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You think your kids won't talk to strangers think twice
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blueberries




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, May 03 2015, 11:23 pm

When I watched this video it scared me how easy it is for a stranger to take away a child.
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youngishbear




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, May 03 2015, 11:51 pm
Did the kids perhaps see the guy talking to their mothers? In that case they may have decided that he's not a stranger.

This is so scary.

My kids don't like puppies but they do like balloons... and lolipops... and lots of things.
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ra_mom




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, May 03 2015, 11:57 pm
There was a very extensive article I came across a few years ago that provides a lot of information.
http://www.imamother.com/forum.....anger

Quote:
Prevention Contention
As children, most of us were taught never to speak to strangers and never to accept candy from a stranger. However, safety experts today claim that this advice is, in fact, more confusing than helpful to children. Kids often think that strangers who may hurt them are mean-looking and disheveled. Child Safety Expert Ken Wooden insists that teaching children not to speak to strangers is, in fact, the biggest mistake parents make. "In the eyes of a kid, a stranger is a character who is a very scary and monster-type, but in reality, he [the stranger] comes across looking like a very nice guy, and very engaging," Wooden explains. Wooden has studied thousands of child abductors during his career. "The people I interviewed are not scary looking; they're friendly."

In making hard-and-fast rules about not talking to strangers, we have to take into account the situation if a child is lost and there are no familiar adults nearby. To whom will the child turn for help? {INSERT: Tell your child that in an emergency he/she should go over to the nearest mom with kids (stroller) or run into the nearest retail store and ask for help} There have been several situations where missing children actually hid from the search-and-rescue teams because they perceived them as strangers. "We need to teach kids things that are actually going to help them if they're in trouble," says Nancy McBride. "We really need to teach children about situations to avoid and to be concerned about - not people. We can't tell kids who the good people are and who the bad people are.

Lurking Lures
While all children are vulnerable and can easily be lured away, children ages 8-12 are at the highest risk of being abducted. It is particularly important to teach children in this age group about dangerous adult behaviors so that they have a greater awareness when they are in an unsafe predicament. This can be accomplished by talking to kids about the various lures most commonly used by perpetrators. After interviewing hundreds of convicted abductors, Ken Wooden uncovered strategies these people use to entrap their victims. In his Child Lure Prevention program, Ken familiarizes children with the most frequently used lures.

The Assistance Lure
Perpetrators may try to appeal for assistance from children. They may claim to be lost and ask for directions, or request a child's help with packages, and in some instances - pretend to be disabled. Sadly, this lure turns out to be the greatest threat to human life. Tell children that adults who need assistance should get it from other adults, not children. They don't need to be polite in these situations, they need to be safe. Children should pretend that they didn't hear the request and run away in the opposite direction.

The Bribery Lure
Lurking kids with candy, toys, or other gifts still happens, and it still works. Yet, money is the most effective bribe. When children are bribed they are warned not to tell their parents. Discuss with your children that it's never okay for an adult to ask them to keep a secret from their parents. Children should know that they can always share secrets with you, especially if the secrets make them feel upset or scared. Parents should always inquire about unexplained gifts. Who gave them to your child? Why and when were they given?

The Emergency Lure
Perpetrators may fake a crisis in order to trick children to follow them. One common scenario is telling a youngster that "Mommy had an accident and she asked me to come get you." Talk to your children about this lure and have an emergency plan in place with your children. Who will contact them in case of emergency and whom do they need to all if there is an emergency? {INSERT: set up a code with your kids}

The Pet Lure
Most children are fascinated by animals and can easily be lured away with the promise of being able to see a litter of newborn kittens or when asked to help look for a lost puppy. Children must know never to enter anyone's home or car without parental permission. They should never respond to such requests and should report the incident to their caregivers.

The Affection Lure
Children who are starved for attention are especially vulnerable to this type of entrapment. They will blindly follow their abductors in exchange for being listened to, praised, or shown other forms of affection. Children should know that nobody may touch them in a way that makes them feel uncomfortable. If an adult tries to touch them they should yell "NO!" and run away. Encourage your children to immediately report such incidents.

