Children kicked out of school

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Forum -> Chinuch, Education & Schooling

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penguin

Tue, Jun 23 2015, 2:11 pm

What does WORD mean?

singleagain

Tue, Jun 23 2015, 2:19 pm

penguin wrote:

What does WORD mean?

According to Urbandictionary:

1) well said
2)said in a agreement
3) can be used as a greeting, hey whats up

http://www.urbandictionary.com.....=Word

naturalmom5

Tue, Jun 23 2015, 2:25 pm

gp2.0 wrote:

Where is this fantasy world where schools work together to find the best school for a child???? I want to go there. Are there unicorns there too?

I think it's located near the wonderful Ir HaTorah where you can breath Rava and Abaye in the air
Believe it's called Lakewood not to be confused with Fakewood in southern nj

anonymous458

Tue, Jun 23 2015, 2:44 pm

OP, here
to the poster who said that principal is kicking us out bc we are sephardim in ashkenaz school, well first of all YOU ARE WRONG THE SCHOOL HAS A MIXTURE OF SEPHARDIM AND ASHKENAZIM (to be anonymous, I will not say what I am) Furthermore, if principal was kicking someone out for that reason, then the principal could have told that person in October that at the end of the year they will need to find another school that is achkenaz or sephard. In October, at least the parents can still apply to other schools before the deadline.
To the poster who said the principal kicked her and her sibilings out because he claimed of learning disabilities. Well, that is always a possibility but truthfully there are MANY CHILDREN IN THAT SCHOOL THAT HAVE IEPs and also get help with reading so if the principal were kicking my children out for that reason, then the principal should be kicking others out with learning disabilities but he is not doing that!!So, there is another reason but principal is not telling the ENTIRE TRUTH. He is dishonest and kicking a child out of yeshiva is a serious thing and I know the principal did not ask a RAV if it is the right things to do especially children who were not bullying others or doing drugs or... horrible things like that but yes I have to say that obviously I dont want my children there now that the principal acts like this.

animeme

Tue, Jun 23 2015, 3:19 pm

Did I miss what reason the principal actually told you? The one that doesn't make sense so it can't be the reason? Or did he just say, "They can't come back" and refuse to provide a reason?

Lady Godiva

Tue, Jun 23 2015, 4:00 pm

OP, what were you told?
Are your children academically on the right grade level?
I'm so sorry that you're going through this. Crying

anonymous458

Tue, Jun 23 2015, 5:33 pm

OP , here
no he did not give an exact reason like I said earlier-he was very vague and said find another school. So, it was quiet I said nothing BUT after few minutes I broke the silence and said "so you are kicking my kids out" The principal being the crook she is-would not say yes but avoided the question and said I am saying to find another school.
Note that We have paid thousands to this school and my children's registration was already paid to hold a spot for next year meaning that the children were already accepted for next year's spot.
In Apriil/May -I got a letter allowing to register for them. Now, I have to fight to get that money back!!

PinkFridge

Tue, Jun 23 2015, 5:39 pm

naturalmom5 wrote:

I think it's located near the wonderful Ir HaTorah where you can breath Rava and Abaye in the air
Believe it's called Lakewood not to be confused with Fakewood in southern nj

Phew. For a minute there I thought you were lampooning Lakewood. Everyone knows Lakewood's in central NJ.
Rolling Eyes

Cookie Monster

Wed, Jun 24 2015, 4:19 am

KB, I have one more question for you. What happenes when your children leave school? Let's say they go to work, and you don't like one of their coworkers? Are you gonna get them fired or rather, " suggest they find a more suitable job?"

I know parents like you IRL. I don't think they realize the damage they are causing.

gp2.0

Wed, Jun 24 2015, 5:46 am

OK OP in your place this would be my response:

Principal: I'm calling to tell you that you need to find your kids another school
OP: I'd really rather not, can I ask why?
Principal: You need to find them another school.
OP: Why? They are signed up for this school for next year. I paid registration. They'll be attending next year.
Principal: No, you need to find them another school.
OP: Unless you actually have a reason why this is necessary, they'll be attending this school next year.
Principal: I already told you, you need to find them another school
OP: That's weird, my registration fee for next year wasn't returned to me. I'll assume that means they're still accepted for next year.

That would have at least squeezed a reason out of her eventually, which you could then either disprove and not accept if it's based on false allegations or accept if it's based on true allegations.

imasinger

Wed, Jun 24 2015, 5:56 am

Yeah, something's really fishy. It's not too late to try gp2.0's approach, even if that first call happened.

Chayalle

Wed, Jun 24 2015, 6:54 am

naturalmom5 wrote:

And I will wager a years salary that you don't teach in Lakewood or any very Charedi school

I live in Lakewood and with one or two exceptions, my girls have had the Mazal to have incredibly caring and devoted teachers.

If I was a millionaire, I'd double the salaries of my 7-year-old's First Grade teachers. My DD is an independent soul (read: a tough cookie), and yet her teachers went beyond the call of duty to give her a very positive year. Alas, my budget had to suffice with a pretty item filled with caramels.

I feel really bad for the OP.

As I said in a PM to another poster, my personal opinion about kicking a kid out of school is that it should be extreme. The principal should fast, he should feel that strongly about it. Parents who cause this type of thing, they should fast and do Teshuvah.

If that level of pain does not apply, then kicking someone out of school is not likely justified - there's probably "negius" involved.

It reminds me of something I learned in high school - when Yosef said to the brothers Ani Yosef, Haod Avi Chai, the brothers trembled. The Gemarah says Oy Lanu Miyom Hadin, Oy Lanu Miyom Hatochacha. Faced with what they had done, the brothers saw that they had been wrong. They thought they had been right to do this....

