Corporate Job: Fridays and Yomtov

amother

cornflower

Thu, Jun 18 2015, 3:34 pm

I'm about to start working in a huge corporation, and just wanted to hear other people's experiences with leaving early on Fridays and taking off for yomtov. I have no problem coming in early/leaving late on other days of the week, but just don't know where to to start with introducing the concepts without appearing flaky.

What have your experiences been like? Mainly positive, or negative?

Do you have any frum colleagues? Do you feel that this makes a big difference?

Please share your thoughts.

tigerwife

Thu, Jun 18 2015, 3:54 pm

It makes a difference if you have drum colleagues because then it means they are familiar with your predicament.

Did you mention anything at your interview?

Can you take overtime on Sunday's to make up for Fridays (this should only be an issue in the winter).

Is the office open at all on Legal Holidays? Can you work those days? You want to save as many vacation days as you can for YT, especially when it comes out in middle of the week.

amother

cornflower

Thu, Jun 18 2015, 3:58 pm

I have not mentioned anything yet at all, although I made sure that the contract had an hourly requirement vs. a specific schedule requirement. They do have off on legal holidays, and I'd be happy to offer overtime work to make up for any lost hours.

I just want to make sure I go about it tactfully and professionally without upsetting the culture, especially because leaving early on Fridays is a common issue in secular society for people eager to start their weekends.

groisamomma

Thu, Jun 18 2015, 4:10 pm

I should hope you didn't mention it before you signed a contract. Bring it to the attention of your immediate supervisor only and let him/her guide you if arrangements need to be made. No need to be the talk of the office nor to get the input of your colleagues, forum or otherwise. If they have any questions for you, answer tactfully and respectfully that you are any time willing to work overtime for them if they need it and that you plan on putting in the same or more hours that the rest of the office does.

mille

Thu, Jun 18 2015, 6:24 pm

I would decide what you want to do about fridays. Either make a precedent that you must leave early every single friday and leave at the same time every friday, even in the summer, or try to leave early only the minimum number of fridays in the year, when shabbat starts the earliest. Either way, make it known from the beginning.

I would mention yom tov and inquire about how your vacation accrues (will you have enough days accumulated by september to cover you?), but no need to give specific dates this early.

egam

Fri, Jun 19 2015, 1:26 pm

I worked for companies where there were already from people and they were familiar with concept and for one where I was the first one to ask for. You should not have a big problem in a big corporation.
You need to talk to your manager and/or department head and present them with options. For example I'll work 8:30 am to 6 pm Monday thru Thursday, and 8:30 am to 2 I'm on Friday without lunch. Or they might prefer you to keep this schedule for short Fridays only. Or they might ask you to have like a floating schedule on Friday, that you leave based on sundown. In my opinion the first option works the best, as it consistent and everyone knows what to expect.
You might find that some managers don't really care what time you leave on Friday, as long as deadlines are met. But these are few.
You will have to educate them about Yom Tov, since while majority are familiar with Shabbos, but most of them don't know about Yom Tov restrictions.
Good luck.

Mrs Bissli

Tue, Jun 23 2015, 5:45 pm

I've always worked in corporate jobs, but fortunately Fridays and Yom tovs have never been an issue. Like others said, wait till you get a written offer but inform your manager before you start. If he/she is not familiar with frum staff, the Board of Deputies publishes an excellent guide about shabbat observance to potential employers. (Go bod.org look for publication. )

First have a conversation, emphasise you are willing to come in early or work extra hours during the week. You should also emphasise leaving early and taking Yom tov has not affected your performance negatively.

Hatzlacha on the new job, you're fortunate to start in the summer when shabbat starts late.