Creating a Scene
While familiarizing youngsters with the lures used by abductors proved to be the most effective way to prevent abductions, the NCME has some compelling evidence that parents will want to know about. Thousands of children in the United States are lured away each year. But the good news is that many do manage to get away from their abductors. How? Eighty-eight percent of these children created a scene. They yelled, fought, kicked, screamed, and flailed. "All of these things need to be done so that the child does not get into the vehicle or so that the child does not get abducted by that person." McBride warns parents. "I'd much rather know about attempted abductions where kids got away that be part of an abduction where the child is unfortunately taken."


Last edited by ra_mom on Mon, May 04 2015, 12:33 am; edited 1 time in total
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zaq




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 12:03 am
I have to wonder about the moms who not only shake hands with and talk to a guy they don't know but fall for his story about "doing a social experiment" and then blithely POINT OUT THEIR KID TO A GUY THEY DON'T KNOW. I'd like to think that I would have been off that bench and herding my kids for home the moment that guy plunked himself down beside me.
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MagentaYenta




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 12:16 am
When this video first came out a few years ago, it was pretty obvious that they chose a 'perp' who was neat, clean well dressed and reasonably attractive.
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sequoia




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 12:25 am
And sounds like Adam Sandler.
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zaq




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 12:32 am
MagentaYenta wrote:
When this video first came out a few years ago, it was pretty obvious that they chose a 'perp' who was neat, clean well dressed and reasonably attractive.


Well, sure. Because if he'd been scuzzy and reeked of beer, the playground would have emptied out before he got two feet inside, and someone would have been calling the cops.

So it's not my imagination that he's somewhat cute?
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MagentaYenta




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 12:40 am
zaq wrote:
Well, sure. Because if he'd been scuzzy and reeked of beer, the playground would have emptied out before he got two feet inside, and someone would have been calling the cops.

So it's not my imagination that he's somewhat cute?


I'd give him a 6.
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seeker




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 12:54 am
What bugs me is how many adults think kids should respond to them. I live in a very urban setting, in a large building where even I am not familiar with all the neighbors, and random people will meet in the elevator and say hello to my kids and/or ask how old they are and they feel like they're being put on the spot. I always tell them they're doing the right thing by not talking to strangers and that the adult was wrong for addressing them directly like that, but it happens all the time! I really think the majority of these people are trying to be friendly and neighborly, not pervy, but they should use their brains more! Doesn't everyone know that kids shouldn't talk to strangers? Well if you don't know the kid well enough to rightfully know their name or age then you are a stranger and have no business talking to them or asking that stuff!
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salt




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 1:33 am
Probably totally staged. The whole thing. Sorry to be cynical.
And if not, the kid probably saw the guy sitting down and talking to their mum, so could have thought he was a friend of the mum.
Good to arouse awareness though.
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ora_43




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 3:08 am
seeker wrote:
What bugs me is how many adults think kids should respond to them. I live in a very urban setting, in a large building where even I am not familiar with all the neighbors, and random people will meet in the elevator and say hello to my kids and/or ask how old they are and they feel like they're being put on the spot. I always tell them they're doing the right thing by not talking to strangers and that the adult was wrong for addressing them directly like that, but it happens all the time! I really think the majority of these people are trying to be friendly and neighborly, not pervy, but they should use their brains more! Doesn't everyone know that kids shouldn't talk to strangers? Well if you don't know the kid well enough to rightfully know their name or age then you are a stranger and have no business talking to them or asking that stuff!

... no?

Why would it be unsafe for a child to say "hi" to someone when their mother is right there next to them? Is the idea that if they learn to not ignore people they don't know, they'll be more likely to go along with an abductor if their mother isn't there? I'm not convinced that follows.