There's a Yom Hadin, and one day some of these principals will be faced with their deeds - the ones they convinced themselves that they did L'shem Shomayim - and they will realize that they had fooled themselves, and that they were wrong.

Chayalle

Wed, Jun 24 2015, 6:57 am

amother wrote:

Op, I and all my siblings and almost all the other sefardi kids in my school were asked to leave one year. After pressing, our parents were told that we were all mildly learning disabled for one reason or another.

In the long run, it turned out to be great. I got a much better education elsewhere (homeschooled). And I'm not learning disabled. But I had been a good student before and became an excellent student trying to prove them wrong. I wasn't the only one.

Hang in there, gam ze ltovah

I'm glad it worked out well for you. But this type of discrimination makes me sick.

Both of my DD's have Sefardi best friends (we tease DD that she will marry a Sephardi because she just loves Kibbeh). These friendships are so enriching. Why would we not want to be in the same schools? I don't get it.

Wed, Jun 24 2015, 8:20 am

I knew I was opening a can of worms when I made my original post. There are two types of people disagreeing with me: (a) those that say that kicking someone out for a difference in mentality is overboard and not fair, considering the potential results to the child asked to leave, and (b) those who are angry at the chareidi population in general and so have lumped me in that category, and channelled all their hate and anger at me.

I feel like at this point, I have answered all the a people, either through this thread or via pm. Current posters are picking and choosing which of my posts to read, and are twisting what I said so that they can make another bitter comment about the community they have an agenda with.

Last edited by kb on Wed, Jun 24 2015, 8:38 am; edited 1 time in total

Simple1

Wed, Jun 24 2015, 8:35 am

I would put myself in your (a) category. And to a certain extent, so do the yeshivas. I say to a certain extent, because schools are quick to reject applicants, but once they are students are not quick to expell.

amother

Floralwhite

Wed, Jun 24 2015, 9:07 am

gp2.0 wrote:

The parents have no control to accept or not accept the decision. There is no right to attend a private school. You might have a case under contract law but try getting your kids in a new yeshiva or having them attend after the current year. Try getting an order to show cause in certain communities while the case is heard. Plus the repercussions in certain communities are not worth the children attending school for another year.

I called the rabbinical counsel that governs the school. I reported illegal behavior of one of the schools my children attend. This behavior would result in me committing fraud because by accepting this, I would be colluding. I was told tough luck. I called a rabbi recommended by imamothers. I was told tough luck. My children have no right to attend private school. BTW all the parents were put in the same position knowingly by the school.

The realities are such that if you persist in that behavior, you are labeled difficult. I know children who can't get into schools because no one wants to deal with the mothers. Mothers who challenge are labeled crazy.

gp2.0

Wed, Jun 24 2015, 10:39 am

If a school would try to kick out my kids based on false allegations, I would not accept it. I would demand proof of the allegations, involve a rav and generally kick up a fuss.

It's my job to be my kids' advocate and I don't care if that labels me difficult or crazy. I would try not to yell or act hysterical and on the whole keep acting courteous and logical, that goes a long way.

Your example of reporting illegal activity is so different than what OP is experiencing that it is irrelevant.

amother

Floralwhite

Wed, Jun 24 2015, 3:08 pm

gp2.0 wrote:

You totally missed the point. The point is that schools can and do what they want without supervision including illegal activities.

You are powerless. If you think other moms do not do everything you suggest including kicking up a fuss. You can try to include a rav. If you think everyone doesn't do that also then you need to think again. Involving a rav, kicking up a fuss are not original ideas. Unless your rav is a very big shot then they don't care. You don't know what is being said behind the scenes, but I promise you plenty is being said.

You can try contacting their the largest donor. This is where the schools have a hard time saying no.

I am not saying every school situation is the same, but when administration doesn't want you, they have all the power and you have non, and if you don't go gracefully then good luck getting in anywhere else.

anonymous458

Wed, Jun 24 2015, 6:47 pm

OP here,
gp2.0 your advice sounds great but is UNREALISTIC because as Floralwhite wrote that the schools can and DO WHAT THEY WANT!! I did say something like that to the principal BUT SHE HAS THE LAST SAY!! I was a whistleblower about something maybe that is why she wants my kids out but the principal would not say why!! The only good thing is that as of now that I am trying to get my children into another school, the "new" principal wants to speak to the "old" principal to find out what is the "issue"?
So, it is better for me to say something general and be able to just say "speak to the old principal" rather than forcing the old principal to give a reason which may reflect badly on my children. At this point, maybe the principal would say I am difficult because I always have advocated for my children. However, as Floralwhite pointed out
even though they took my almost full tuition -thousands of dollars- they still do not give me much say! and even though my children's registration was already paid for- she still kicked them out!! (ill have to fight to get money back)
The latest is there may be space for my older child in another school but like I said that school wants to speak to the "OLD" principal about what happened and as of now the principals are playing "phone tag" and MAYBE THE OLD PRINCIPAL WILL CONTINUE TO PLAY PHONE TAG TO AVOID TALKING ABOUT IT!! so, I will have to push more in August I guess!!
Maybe I can send my children's report cards to show they are "normal"???.....I will try to see if I can "PUSH" A RAV TO ADVOCATE FOR ME (although he already said he would -he is leaving to the country and dont think he remembered....??) I will do my hishtadlus and I must trust in Hashem.

imasoftov

Thu, Jun 25 2015, 6:15 am

kb wrote:

I'm not judging anyone. I just don't want my child being exposed to certain concepts at age 4. Is that so difficult to swallow?

I do understand, but because in practice that excludes real living people ...

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