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The whole Orthodox world is complicit in Faigy Mayers death
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amother
Fuchsia


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 2:46 pm
According to Ysoscher Katz, an ex-Satmar turned Modern Orthodex, the whole Orthodox world is complicit in Faigy Mayers death. Do you agree? Why or why not?

http://forward.com/opinion/312.....eath/

Quote:
Another beautiful soul died this past weekend, prematurely and unnecessarily. Thirty-year-old Faigy Mayer was found dead early Monday morning after having plummeted from a 20-story building in Manhattan. Officials described her death as a possible suicide.
While Faigy may have taken her life, the will to live was taken away from her by a community that is sadly complacent and perhaps a tad distracted. All of us in the Orthodox world are somewhat complicit in her death.
Faigy was raised in the ultra-Orthodox Belz community. As a young adult she chose to embark on a journey of self-discovery, abandoning her native community in search of an alternative.
READ: Woman Who Left Hasidic Community Plunges to Death From Rooftop Bar
Replacing your native community is a long and arduous process, happening gradually and over the course of many years. It takes a long time to admit to yourself that you’re a misfit, different from everybody else in your social circle. Once you’ve come to terms with being different, you need to muster the courage to leave. That does not happen overnight either. Making such a momentous move requires years of reflection and introspection. After you leave, you spend years searching for an alternative community, one that corresponds with your new identity.
Many of those years are spent living in a metaphorical closet, to borrow but not trivialize a term most commonly used by the gay community. You walk around in this world scared and alone, physically and existentially. You wonder if your values and beliefs are still in consonance with those of your native community, but you have to keep those doubts to yourself. Sharing your hesitations about the community’s tenets or practices might be dangerous and detrimental. Instead you walk around anxiously, terrified that your secret will be discovered. While many who leave manage to find alternative communal homes, the interim years are excruciatingly difficult, with days spent mired in self-doubt and paralyzed by self-loathing.
I know what this life is like because I lived in that metaphorical closet. I grew up in the ultra-Orthodox community of Satmar but now identify as Modern Orthodox. Those years of transitioning from one end of the Orthodox spectrum to the other were extremely difficult, excruciating and debilitating.
Spending years obscuring your true identity is existential hell. Many of us who have been there have contemplated suicide. Although bruised and scarred for life, most of us triumph over those suicidal demons. Faigy, unfortunately, did not. The thought of living a life where she is invisible and unseen (at least to some segments of her former life) became unbearable. She apparently decided to put an end to it. She is now gone and we are somewhat at fault. We failed her and also let down her community.
Faigy was a member of the XO (ex-Orthodox) community. Her story is not anomalous. Many in that community are struggling with similar issues, feeling ignored and communally neglected. We owe it to them to do better.
Our efforts towards addressing this problem have so far been haphazard and piecemeal. We are, for the moment, too distracted to notice the tragic proportions of the problem, a phenomenon that impacts all segments of Orthodoxy. Attrition is not unique to the ultra-Orthodox community. The Haredi community is busy rallying around rabbis and yeshiva heads who are fighting turf wars, while the Modern Orthodox community is focused on demarcating communal boundaries. We need to shift our energies from the hypothetical to the practical and start providing support to the young souls who are struggling and flailing.
Our efforts should be two-pronged. We need to develop a robust support system for those beautiful souls who are imprisoned by existential loneliness. They should know that our acceptance of them is absolute and unconditional and that we appreciate and even sanctify their journey in search of a true and authentic self.
We also have to support their families and loved ones who are rightfully pained by the rejection implicit in this pursuit of self-discovery. We can legitimate their pain but at the same time help them appreciate the difference between product and process. They can be made to understand that while they might not approve of the final outcome of their relative’s journey, they can still support the process and be there to provide the unconditional love that the relative craves and deserves.
In a few weeks we will read the Torah portion of Eglah Arufah. In it, the Bible prescribes a communal cleansing ritual for when someone in the community dies under questionable circumstances. A tragic death is never an accident or a matter of happenstance — it’s a call for reflection and introspection. We are due for a communal cleansing. May Faigy’s death be a clarion call to all of us to look out for those in our midst who are suffering in silence, being penalized for no other crime than the desire to live an honest and authentic life. This way her death will not be in vain.
May Faigy’s memory be a blessing.



Read more: http://forward.com/opinion/312.....JUEf2
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amother
Mauve


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:09 pm
My sister was in Cornells psychiatric unit last summer together with Faigy. She told my sister that she was an unfortunate frequent visitor there. This is what you will not find in the news.
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amother
Fuchsia


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:14 pm
amother wrote:
My sister was in Cornells psychiatric unit last summer together with Faigy. She told my sister that she was an unfortunate frequent visitor there. This is what you will not find in the news.

