories about him accepting all sorts of Jews is just a very good PR machine. In reality, he railed against those Jews to his Chassidim in private derashos which didn't get publicized in the newspapers. I went to his school for twelve years and read two of his biographies and Yiddish seforim. I know what his views were on Jews who were not Satmar Chassidim.

Maya

Fri, Apr 17 2015, 11:30 am

gp2.0 wrote:

fmt4

Fri, Apr 17 2015, 5:49 pm

Just so you know, Shulem Deen or someone he knows must be reading this post, because he mentions it on a Facebook post. Here's part of it:

"
I will also confess an unease: I have already seen attempts to dismiss my book because my background was unusual. I agree that it was, and I expected this fully. But I do feel uneasy with those who overlay a family history over an individual journey and ascribe too much to it. I think Shaul does this as much as the women of Imamother.com--although Shaul does it in a way that is kind and generous and thought-provoking, and it feels correct in many ways--which cannot be said for some of the others."

fmt4

Fri, Apr 17 2015, 6:03 pm

Here is a link to the article by Shaul Magid that he is referring to. It's very beautifully written and I think can give a better idea of where Shulem is coming from.
http://tabletmag.com/jewish-ar.....d-din

sequoia

Fri, Apr 17 2015, 6:11 pm

fmt4 wrote:

I linked to that post 14 pages ago.

cookiecutter

Sat, Apr 18 2015, 10:23 pm

Maya wrote:

How do you know which message he meant more sincerely?

amother

Black

Sun, Apr 19 2015, 6:49 am

Maya wrote:

Sorry Maya, but accepting all Jews and helping them out when necessary, and telling his Chassidim not to be like them, are two VERY different things!

It's okay to acknowledge the positive aspects whilst simultaneously disagreeing with the not-so-positive aspects. Don't throw out the baby with the bathwater.

PinkFridge

Sun, Apr 19 2015, 8:16 am

amother wrote:

There's a classic (and some might allege, apocryphal) story of someone - I forgot who, it was someone with enough prominence to confer legitimacy to his memories - who somehow found himself asking the rebbe for a donation to (brain freeze, forgot the name of the institution for developing Torah schools in E"Y, kind of like Torah Umesorah in America) in the fifties, and the Rebbe took one hand and railed against this organization and stuffed his other hand with bills.

Clarissa

Sun, Apr 19 2015, 12:46 pm

amother wrote:

I agree that we can get too strident with our opinions and sometimes refuse to acknowledge the good. We all need to be careful to not be screaming about how tolerant and open-minded we are while exhibiting the opposite behavior. I’m not addressing anybody here (really!) -- just talking about myself as well as other people.

Iymnok

Sun, Apr 19 2015, 12:54 pm

PinkFridge wrote:

Probably chinuch atzmai.

leah233

Sun, Apr 19 2015, 1:49 pm

Is Shaul Maggid frum?

Personal question for Deen since he indicated he is reading this.(I wouldn't comment otherwise and did not read the book)

How could you possibly have though that your wife may need surgery to have a baby. Didn't you know the difference between a Cesarian and natural birth from halacha? (e.g. bris on Shabbos, Pidyan Haben etc)

Are you sure your mind isn't playing tricks with you?

Last edited by leah233 on Sun, Apr 19 2015, 2:13 pm; edited 1 time in total