S/o of having less kids...

catonmylap

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 6:40 am

I don't understand why these are the only 2 options....

what about making aliya and living in Israel where tuition is less of an issue or at the very least seeking out a less expensive city in the US where there are vouchers for private school education...

33055

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 7:51 am

catonmylap wrote:

Another option is the Lakewood way where everyone pays for their own children and you don't get the ridiculous situation where a fraction of the people are supporting the large majority.

chani8

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 8:03 am

amother wrote:

what will you answer Hashem (after 120) when you will be asked why you didn't want the other neshamos that were destined to be yours?

For those of you who are bashing this amother, this is standard charedi hashkafa. This is what I was taught, too.

amother

Blonde

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 8:24 am

amother wrote:

what will you answer Hashem (after 120) when you will be asked why you didn't want the other neshamos that were destined to be yours?

This is disgusting. My husband is sterile, and I wouldn't trade him for anything. Am I going to be asked after 120 why I didn't divorce him to have children who were destined to be mine? You have no idea why people do or don't have children.

Laiya

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 10:09 am

Squishy wrote:

Another option is the Lakewood way where everyone pays for their own children and you don't get the ridiculous situation where a fraction of the people are supporting the large majority.

So what happens to those who can't afford even to pay for their own children?

seeker

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 10:21 am

Laiya wrote:

So what happens to those who can't afford even to pay for their own children?

My understanding is that they do their own begging or borrowing, rather than the burden of fundraising and budget shortfalls falling on the school. Which must be very difficult and painful for people in these most desperate situations, but avoids the larger systemic problem brought up here.

youngishbear

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 10:30 am

amother wrote:

Your husband is the one who has the mitzvah, and in his case obviously he is exempt. You are a true ezer kenegdo and eshes chayil. No need for any excuses or explanations, and Hashem knows His cheshbon better than any amother.

33055

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 10:43 am

Laiya wrote:

So what happens to those who can't afford even to pay for their own children?

What happens in Lakewood?

I can tell you what happens with the schools that I send to. Many parents fake hardship, get scholarships and continue to live large. One side of their mouth is saying what new things they bought and the other is telling me their scholarship. Paying full tuition seems to be a choice.

I also think some of the over the top tzedukah practices might be channeled for education. Right now it is the parents of school age children who are supporting almost all the scholarships. The more broad based community who are donating money for hair bows $100 a girl per yontiff or money for jewelry for the mother of the kallah or the mother of the Bar Mitzvah boy might channel their funds to education.

33055

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 10:50 am

seeker wrote:

In my community there is a buffer between the people with the needs and the givers. The rabbis or their representatives call around when someone is in need. They raise money for those who can't pay their rent or were arrested or can't afford a kimpertunim home. BH the community meets the needs.

Laiya

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 10:51 am

seeker wrote:

Interesting, I did not know about this. Clearly, this isn't a perfect solution, either.

It seems the only real answer is to get government assistance for private schools, whether by tax credits, or whatever. As tax-payers, we support public schools, yet the public schools would be unable to handle our students. Anyway.

Laiya

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 10:54 am

Squishy wrote:

Right, but how can a community force people to give tzedakah in a certain way? I can't see how this can work in practice.

Mama Bear

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 10:59 am

amother wrote:

what will you answer Hashem (after 120) when you will be asked why you didn't want the other neshamos that were destined to be yours?

TwinsMommy has [personal info removed]. Once you have a boy and girl, there's no chiyuv to [......]

SRS

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 11:02 am

Laiya wrote:

It seems the only real answer is to get government assistance for private schools, whether by tax credits, or whatever. As tax-payers, we support public schools, yet the public schools would be unable to handle our students. Anyway.

Government assistance in the top 10 states with large frum populations is a long shot. A lot of money is being spent on lobbying, but I'm afraid the problem needs solved at the local levels and solving the problem likely does not mean a full day yeshiva or day school education for each child.

The public schools can easily take in private school populations after a small adjustment period. It really would not be a problem. Public schools have continually adjusted to changing populations, both increases like after the baby boom and decreases in student populations. Public schools might not be the epitome of efficiency, but they can manage population changes and many schools and their staff would welcome more frum students.

Laiya

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 11:19 am

SRS wrote:

I think this would be true in some locales, less so in others. Or the adjustment period would be longer than reasonable. Why do public schools spend avg. $18,000 per year per student? Because of bloat, waste, bureaucracy, etc.

But you're probably right that it wouldn't happen.

amother

Peach

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 11:26 am

Now pray tell me how my daughters school (Satmar) gets so much government funding. They manage to wrangle every program available. Not only is tuition dirt cheap (220$/month), but she sometimes brings home random cheap toys. My friend who used to work in their financial department told me it's because they have to spend a certain amount on toys or whatever.

33055

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 11:35 am

Laiya wrote:

Right, but how can a community force people to give tzedakah in a certain way? I can't see how this can work in practice.

You can channel the tzeduka where it is needed. One diamond eternity band for a bar mitzvah moma can educate 3 children for a year. No one woke up and decided to give the mama the band. They were asked.

I think the very large majority of the people would give money to educate Jewish children rather than give to support ridiculous conspicuous consumption especially with their massur money.

The burden needs to be spread.

It can't be that someone else with a pedigree and experience won't come up with the idea to start a school without scholarships. I would find such a partner if I had young children because that school could skim those that are forced to support the rest and are struggling precisely because of that reason.

33055

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 11:44 am

amother wrote:

Satmar is organized asking for grant money. [...] They pay people to do nothing else but look for grant money. Also because Satmar has a large cash economy the population is poorer on paper so they get more funding.

Satmar gets tens of millions a year according to The Washington Post.

33055

Sun, Oct 04 2015, 11:47 am

Laiya wrote:

This couldn't work in Monsey because Spring Valley is a safe haven for illegal immigrants and therefore is a magnet for them. Regardless of religion the schools are not safe.

The schools spend so much money on the public school students in East Ramapo because of remedial programs such as ESL.