Migration crisis | Imamother

Raisin

Sun, Sep 06 2015, 11:53 am

Some of this rhetoric sounds all too much like what many countries were saying pre ww2: They are too different, different religion, they might be german spies (indeed many Jewish refugees were interned), the economy is too bad, etc.

I agree muslim extremism is a worry. (isn't that what the refugees are fleeing from?)

pause

Sun, Sep 06 2015, 11:56 am

Take care of the problem in the country of origin.
No, don't ignore the issue.

If the US would have gotten involved in Nazi Germany in 1939 or even earlier, maybe the Holocaust wouldn't have happened.

Better be proactive than reactive.

Mevater

Sun, Sep 06 2015, 11:59 am

Raisin wrote:

Now that the US is at the threshhold of a deal with Iran, together with Moslem countries, couldnt Obama have been instrumental in getting the Moslem countries to do their share of attending to refugees nearby?

Potus hosted the King of Saudia Arabia this past week, just as babies were washing ashore in Syria. Wondering if this issue was brought up at their meeting.

etky

Sun, Sep 06 2015, 12:00 pm

Raisin wrote:

There are historical similarities perhaps but this migration joins and exacerbates an already existing problem in Europe that many states are already not successfully combating.
I'm not sure they're fleeing Muslim extremism in general. They may be fleeing a Muslim extremism that is different from their own particular brand of Muslim extremism or political affiliation- a difference that currently endangers their lives.

Ruchel

Sun, Sep 06 2015, 12:04 pm

The politicians who say take them in won't have to live with them. Zehu. As for the difference with the Shoah, Europe is already struggling with Islamists attacking Jewish, American, European places and interests. This was not the case with Jews pre-war in any country afaik. So you take them, amothers who say we should. There's a reason other Arabic countries are wary...

pond user

Sun, Sep 06 2015, 12:04 pm

Raisin wrote:

Yes that is what some of them are fleeing from. Not all. Not even half. And it's too complicated to discern good from evil. The problem needs to be fought from within their country. Yes the west needs to get involved but not by taking 6 million people from Africa and attempting to integrate them into Europeans. Look at the spèech Bibi gave today: he will help by sending arms, food, aid and soldiers but he will not risk the safety of his civilians by opening his borders. Smart move Bibi.

And the Jewish religion do not have a tendency to blow up people who do not follow Jewish law. Unfornately Islamists do so the first priority would be to protect your own citizens; then come up with a method to save another society. Charity begins at home and comparing Jews to Muslims is a non-starter; we are different in every single way possible.

I'm sorry if I sound heartless but I am living in a country where thousands of refugees have already gained access and are starting to wreak havoc. Of course I feel terrible for the real innocent asylum seekers but I'm more concerned with the safety of my own children and community at the moment. When I feel safe I'd probably think like you and want to help however I can.

black sheep

Sun, Sep 06 2015, 12:59 pm

israel has already been taking in refugees for years. they even have comedy based on it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?.....uJy8Y

imasoftov

Mon, Sep 07 2015, 1:52 am

black sheep wrote:

israel has already been taking in refugees for years. they even have comedy based on it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?.....uJy8Y

1) That's not a video about "taking in" refugees
2) not one of the refugees cleans his streets or washes the dishes where he eats, they all are out to get him. He's also offended that a Muslim is praying.
3) I think I sorta agree with "Ron the leftist" in that video.

DrMom

Mon, Sep 07 2015, 3:10 am

Mevater wrote:

The current administration is clearly not interested in pressuring Iran to do anything ( except accept billions of dollars to fund their terrorism).

And since this deal with Iran infuriated most other Muslim countries in the region, I can't see how he has any leverage to pressure them into anything anyway. Nobody trusts him or wants to work with him (except DNC loyalists).

etky

Mon, Sep 07 2015, 5:25 am

I read that New Zealand has graciously announced that it will absorb 750 Syrian refugees in the course of the next three years...

Sadie

Mon, Sep 07 2015, 8:21 am

DrMom wrote:

Or maybe they are among the same people who oppressed Jews...

IMO, this whole mess is an example of what happens when the Western world steps back from the world arena.

The isolationist philosophy that "We need not get involved in the world's problems," "Why bother with all these problems overseas when we have our own problems at home?" is clearly ignoring the big picture. The world ignored the Syrian civil war for years, and now thousands of Syrians are arriving on their shores. Foolish, shortsighted missteps in the Middle East will come back to haunt the Western World.

I really don't understand where you see the isolationism coming from the Western world- for the past couple hundred years up until the present day the Western world- Europe and the US- have been engaged in colonialist and self-interested wars, propping up oppressive dictators, and backing coups in the Middle East and Africa (and in South and Central America). We've been anything but isolationist and it's been to our ultimate detriment.