Seems like her hospitalization did indeed make the news. Here is a direct quote from People, "Mayer's close friend, Pinny Gold, who said Mayer had been hospitalized three times in the past for depression...."

http://www.people.com/article/.....lemag
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Fox




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:17 pm
I think the kind of ignorance and arrogance displayed by Mr. Katz would make both the Satmar *and* the MO communities want to shut him up.

Where do we even start?

* His ignorance about nuts and bolts of serious mental illness.

* His arrogance in projecting his own emotions and experiences onto others.

* His arrogance in claiming to know why a particular tragedy occurred.

* His facile treatment of a complex issue.

* His even more facile suggestion of a solution.

* His hijacking of someone else's pain to advance his own views -- without any supporting evidence.

* His equation of battling serious mental illness with the stresses and leaving one's community of birth.

* His ignorance about the causes and effective treatments of serious mental illness.

If Mr. Katz were to remain a Satmar chossid, I would recommend he spend enough time learning Gemara to develop some critical thinking skills. If he wants to be MO, I would suggest he immediately enroll in the university of his choice and learn the fundamentals of rhetoric.

In the meantime, I recommend his puerile writing be given a "B-" in 9th grade English class and roundly ignored by grown-ups.
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amother
Olive


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:18 pm
Does he really expect Orthodox Jews to encourage their children to explore and find their own way? Sorry guys, this isn't Judiasm.
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Barbara




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:21 pm
amother wrote:
My sister was in Cornells psychiatric unit last summer together with Faigy. She told my sister that she was an unfortunate frequent visitor there. This is what you will not find in the news.


Interesting that you're anonymous, presumably because you don't think that the world has the right to know that your sister was in a psych unit.

But you don't give the same courtesy to Ms. Mayer, who is no longer able to speak for herself.

This makes me sick. People are using this poor woman for their own purposes. The author of that article certainly does. Newspapers are. People here are.

She was someone's daughter. Someone's sister. Someone's friend. For heaven's sake, let her rest in peace.
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amother
Vermilion


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:23 pm
Found this reply as well:

Finette LLerman-Russak

I'm a family member, and bizarrely the news is making a mockery of what was her tortured existence.
Sadly Faigy had serious and ongoing mental health problems. Many years of many long term psych hospitalizations from late teens until less than a year ago. She did not have any sort of happy life, tortured and uncomfortable in either world( Hasidic or secular). I laugh at the articles stating she must have been a foodie because she was anorexic and obsessed about posting food pics to seem as if she was eating. See how thin she was? I also feel saddened that she is not remembered as she was, and instead a cartoon, made up by writers assuming things from falsity posted by a mentally ill girl on twitter and facebook.Recently she was in a prolonged manic state and was starting to feel the backlash of the many lies she had built up into a false persona. Her"CEO" title was self applied, and her "company" was but a dream and a website. Her degrees and work experience was mostly exaggerated or made up. She wanted so badly to BE a programmer that she went to events and conferences pretending she already WAS in the field. She once said to her father's family, who did support her (unlike her immediate family who did not),that she wanted to be famous,to be known as another persona..not the real Faigy. She hated herself that much.

Even in the documentary about leaving Hasidic life, she couldnt tell the whole truth and much untrue was mixed into her story. Her fathers family were VERY supportive but she couldn’t admit that lest it dilute her being victim. She often said getting good at pretending was better and faster than doing the work.The past several months she worked to build that fake programming, top ofthe world, "other" Faigy, and then, on a manic medicated state probably thought "what the hell, Im on top and soon to be found out, soIll jump".. I sit here disheartened that she hid her turmoil so well that those around her didnt know how much she needed to be saved, I sit here sad that I couldnt do more, but as one of her Drs said to me " often you cant save a person whose illness is so ingrained, so much a part of their belief". I hope the world will know, NOT the fake, made up cartoon media has cobbled together from assumptions and untrue snippets, but the REAL Faigy:intelligent, kind, confused , tortured, and deserving of far more than she got.May she rest in peace.

there is a LOT here and in many of the media outlets that's blatantly UNTRUE
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amother
Turquoise


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:23 pm
Mr. Katz can write what he wants. Why does the Forward print this drivel?
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kerida




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:28 pm
Barbara wrote:
Interesting that you're anonymous, presumably because you don't think that the world has the right to know that your sister was in a psych unit.

But you don't give the same courtesy to Ms. Mayer, who is no longer able to speak for herself.