If anything I think it might be safer to teach kids to be friendly to strangers, but not to go away with them. Because if chv"s they are in a bad situation, the other adults nearby - the ones who might be in a position to help - might also be strangers. You don't want your kid so convinced strangers are bad that they wouldn't seek help.

And also because it's not realistic to expect kids to never talk to strangers. My kid's preschool teacher was a stranger just a few months ago. It could confuse them to tell them not to talk to strangers, while expecting them to talk to the "good" strangers, ie, people we the parents don't view as strangers.

And also because we all have to start being civil to strangers at some point, while still being cautious. So better to start teaching kids how to walk that line sooner rather than later. JMHO.

I'm not trying to argue you out of your opinion. Just arguing on behalf of all the many people who are a part of "everyone," but don't think it's bad to be friendly to small children. To be honest in my neighborhood I doubt it would occur to a single person that talking to a child might be a bad thing to do.
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 3:52 am
ora_43 wrote:
... no?

Why would it be unsafe for a child to say "hi" to someone when their mother is right there next to them? Is the idea that if they learn to not ignore people they don't know, they'll be more likely to go along with an abductor if their mother isn't there? I'm not convinced that follows.

If anything I think it might be safer to teach kids to be friendly to strangers, but not to go away with them. Because if chv"s they are in a bad situation, the other adults nearby - the ones who might be in a position to help - might also be strangers. You don't want your kid so convinced strangers are bad that they wouldn't seek help.

And also because it's not realistic to expect kids to never talk to strangers. My kid's preschool teacher was a stranger just a few months ago. It could confuse them to tell them not to talk to strangers, while expecting them to talk to the "good" strangers, ie, people we the parents don't view as strangers.

And also because we all have to start being civil to strangers at some point, while still being cautious. So better to start teaching kids how to walk that line sooner rather than later. JMHO.

I'm not trying to argue you out of your opinion. Just arguing on behalf of all the many people who are a part of "everyone," but don't think it's bad to be friendly to small children. To be honest in my neighborhood I doubt it would occur to a single person that talking to a child might be a bad thing to do.


Oh my gosh, you are my FAVORITE person today!

Thank you for being a voice of reason and putting some balance to the whole "stranger danger" hysteria.
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amother
Beige


 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 6:47 am
Quote:
As children, most of us were taught never to speak to strangers and never to accept candy from a stranger. However, safety experts today claim that this advice is, in fact, more confusing than helpful to children. Kids often think that strangers who may hurt them are mean-looking and disheveled. Child Safety Expert Ken Wooden insists that teaching children not to speak to strangers is, in fact, the biggest mistake parents make. "In the eyes of a kid, a stranger is a character who is a very scary and monster-type, but in reality, he [the stranger] comes across looking like a very nice guy, and very engaging," Wooden explains. Wooden has studied thousands of child abductors during his career. "The people I interviewed are not scary looking; they're friendly."


I think one fact that contributes to this misconception that strangers are scary mean-looking characters, is the fact that the very word "stranger" - sounds like the word "strange". Therefore, the concept of a stranger conjours up the image of a "strange" looking person.

Also in hebrew - "zar" is a "stranger", which sounds like "muzar" strange.

I'm pretty sure this is where kids get that image from.
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mommy3b2c




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 8:06 am
zaq wrote:
I have to wonder about the moms who not only shake hands with and talk to a guy they don't know but fall for his story about "doing a social experiment" and then blithely POINT OUT THEIR KID TO A GUY THEY DON'T KNOW. I'd like to think that I would have been off that bench and herding my kids for home the moment that guy plunked himself down beside me.


Should I be embarrassed? I totally would have let the guy do the experiment. I would be watching the whole time, so I wouldn't be nervous. I'm curious what my kids would do. They would for sure talk to the guy and play witht the puppy. They would not take his hand though.
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mommy3b2c




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 8:11 am
FranticFrummie wrote:
Oh my gosh, you are my FAVORITE person today!

Thank you for being a voice of reason and putting some balance to the whole "stranger danger" hysteria.