In 1892, British diplomat George Curzon described Iran as "pieces on a chessboard upon which is being played out a game for the dominion of the world."

We (the West) invade the Middle East, India (and future Pakistan) and North Africa, divide it up to plunder its spoils, oppress its people and play games of money, oil, and military for *centuries* and then we have the nerve to call them barbarians and to say that we fear them coming to our shores? After all we did to cause or at last help along the constant warfare and instability in the region? There's an expression for that, "the chickens are coming home to roost."

We hated Communism so much that we supported with arms and money the Afghan resistance movement in their war against the Soviets- that resistance movement evolved into the Taliban and al-Qaeda.

The US and the British helped overthrow the democratically elected Prime Minister of Iran in a coup d'etat (related to financial interests re: oil) which helped lead to the Iranian Islamic Revolution.

Of course the Iran-Contra affair when Reagan administration officials illegally sold arms to Iran in order to fund terrorist groups in Central America.

Of course the Iraq war which yes, removed a horrible dictator but caused so much destabilization in the region that it allowed ISIS to flourish.

Pardon my language but everything the West has touch in the Middle East has turned to sh*t.

Even though I'm usually against US intervention I was hoping that there was something that we could do in Syria. We did send money and weapons but unfortunately as usual that type of "help" did more harm than good and the supplies often fell into the wrong hands. Who should we support there? Who should we kill? If we back group X against Assad will they fall in with ISIS afterwards? If we back group Y against ISIS will they take the opportunity of a power vacuum to start their own repressive regime? Will we be creating our own future enemy like we've done so many times in the past?

elisheva25

Mon, Sep 07 2015, 9:35 am

You guys do know that Isis made a video where they said they snuck in terrorists ...a lot of terrorists into Europe?

FranticFrummie

Sun, Sep 20 2015, 11:33 am

Oy. I just saw this video, and I am both appalled and terrified. Do we really want these people on our shores (any shores)?

ImaLAEma

Sun, Sep 20 2015, 3:25 pm

Sadie, I agree with everything you wrote. And you didn't mention the West's support for the Arab Spring, which also opened space for terrorist supporting governments to come into power. By getting rid of Mubarek (yes he was a dictator), room was made for the Muslim Brotherhood to take over, for the Sinai to become a hotbed of terrorism and even for ISIS to begin moving in. The same would probably happen if Assad was removed.

That video Frantic Frummie put up was appalling (and something we all know about from what goes on in Israel - look at some videos of what's happening in Yerushalayim near the Arab areas now). I think all this just shows what happens when people know nothing of history, and only hear all the sound bites the media puts out.

Ema of 5

Sun, Sep 20 2015, 3:46 pm

FranticFrummie wrote:

Oy. I just saw this video, and I am both appalled and terrified. Do we really want these people on our shores (any shores)?

I was going to ask you for a link, but I see it when I quote your post :-)

sneakermom

Sun, Sep 20 2015, 5:02 pm

It's not a migration. It's an invasion.

If these people get in they will outnumber the average European. They will swallow up Europe in no time.

pond user

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 2:41 pm

I rest my case Sad

This result was so predictable. Too many of these 'refugees' are voilent, phsycopathic, mentalists. Two of the French killers have already been identified as Syrian refugees. One of whom is all of 15 years old!!!!!
Can we really allow ANY of them in anymore? Can we really feel sorry for these people?

Perhaps there are truly desperate people amongst the crowd hammering on our doorstep. But at what and who's cost should they be allowed into Europe?

It's important to note that the Jewish establishments in France have been guarded over the past year 24/7 by the military. Possibly this is the only reason an attack on the French Jews did not take place Friday night.

morah

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 2:51 pm

I agree. I said elsewhere, Europe is reaping what they sow. The only real way to deal with this is to fix Syria enough so people stay there. You can't just keep taking people, more will come. And from that part of the world, you just can't trust who's coming. Hope America rethinks the plan to let in 10,000.

pond user

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 2:59 pm

morah wrote:

10,000? Try 800,000 in the small country of Germany etc etc.

Crying

morah

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 3:03 pm

pond user wrote:

10,000? Try 800,000 in the small country of Germany etc etc.

Crying

Yeah, I know. But the US was getting in on it too and 10,000 was the starting point, there were calls to bring it in line with Germany since we're so much bigger. I hope everyone rethinks it, though already you have EU policy makers urging heads of state not to take it out on those poor "refugees" because 2 bad eggs shouldn't spoil the bunch Rolling Eyes