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WWYD: Child obsessed with money



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amother
Chartreuse


 

Post Wed, Jul 01 2015, 5:17 pm
Those who know us well, will probably recognize my daughter, but to protect her privacy I will go anonymous for this.

My 10 year old daughter is always thinking about money. For years now. At least once a week she asks me how she can earn money, why don't I give her chanuka gelt, when will she have a lot of money, etc etc. We have spoken countless times about ways to earn money. By me she can only earn a little at a time for small things. Babysitting she earns much more, but at 10 years old she only has one customer. I am trying to help her develop her talents and explaining that people are more likely to pay for doing something you are good at and enjoy. I have also told her that the most important thing is setting herself up for future jobs, like focusing on her education, and even volunteer jobs like working at the library to build up work experience.

She keeps asking why I don't give her money and expect her to work for it. It think she hears that other girls in her class have spending money that they didn't earn, they just got it from grandparents and parents.

When I ask her what she needs, she says she just wants to know she has money. She has mentioned that she wants her children to have money. There was a period of two years when DH didn't work and we were very tight. She always had basics, but not extracurricular activities or any extras. We are a few years past that period and I wonder if that still affects her.

She has other issues that concern us and we have been taking her to meet with a family therapist for the last couple of months. But this particular bent strikes me the most. I can't understate how often she thinks of money. Today she cried because she heard her older sister is earning money running a camp (not that much between us). She took it REALLY hard that she doesn't have an easy way to get cash.

My husband already suggested telling her that she can choose either bat mitzvah party or a nice monetary gift, half to spend and half to save. I am worried about the social aspect of not having a bat mitzvah party.

Today she was saying to me, "Imma, if you want me to be happy, just give me money and I'll be happy." I tried explaining how she would only be happy for a week, a month or two, and then would want more and more money to feel happy again. But it fell on deaf ears. I am almost tempted to give her some money and say, "now are you happy?" but I really don't want to give in to this unhealthy obsession either.

I will speak to the therapist about this, but meantime wanted to ask if anyone has had something like this before? Let's say the obsession wasn't for money but for junk food, expensive clothes or something else. She does also obsess about junk food, and other material things, but it is the money that comes up over and over and over and over again.

WWYD?
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amother
Chartreuse


 

Post Wed, Jul 01 2015, 5:18 pm
I forgot to add, I have already told her how having a lot of money and using it to help people do mitzvot is a very positive thing. But that didn't really connect with her in any way.
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mummiedearest




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 01 2015, 5:33 pm
she sounds like a prime candidate for an allowance. I had one as a kid. we didn't have a lot of money, but I got a dollar a week when I was seven. it went up to three dollars when I was ten, and I think five when I was twelve. I didn't have to work for it, it was just an allowance. if you want her to work for her money, come up with a list of chores she can do and a price per chore. these can be chores you do easily, but let her do them anyway. make a spreadsheet of all the chores/prices and let her learn to fill out some paperwork. enjoy your time off. if she wants more money, teach her how to ask for a raise. and work out a system for teaching her to be responsible with the money she earns.
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amother
Chartreuse


 

Post Wed, Jul 01 2015, 5:40 pm
This is so brilliantly simple, why didn't I think of it myself? I guess because I never got an allowance as a kid.

Thank you, thank you, thank you. This gives me hope. She really is capable of truly helping.

Israeli amothers does 10nis a week sound right? How much do others give? I have a bunch of other kids though so I have to have a plan for what to do when they ask for chore-allowance set up.
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nywife




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 01 2015, 5:42 pm
I think you need to figure out what the connection in her mind is between money and happiness. Why is it that she feels she can only be satisfied with money?
You mentioned a period where money was tight- do you know if she felt the brunt of that at all? Children are very sensitive and intuitive- often more than we adults realize. It's possible she's still in the mindset that she's not secure because she still thinks that as a family you're lacking.
Is there a peer pressure aspect to this too? Ie is she friends with girls from more wealthy families? Jealousy could be at play here.
I think it would be wise to bring up your concerns with her therapist.
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mummiedearest




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 01 2015, 5:45 pm
amother wrote:
This is so brilliantly simple, why didn't I think of it myself? I guess because I never got an allowance as a kid.

Thank you, thank you, thank you. This gives me hope. She really is capable of truly helping.

Israeli amothers does 10nis a week sound right? How much do others give? I have a bunch of other kids though so I have to have a plan for what to do when they ask for chore-allowance set up.


the plan for the other kids should be the same as hers. use the same spreadsheet. if there are some chores they can't do, they'll get to them when they are old enough. the kids can learn to schedule amongst themselves who does which chore on which day. try to have daily chores on the spreadsheet and tell them you want all chores done daily. if one kid is sick/away, the others can take over that kid's load and earn extra.
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Dolly Welsh




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 01 2015, 6:27 pm
Both parents should agree and present a united front. If your husband said that about the Bat Mitzvah without talking to you first, he should talk to you first in future.

