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Migration crisis
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morah




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Aug 31 2015, 4:05 pm
I'm kind of surprised this hasn't come up here, as I know there are a lot of Europeans on here (I'm American but also hold French citizenship and an EU passport, so I follow what goes on there). Every day, there's another story- usually tragic- about migration from various crisis-stricken countries in Africa and the Middle East. The number I keep seeing in all the news reports is 60 million people displaced this year by war and other civil unrest. That is insane! You can't blame people in such desperate situations for trying anything and everything to get away.

But Europe cannot handle such an influx, nor should they be expected to. I know France has been grappling with Muslim immigrants from hostile countries who bring extremism with them for a long time already, and the last thing they need is more of the same (surprise surprise, much of the violence these people are fleeing is occurring in Muslim countries). From what I understand, England and Germany have similar issues. Not to mention that none of these countries would be able to sustain their generous social services with such an influx. But thousands of people have died this year crossing the Mediterranean or packing into unventilated trucks or trying to jump trains, and that's horrific and not something we can ignore. Things need to be fixed in the countries of origin, but that's not so simple and no one wants to touch that. The migrants are so desperate that they're not going to stop trying any time soon. Not many Americans get it, but this pales in comparison to Central American illegal migration into the US. This is a crisis of epic proportions and there are just no easy answers.
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Aug 31 2015, 4:13 pm
For some expert analysis of the political, social, and financial implications of immigration in Europe, read The Gatestone Institute website. Pay special attention to Sweden, which is the canary in a coal mine for the rest of us.

IMHO, the biggest problem is that for every innocent victim, 100 criminals are getting in as well. Look what happened to Israel with Russia and the mafia, and then again with the Somalians that piggybacked on the Ethiopians.

Sifting out the criminal element from the humanitarian crisis is the key to the problem, and sadly, I don't have any brilliant solutions to offer.
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Sadie




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Aug 31 2015, 4:25 pm
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gold21




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Aug 31 2015, 6:54 pm
im thinking that if Europe would only accept the immigrants "al tnai" so to speak, it would be a lot better than allowing them in with no restrictions on their freedoms.

if all jews were allowed to enter the U.S. during the holocaust but had restricted rights, they would have been grateful for the opportunity to go somewhere safe.
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morah




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Aug 31 2015, 7:07 pm
There were 9.5 million Jews in Europe before the Holocaust. The available places where they would have been safe were England, US, Canada, Israel, Australia, and a few countries South America. It's a lot of people, but it maybe it could have been done. Especially if Israel had been a state already. We are talking 60 million. Even with all sorts of precautions and systems, that's just too many to relocate.
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Raisin




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Sep 01 2015, 3:44 am
some of the migrants are genuine refugees, ie from Syria. Others are economic migrants.
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MagentaYenta




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Sep 04 2015, 1:50 pm
I'm going to revisit this thread because of the general topic.

The Syrian refugee crisis is really on my mind. I'm not watching TV or any of the graphic images but I just heard some interviews of people at the Hungarian train station (Budapest?). I'm getting bothered by Hungary's position on this refuge crisis.

I grew up in NJ not far from what was once Camp Kilmer. CK was used to house Hungarian refugees after the revolution. They eventually became a part of our community and we welcomed their children in our schools. It seems to me that Hungary has a short memory.
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pond user




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Sep 05 2015, 3:49 pm
Hi

I'm European and live in Europe too. It's very easy to say take them all in. I'm sure the USA are taking them in by the thousands? Thought not. It's an international crisis for the following reasons:

The difference between this situation and say the Holocaust is that the Jewish people were targeted. If it were only targeted Christians no country would have a problem with thousands seeking asylum. Unfortunately hundreds of thousands of opportunists have decided to crash with the genuine persected people and make a better western life for themselves in Europe.

The amount of refugees seeking asylum is as high as it was for the first time since the second world war. If all refugees are taken in, European society will be completely lost. Most are devout Muslims and they are expecting their culture to be respected. As we already know this is causing terrorist attacks all over Europe already so the problem would be massively magnified.

Most refugees are seeking welfare from the state, something which all countries are already cutting down on and struggling with so again, it's too much to suddenly add 300000 people onto the welfare list.