Elanachka91

Tue, Jun 23 2015, 5:56 pm

Wow a topic after my own heart. I have worked in a public accounting firm for almost two years now and here are some tips. Firstly you do not need t say anything until after you are hired. Then usually the Wednesday of your first week you should send an email to whoever needs to know saying due to religious observance you will need to leave xyz hours before sundown. Definitely do not make a standard year round time - if they ever meet other religious Jews who leave a certain amount of time before shabbos you will look very inconsistent). In your first month or two of work be sure to stay later then everyone to show that although you are leaving earlier on friday you are 100 percent a team player. If you are working in a law firm or accounting firm where the culture is to work weekends then be sure to check in Saturday night or Sunday with a quick email. Finally be sure to touch base with any one who you are working with that week a couple hours before you are going to leave on friday t see if there is anything you need to finish up.

Mrs Bissli

Thu, Jun 25 2015, 4:20 pm

This is more for yomtov rather than Shabbat, but these days when everyone is almost expected to check emails and have blackberry, I find it necessary to rephrase the standard Out of Office auto messages. In addition to saying 'I will be out of office on XX and will be back on YY', you also need to add explicitly 'and I will NOT be checking for emails and voice emails during my absence. Please contact ZZ for urgent matters.' Otherwise people assume you're checking emails on your 'day off'. Just my 2cents.

Barbara

Thu, Jun 25 2015, 4:50 pm

Elanachka91 wrote:

I'd be quite upset if a new employee negotiated employment terms, accepted the offer, started work, and then, toward the end of the first week, said, "oh, yeah, and I'll only be working half a day on Friday." The time to mention that is when you're discussing hours and terms.

OP, when you're discussing hours, simply state that, for religious reasons, you will need to leave in time to get home one hour before sunset on Fridays. You'll be coming in early and working late other days to make up for it. Ask if they would prefer you leaving the same time year round, or leave later in summer and earlier in winter.

Always check your emails motzei Shabbat to see what happened after you left.

mha3484

Thu, Jun 25 2015, 5:05 pm

I agree with Barbara. I always had the policy to leave two hours before licht no matter the season. I would tell my boss in the middle of the week approximately what time that would be. I have had the same arrangement working while for frum employers. I leave work at 3:45-4 in the summer as opposed to my regular 5:20. I would never take off more time than necessary. If they know you are staying as late as you can you will be seen as a team player. Leaving at 2pm on Fridays in July looks icky IMO.

amother

Copper

Thu, Jun 25 2015, 6:01 pm

I would explain that you are a sabbath observer and that you need to leave early on Fridays as the Sabbath starts friday night. Make it clear that you will make up the time during the week. In public accounting I found this hard because everyone stayed crazy late, so there was no real making it up. Now that I am out of public accounting, I officially stay 1 hour extra every night to make up for the extra 4 hours that I leave early on Friday. I say officially, because I stay much longer usually because I am at a manager level and working more that the 40 hours is expected.

I found Yom Tov not really a problem, as I use my PTO/vacation for it, and as long as I request the time early enough there was no quesitoning the time off. I do check emails on chol hamoed and would occassioanlly call into an important meeting if necessary. I am very clear that I will have no phone or email access on the actual yom tov days and will have limited access on chol hamoed. This is similar of what is expected of my co-workers at my level of when they are on vacation.

Regarding leaving the same time every week or different does depend on a few things. When I was in public accouting I left too close to shabbos no matter what time shabbos was. Now that I am in a private big corporation, I try to leave between 12 and 3 every week no matter when shabbos starts. So in the winter more like 12 and in the summer more like 2. Since the hours are expected to be 40 hours per week, as long as they see me as a hard worker in general, they really don't care when I work those 40 hours as long as it is not effecting my work with others. So I find it extra important to provide status updates and communicate with others so that they are not looking for me or my work on a Friday afternoon and then get annoyed at me. On my outlook calender, I also block off my friday afternoons so no one tries to set up meeitngs with me then.

I also found it much easier in my current job because there are no other frum Jews, so it doesn't look bad if I am leaving earlier than a different frum Jew. When I was in a job that had many frum Jews, it just looked bad if I left before others, even though I might have lived much further or other things that I needed more time.