He is implying that a party that is normal and expected in her circles is somehow an extravagance. Over in a day. This is feeding her worries.

Whatever he thinks is fine but he needed to talk to you first. When parents aren't on the same page about something this important, money, the kid gets anxious.

Ideally a 13 year old girl should not have to think about money and make decisions about how large sums are spent. She should be handed without comment what is normal and appropriate for her family's lifestyle.

Your husband asked a 12 year old to decide how to dispose of and allocate a large sum.
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amother
Chartreuse


 

Post Wed, Jul 01 2015, 7:06 pm
Dolly, my husband suggested it to me in private. She has no inkling of it.

Mummie, I was thinking of 8 things to be done once a week, and I was thinking that each kid would get a list of things that would be most suitable for them. For example, son with ADD would be awesome at cleaning recycling and very challenged by cleaning up a room. Daughter would hate any errand related chore but is perfectly capable of cleaning a room. Is this approach less effective? I see what you mean about kids being able to sub for others. I guess I have to research this more.

Nywife - yes I think peer pressure is a big part of this. I don't know that families are more well-to-do but they spend differently than us. Could be a cultural thing, as we are olim.
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Dolly Welsh




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 01 2015, 8:03 pm
Oh.
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Iymnok




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jul 02 2015, 3:05 am
If she values money like this you need to have a real discussion about how money is just a tool. More money doesn't equal happiness.
I don't like allowance. In the real world money is often hard to get.
How do you view money? How do you talk about money and expenses in front of your children?
I don't have any advice, but those are my first reactions.
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5*Mom




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jul 02 2015, 3:19 am
amother wrote:
Dolly, my husband suggested it to me in private. She has no inkling of it.

Mummie, I was thinking of 8 things to be done once a week, and I was thinking that each kid would get a list of things that would be most suitable for them. For example, son with ADD would be awesome at cleaning recycling and very challenged by cleaning up a room. Daughter would hate any errand related chore but is perfectly capable of cleaning a room. Is this approach less effective? I see what you mean about kids being able to sub for others. I guess I have to research this more.

You are going to be veeeeery busy with this system, constantly checking to make sure things are done to your standard, negotiating with children who want more for less, arguing... IME these kinds of systems don't end well at all.

If she wants money and you would like to teach her about money, but she is too young to get a proper job for someone other than you I would suggest giving her a modest amount per week or month with the understanding that there are certain things that she will be responsible for paying for independently, such as ice cream, pizza, tchotchkes or whatever little extras you currently pay for which are not needs and which will give her the opportunity to prioritize her wants and learn to budget and save. This should be presented in a very positive way, as in, Abba and I have been thinking about your request and we've decided that you are old enough to have some money of your own and to manage it on your own. These are the things you will be able to do with your money: x, y, z. This means that Abba and I will no longer be paying for these things if you want them.
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spikta




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jul 02 2015, 6:51 am
I totally understand why telling her that money won't make her happy doesn't help. It isn't the kind of thing you just hear and accept. You have to truly be in that situation to internalize it.

Right now all she sees is her friends getting money, buying all these fun things when she can't. Of course she thinks money will make her happy. Heck, imamother is full of women worried about whether they can afford new clothes, tuition, chicken on a weekday, etc. I'm sure they think money will greatly improve their lives.

To me it sounds like what she really wants is more control and independence. I second the suggestions for allowance, and I also think you can help her earn more money outside the home. Studying is good long term, but she wants something short term as well, and it sounds like she's willing to work for it, which is admirable.

If she does her cleaning chores well, she can easily do small tasks outside the home for pay. I don't have a cleaning lady, but if our neighbor's precocious 10 year old offered to dust my shelves or wash some dishes for me I'd totally go for it. I used to do makolet runs for our neighbors for a shekel or two. She could walk dogs, play with kids to free up parents for shabbat prep... There's a ton she can do for money at age 10. You can suggest she google it, do some research and see if there are any ideas she likes.

Perhaps try thinking of her not as a money obsessed child, but as a capable young entrepreneur that needs help translating her desire for financial independence into viable business plans. If you can make that switch, she will too, and empowered people tend to be a lot less whiny Wink
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gp2.0




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jul 02 2015, 8:44 am
I agree with mummiedearest, and I suppose I disagree with everyone else. I would give my DD a small allowance without any stipulations. She wouldn't have to work for it, nor do I get to control what she spends it on, or stop buying her little treats just because she "has her own money now." If she gets $5 a week and spends it all on candy the first day, she'd quickly realize on her own that maybe she wants to save it for something else instead. Kids can have some freedom to make these choices and come to these realizations on their own. She can of course work for other people to earn money.