Isis have openly declared they are sending terrorists by the hundreds along with real asylum seekers. Sifting them out from genuine people is virtually impossible. So basically if you are to let in refugees you are to be sure a percentage of them are real terrorists.

Finally, Europe has a rule which says the first country a migrant lands in they must seek asylum there. Not cross further through Europe. Because of Europe's open borders policy, countries which weren't expecting refugees are being flooded with them. They aren't coping!

And by the way, why are Saudi Arabia, Iran etc and other Muslim countries not accepting asylum seekers? Because they are aware of the catastrophic repercussions they are likely to bring with them. Europe cannot manage this situation alone.. its a scary time for all Europeans at the moment, especially Jews because we know who extremist Muslims target first and foremost.
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Sadie




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Sep 05 2015, 4:25 pm
pond user wrote:
Hi

I'm European and live in Europe too. It's very easy to say take them all in. I'm sure the USA are taking them in by the thousands? Thought not.


You can sign this petition:

Resettle Syrian Refugees in the U.S
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naturalmom5




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Sep 05 2015, 7:34 pm
Europe, particularly the Scandinavian countries have all kinds of Tzurus from Moslems
It's totally out of control
That's the last thing the us needs
Previous poster with petition , are you a self-hating Jew or just that clueless
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Sadie




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Sep 05 2015, 9:36 pm
naturalmom5 wrote:
Europe, particularly the Scandinavian countries have all kinds of Tzurus from Moslems
It's totally out of control
That's the last thing the us needs
Previous poster with petition , are you a self-hating Jew or just that clueless


Seriously? What a nasty thing to say. There needs to be a version of Godwin's Law for people who use "self-hating Jew" in an argument.
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naturalmom5




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Sep 05 2015, 9:44 pm
Sadie , you do realize that almost the entire population of the once thriving Jewish community in Syria was either killed or chased out
Now you are proposing that these Syrians come to America to potentially hurt Jews
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Sadie




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Sep 05 2015, 10:14 pm
People are not fleeing Syria because they want to hurt Jews, they are running for their lives. They are being murdered and oppressed by the same people who murdered and oppressed the Syrian Jews. That's on one side- on the other side they are being murdered by ISIS, most of whom are not originally Syrian, but who were able to flourish in the region because of wars started by the U.S. We have a responsibility to help.
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Hatemywig




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Sep 05 2015, 10:44 pm
While many if not most of those fleeing, are refugees, there are also quite a few terrorists who have joined the fleeing masses and are a clear and present danger to all of us in the western world.

The most hypocritical part of all of this crisis, is the fact that ISIS was created on Obama's and the EU's watch, since the outbreak of the civil war in Syria, people have been smuggling out information and the world has basically been silent, suddenly when the body of a dead child is viewed world-wide, everyone is to blame, particularly the west.

Where are Dubai, Saudia Arabia and Kuwait to mention a few? Why aren't they taking in their Muslim brothers? Why is only the west responsible?
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DrMom




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Sep 05 2015, 11:11 pm
Sadie wrote:
People are not fleeing Syria because they want to hurt Jews, they are running for their lives. They are being murdered and oppressed by the same people who murdered and oppressed the Syrian Jews. That's on one side- on the other side they are being murdered by ISIS, most of whom are not originally Syrian, but who were able to flourish in the region because of wars started by the U.S. We have a responsibility to help.

Or maybe they are among the same people who oppressed Jews...

IMO, this whole mess is an example of what happens when the Western world steps back from the world arena.

The isolationist philosophy that "We need not get involved in the world's problems," "Why bother with all these problems overseas when we have our own problems at home?" is clearly ignoring the big picture. The world ignored the Syrian civil war for years, and now thousands of Syrians are arriving on their shores. Foolish, shortsighted missteps in the Middle East will come back to haunt the Western World.
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etky




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Sep 05 2015, 11:39 pm
DrMom wrote:
Or maybe they are among the same people who oppressed Jews...

IMO, this whole mess is an example of what happens when the Western world steps back from the world arena.