Believe it or not, I agree with this too. Like a said, in another post, my kids would for sure talk to the man, but they would also not take his hand and ask permission to see the "other puppies." I don't teach my kids not to talk to strangers. I teach them not to take treats from them, or go anywhere with them.
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ven




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 11:29 am
A pervert here abducted in total 8 teenage girls with his young child in the backseat stating he needed to drive to a hospital in an emergency. The girls all went into the car... We can only hope our children stay safe... And yes his wife knew what he was doing and that their kid was the lure.. U can never be prepared against such evil
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luvinlife




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 1:04 pm
the main point is that telling children to not talk to strangers daily aint gonna do it! when a child comes in a situation with a stranger they don't necessarily put it together that they are strangers. you need to role play with your children different scenerios and practice with them to scream "no". literally have them scream and practice all the time.
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debsey




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 1:18 pm
Yesterday, my daughter answered the door. She is four. I was downstairs working on cleaning up from a project (renovation).

Her brother (14) was watching her, but he was in the kitchen. She had gone to the bathroom, which is right next to the front door. When she heard a knock, she answered it, and then came running down to the basement saying "Mommy, there's a tzadik here to see you." I came upstairs - it was a meshulach.
What scared me is that I have DRILLED into her, OVER AND OVER, that we DON'T ANSWER THE DOOR, we tell a grownup to come.

Plus her characterization of the man (who had a long white beard) as a "tzadik" scared me. What if the "tzadik" snatched her!?

I had a long talk with my son and with her. My son said - I was in the kitchen- she didn't tell me she's going to answer the door, and I didn't hear the knock!

I was around - I just was cleaning in the basement - and nothing happened - but I was shaken up.
I said to her - Why didn't you call a grownup? She said - because there was no grownup upstairs!
I said - your big brother is the grownup who was watching you. She said "Oh."

And this is a kid who has been really sensitized to safety rules because I'm a bit neurotic about them.
Four year olds are really little and they make elementary mistakes.
I dk what the solution is.

What we did is I practiced it. I put on a costume, I knocked and she didn't answer. I knocked, she ran to get her brother. I knocked, she just walked upstairs. We turned it into a game, and I'm glad we practiced it, but it is just scary.
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Laiya




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 3:37 pm
My new favorite book is "Protecting the Gift", by Gavin De Becker. Has amazing advice on teaching children to be safe and this whole topic
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gp2.0




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 04 2015, 4:03 pm
zaq wrote:
I have to wonder about the moms who not only shake hands with and talk to a guy they don't know but fall for his story about "doing a social experiment" and then blithely POINT OUT THEIR KID TO A GUY THEY DON'T KNOW. I'd like to think that I would have been off that bench and herding my kids for home the moment that guy plunked himself down beside me.


I was thinking the same thing!!! Why are these women blindly trusting a stranger?

I just tested this with my 5 year old. We've gone through the puppy/lollipop scenario before. So I asked her, "what if you were playing in the park and a man you don't know asks you to pet his puppy? Would you? And she said "no! I would come ask you!" then I said, "what if he tells you to come see more puppies in his car? Would you go?" and she said "no! I would come ask you!"

HOWEVER that is a scenario we have gone through over and over, and seeing a puppy IRL might be different because it is more distracting. What shocked me was what happened next, I asked her, "what if a man came over to you and told you he needs help, he has an emergency, his little girl is hurt and he needs your help, will you go with him?"

And her answer was an emphatic "Yes! Because I love to do mitzvos!"

Oy vey. Sad Apparently little kids can't connect the dots the way we can and extrapolate that in every kind of similar situation (strange grownup) the same rules apply. So now she knows that if a stranger asks her for help she should come running to me because a grownup needs help from another grownup, not from a little kid.

Probably the only way to teach this effectively is to actually do it the way it was done in the video, with a stranger (to the child, but someone you know) randomly approaching the child in several different kinds of scenarios to reinforce the point.
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