I dont trust MIL Kashrus

amother

Lilac

Mon, Jul 20 2015, 3:25 pm

In laws moved from overseas to my city a couple of years ago, before dh and I married. After I got married I saw different foods and drinks in their house that left me wondering who told them and how they know if they trust these brands. Since they are from overseas, they really wouldn't know. I knew im marrying into a frummer family than mine so I was a little shocked. It really hit me one day when dh brought home something without a hechsher. I pointed it out and he was like "oh... you're right. I'll take it back" . which leads me to my next point...

based on dh's awareness of food brands, it seems that dh was never taught kashrus - what brands to trust/ not trust, what foods need to be checked before eating (figs/strawberries/etc...). MIL told me that she was taught how to clean certain fruit. But then barely gives a second glance to see if the fruit is worth cleaning at all - "if I know how to clean it, it can be eaten". I once threw out a "cleaned" fruit that definitely was bad.
I also cant be sure she checks beans - she's always in a rush and generally works very fast so when does she check them and how well checked are they?

MIL also doesn't know some stuff in the kitchen including hilchos Shabbos on food. I once asked her nicely if you're allowed to do [something she was doing], she said she learned (many years back) that its ok. and then went on to tell me how she had a phenomenal halacha teacher that ingrained these halachos into her head so well that she knows them till today. I later verified that its not ok.

in laws are frum, good people. She's not ignorant in halacha but I really question some stuff.
I cant point out food brands because my parents do eat those brands in my house so on my end, it's not really wrong. But if they are so frum, why the laxity?

any thoughts? (im not offering to check her beans)

mummiedearest

Mon, Jul 20 2015, 3:34 pm

I don't check beans either. never have.

keep in mind that guidelines for checking produce differs based on countries. she may be used to produce in her previous home country.

as for shabbos issues, I know lots of frum people who do things I don't consider ok on shabbos. unless I'm actively involved in their kitchens, I don't assume they're doing anything wrong. I went to a shiur on the issues involved in using blechs, how to use them properly, etc. this covered hot plate usage. I know plenty of people who use hot plates in a way not ok according to the rav who gave the shiur. if it's someone I'm close to, I'll ask them about it, find out if there are other opinions out there, but this is really just to further my own understanding. I don't eat out much at all. if you are concerned, don't eat at your in-laws or offer to bring food for shabbos. help your mil make the salads once you're there. bond over lettuce. meanwhile, ask your rav for guidance on this. you may find that your concerns are not really an issue, or you may find a way to point things out to your mil. there are products out there that don't require a hechsher, find out what those are.

amother

Plum

Mon, Jul 20 2015, 3:48 pm

Checking guidelines differ by location. I don't check beans either, but I know in some places it's necessary. She probably comes from a place where the rules of what/how to check are different. Also, did her former residence have a very strong frum presence? My husband still sometimes forgets to check hashgachas because he grew up with only kosher markets around so he never developed the habit of checking.

Frumdoc

Mon, Jul 20 2015, 5:49 pm

I don't really understand what you're saying - that they had a frummer label on them than you have on yourself so you expect them to keep certain stringencies that you don't?

Or that it is their fault your dh is not good at checking hecsherim?

Or that you consider she is breaking shabbos according to your understanding, or not keepung losher enough for yor standards, or the higher standards you have associated with people who are at their level of frumkeit?

Because many older women did learn things differently and don't see any reason to change, there are multiple rulings about shabbos and kashrus and in many countries beans and grains don't need checking.

If you have geniune issues with them not adhering to your standards of kashrus, talk it through with your posek, it is a common enough problem. If it is simply that you expect them to do x if they do y, even if you do neither x nor y, well expand your people boxes a little.

I learned a great deal from the differences between how my mil does things and how I do, and the changes in practice from one generation and place to another. We were and qre both right, butv different.

justcallmeima

Mon, Jul 20 2015, 7:10 pm

I know many ba'alei t'shuva (yeshivish, Chassidish) who were told by separate Rabbonim that they can trust their completely not shomer shabos, not frum, parents' kashrus in their homes because one can assume that one's own parents will not purposely try to make non kosher food for their frum children. I think you're probably safe eating whatever they serve you even if you're surprised.

amother

Babypink

Mon, Jul 20 2015, 7:42 pm

We would never eat at my parents or my ILs if they were not our parents. Many rovs are sensitive to family issues and allow you to close your eyes to certain things. Besides these are frum people; not to your standard hardly makes their kitchen treyf. And as others mentioned, kashrus varies from region to region so they may just be used to doing things differently. As far as hilchos shabbos, not everyone holds exactly the same. I was floored when I saw things going on in homes of families that I would consider overall far frummer than we are. On a couple occasions I asked about it straight out and was told that they absolutely learned what they were doing was okay (whereas I was absolutely taught otherwise). With family there is so much wiggle room. Speak to your rov and give them benefit of doubt.

5mom

Mon, Jul 20 2015, 8:45 pm

There's a big gap between "stuff I don't do" and treif or assur on shabbos. As other posters have mentioned, different countries may have different standards and practices.

You might want to read up or speak to someone (without mentioning your in-laws) to get a better idea of what is absolutely necessary.

You should continue to keep your own path, of course. I have certain practices that I keep in my own kitchen but I don't impose them on other people, because they are beyond basic halacha.

Keeping peace in the family is a religious value too. Since your examples do not involve actually cooking meat in milk, chances are that you can overlook a lot of what's going on.

amother

Lilac

Tue, Jul 21 2015, 12:30 pm

Frumdoc wrote:

If you have geniune issues with them not adhering to your standards of kashrus, talk it through with your posek, it is a common enough problem. If it is simply that you expect them to do x if they do y, even if you do neither x nor y, well expand your people boxes a little.

I learned a great deal from the differences between how my mil does things and how I do, and the changes in practice from one generation and place to another. We were and qre both right, butv different.

Op here.

I have seen many ppl do things that differ from the way I do. I didn't say its wrong. Halacha (including Kashrus) has many different rulings. I can tell you that their rav does not encourage the food brands you find in the house. and if a fruit is wormy, clean it all you want, you cant eat it.

Hilchos Shabbos also varies in different houses. its just the combo of low kashrus levels in the house that I see it all over.

I sometimes wonder if their family back home would eat in their house.