As for not giving kids "free money" because no one gives us free money - well, no one pays me to do the chores either. So maybe you shouldn't pay the kids for chores, because then they'll never do any when they grow up?

Let's face it, being a kid is different than being an adult. We don't have to live mired in this fear that being gentle/generous/encouraging with our children will lead them to become damaged adults.
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mummiedearest




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jul 02 2015, 8:56 am
amother wrote:
Dolly, my husband suggested it to me in private. She has no inkling of it.

Mummie, I was thinking of 8 things to be done once a week, and I was thinking that each kid would get a list of things that would be most suitable for them. For example, son with ADD would be awesome at cleaning recycling and very challenged by cleaning up a room. Daughter would hate any errand related chore but is perfectly capable of cleaning a room. Is this approach less effective? I see what you mean about kids being able to sub for others. I guess I have to research this more.

Nywife - yes I think peer pressure is a big part of this. I don't know that families are more well-to-do but they spend differently than us. Could be a cultural thing, as we are olim.


I wouldn't tailor-make a list per child. put all the chores on one list. whoever is inclined to take the job can do it. if the kid really wants to earn more money, s/he can decide to do a chore out of his/her comfort zone. don't box the kid in. your son with ADD may come up with a way to clean the room, and your daughter may decide that errand jobs are worth the money.

to address another poster's concern, you may want to come up with a detailed checklist for each chore. trust the kids to follow the checklist. check the results of their chores, but not every time they do it. have surprise inspections. I do this with my kids' bedroom cleaning. I no longer check up on them, but if I happen to go into their rooms and see something that wasn't done, I will point it out.
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 06 2015, 4:57 am
spikta wrote:
I totally understand why telling her that money won't make her happy doesn't help. It isn't the kind of thing you just hear and accept. You have to truly be in that situation to internalize it.

Right now all she sees is her friends getting money, buying all these fun things when she can't. Of course she thinks money will make her happy. Heck, imamother is full of women worried about whether they can afford new clothes, tuition, chicken on a weekday, etc. I'm sure they think money will greatly improve their lives.

To me it sounds like what she really wants is more control and independence. I second the suggestions for allowance, and I also think you can help her earn more money outside the home. Studying is good long term, but she wants something short term as well, and it sounds like she's willing to work for it, which is admirable.

If she does her cleaning chores well, she can easily do small tasks outside the home for pay. I don't have a cleaning lady, but if our neighbor's precocious 10 year old offered to dust my shelves or wash some dishes for me I'd totally go for it. I used to do makolet runs for our neighbors for a shekel or two. She could walk dogs, play with kids to free up parents for shabbat prep... There's a ton she can do for money at age 10. You can suggest she google it, do some research and see if there are any ideas she likes.

Perhaps try thinking of her not as a money obsessed child, but as a capable young entrepreneur that needs help translating her desire for financial independence into viable business plans. If you can make that switch, she will too, and empowered people tend to be a lot less whiny Wink


I agree with all of this, and especially the bolded.

I made a ton of simple beaded earrings for a craft show, and ended up with a lot of leftovers. I put them on a single display board, and DD and her BFF went around the neighborhood selling them for me. The deal was that they would sell for $10 a pair, and the kids would get 10% of the sales. It was a total win/win for everyone! The girls got out of the house, got exercise, met new neighbors, and made money. I got my surplus inventory reduced and recouped the cost of my materials.

I would love to have a kid come by and offer to pull weeds for me, to wash the windows, or help me change the linens on the beds. I don't have a dishwasher for dairy dishes, and just doing a sink full of dishes is worth a dollar to me, more if there are gross pans to be scrubbed out.
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amother
Chartreuse


 

Post Mon, Jul 06 2015, 5:41 am
Thank you all for your responses! The diversity of responses just shows that each parent can adjust what's "right" for each child's needs.

We spoke with DD generally on Friday (while hanging laundry), and laid out the detailed plan on motzai Shabbat for any kid who was interested. DD was thrilled!!! Yesterday she worked eagerly to knock off a bunch of jobs. Our car now looks like it did right before Pesach and the boys room is cleaned. Did I mention that this child also gets bored easily and has too much time on her hands? I like what spikta said - that we are empowering her to use her abilities in a good way.

BH living in a community blessed with kids, there isn't such a great demand for 10 year old workers as you might think. But in this family there certainly is.
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