This makes me sick. People are using this poor woman for their own purposes. The author of that article certainly does. Newspapers are. People here are.

She was someone's daughter. Someone's sister. Someone's friend. For heaven's sake, let her rest in peace.

Absolutely right, thank you Babara. Please if you wish to have a constructive debate on health issues affecting the young make a thread, but do not report tantalising bits of news about a young jewish girl recently deceased. Especially not at this time of year!!!!!!
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vintagebknyc




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:28 pm
amother wrote:
Found this reply as well:

xxxxx

there is a LOT here and in many of the media outlets that's blatantly UNTRUE


this is the comment section, it's not what the newspapers or magazines publish, it's what the readers write. it's not edited for truth, and don't read comments looking for any
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amother
Vermilion


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:31 pm
I know! this was from her as well...
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amother
Peach


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:31 pm
I don't give a hoot about Yisucher Katz. I know who he is and what he stands for. BTW, he can call h/s MO, but he's associated with the Open Orthodoxy movement.
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amother
Aqua


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:37 pm
I'm the poster from another thread who identified myself as faigys neighbor for the 20 first years of our lives.
Faigy was always different and troubled.
Her behavior had nothing to do with her school and community.
From when she was young (I'm approx her age) , she said and did the weirdest things that most people don't typically do.
We all knew she had some underlying mental condition.

However, with all that, she was a nice, harmless and sweet person.

But don't blame it on "the system" every time. Sometimes it's mental health.
The system did nothing wrong to her.
She never complained, other than thAt yiddishkeit in general is too overwhelming for her.
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myself




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:39 pm
Honestly, all this discussion about Faigy's life is totally inappropriate! Why is it okay to air out someone's personal laundry because they are no longer alive?

ETA: I totally understand the need for family and those who knew her to discuss this however a public forum is not really the right venue.
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amother
Beige


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:42 pm
amother wrote:
I'm the poster from another thread who identified myself as faigys neighbor for the 20 first years of our lives.
Faigy was always different and troubled.
Her behavior had nothing to do with her school and community.
From when she was young (I'm approx her age) , she said and did the weirdest things that most people don't typically do.
We all knew she had some underlying mental condition.

However, with all that, she was a nice, harmless and sweet person.

But don't blame it on "the system" every time. Sometimes it's mental health.
The system did nothing wrong to her.
She never complained, other than thAt yiddishkeit in general is too overwhelming for her.

What kind of things did she do that other people wouldn't do?
Also, if she was mentally ill then she wasn't really obligated to follow halacha. I wonder if she knew that and still felt forced to do things against her will which led to even more turmoil?
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amother
Aqua


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:44 pm
amother wrote:
What kind of things did she do that other people wouldn't do?
Also, if she was mentally ill then she wasn't really obligated to follow halacha. I wonder if she knew that and still felt forced to do things against her will which led to even more turmoil?


I'm not going to give details of of troubled actions. I wouldn't do that to a person who is alive and definitely not to someone who is dead.
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ahuva06




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:44 pm
Barbara wrote:
Interesting that you're anonymous, presumably because you don't think that the world has the right to know that your sister was in a psych unit.

But you don't give the same courtesy to Ms. Mayer, who is no longer able to speak for herself.

This makes me sick. People are using this poor woman for their own purposes. The author of that article certainly does. Newspapers are. People here are.

She was someone's daughter. Someone's sister. Someone's friend. For heaven's sake, let her rest in peace.


Agree, agree agree. If only we can stop judging and gossiping about other peoples misfortune and struggles and focus on bettering ourselves as people.
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amother
Beige


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:46 pm
myself wrote:
Honestly, all this discussion about Faigy's life is totally inappropriate! Why is it okay to air out someone's personal laundry because they are no longer alive?

ETA: I totally understand the need for family and those who knew her to discuss this however a public forum is not really the right venue.

Faigy wanted her story to be publicized. She went on tv to tell it as well. She died in a very public manner because she wanted people to know and talk about her and raise awareness about the issues she was struggling with. I guess this is her way of helping other people.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:46 pm
amother wrote:
What kind of things did she do that other people wouldn't do?
Also, if she was mentally ill then she wasn't really obligated to follow halacha. I wonder if she knew that and still felt forced to do things against her will which led to even more turmoil?
Please explain this??? I have never heard such a thing.
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amother
Beige


 

Post Wed, Jul 22 2015, 3:47 pm
amother wrote:
I'm not going to give details of of troubled actions. I wouldn't do that to a person who is alive and definitely not to someone who is dead.

Then why bring it up altogether?
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