The isolationist philosophy that "We need not get involved in the world's problems," "Why bother with all these problems overseas when we have our own problems at home?" is clearly ignoring the big picture. The world ignored the Syrian civil war for years, and now thousands of Syrians are arriving on their shores. Foolish, shortsighted missteps in the Middle East will come back to haunt the Western World.


Yes, remember when Obama was poised to get involved in Syria a couple of years ago, and then backed out at the last minute? Perhaps US involvement then would have forestalled the current crisis.
OTOH, sometimes Western involvement in the region, especially when guided by only partial understanding of the real issues at stake, doesn't solve much either or even exacerbates existing problems and tensions.
Bottom line, as I see it, is that every policy has its logic and its shortfalls and it's practically impossible to know the exact results of its application beforehand. Hindsight is 20/20.
That said, I do believe in the merits of US involvement as an overarching policy rather than isolationism.
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happybeingamom




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Sep 06 2015, 5:42 am
When you have that amount of refugees, you can't take them in other countries. The world has to unite and get rid of the problem in the refugees country so they can live there again.
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Raisin




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Sep 06 2015, 8:39 am
I think countries need to agree on taking proportionate amount of refugees. No country should have to take millions while others are taking none. Also, there should be a focus on families with young children.

Obviously, stopping the war in Syria (and other countries) would be ideal. But easier said then done.
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etky




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Sep 06 2015, 8:45 am
Raisin wrote:
I think countries need to agree on taking proportionate amount of refugees. No country should have to take millions while others are taking none. Also, there should be a focus on families with young children.

Obviously, stopping the war in Syria (and other countries) would be ideal. But easier said then done.


Yes, but I don't see an end to it.
Yet more will come, encouraged by their compatriots' resettlement in Europe.
And for Europe, as a continent overall, it will still have all kinds of dire consequences, even if they are divided amongst the different countries.
I don't know what the answer is.
It's nothing less than an invasion - albeit not of the military kind.
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Mevater




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Sep 06 2015, 8:48 am
Heres an article, followed by an interesting comment:

http://news.yahoo.com/pope-cal.....stbox

VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - Pope Francis called on Sunday on every European parish and religious community to take in one migrant family each in a gesture of solidarity he said would start in the tiny Vatican state where he lives.

"I appeal to the parishes, the religious communities, the monasteries and sanctuaries of all Europe to ... take in one family of refugees," he said after his Sunday address in the Vatican.

The pope's call goes out to tens of thousands of Catholic parishes in Europe as the number of refugees arriving over land through the Balkans and across the Mediterranean to Italy and Greece hits record levels.

There are more than 25,000 parishes in Italy alone, and more than 12,000 in Germany, where many of the Syrians fleeing civil war and people trying to escape poverty and hardship in other countries say they want to end up.

The crowd in St. Peter's Square applauded as the pontiff, himself the grandson of Italian emigrants to Argentina, said: "Every parish, every religious community, every monastery, every sanctuary of Europe, take in one family."

The Vatican's two parishes will take in a family of refugees each in the coming days, said Francis, whose first trip after his election was to the Italian island of Lampedusa, halfway between Sicily and Tunisia, where many migrants arrive by boat.

The Italian coast guard said on Saturday it had coordinated the rescue of 329 migrants who made distress calls from their rubber boats.

Francis said taking in migrant families was a "concrete gesture" to prepare for the extraordinary Holy Year on the theme of mercy which is due to begin on Dec. 8.



Comment:

This is so appalling that I want to scream at the top of my lungs for this deaf world to hear. The King of Saudi Arabia just got the royal welcome to the White House this weekend. This SOB used a 410 vehicle Mercedes S class motorcade to arrive to this meeting. They rented an entire large hotel. Meanwhile 3 year olds Syrian toddlers are washing up on the shores of the Mediterranean because they are fleeing the fanatics this same SOB is supporting. Europe is trying to solve the refugee crisis caused by this devil, yet Saudi Arabia, which created this refugee crisis in the first place has taken zero, yes Zero refugees from its fellow moslem country only a few miles away. The only motorcade this SOB should be riding is one with flashing lights escorting him to jail to await trial for genocide. This guy is much worse than Hitler, yet once again the world sits in silence pretending nothing is happening. Shame on the so called "leaders" of the Western World.
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