Bring it up or wait for him ask?

amother

Pumpkin

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 6:06 am

My MIL passed away when Dh was in high school. I never knew her. We always knew it was a topic that would have to be dealt with with kids and Dh has planned for years already what he's going to say. Our oldest is 4 and hasn't noticed that he's missing a bubby. He's a very inquisitive child when it comes to physical stuff- why's the Sky blue, and those types of questions - but not at all philosophical. I think he just takes at face value that he has only 1 bubby even though all his friends have 2. Or maybe he didn't notice. They're learning about grandparents in school this week and I thought for sure it might get him wondering, but it hasn't. So my question is- do I have Dh just bring it up himself, or should we wait a little longer to see if he asks? Part of me thinks why bring up something so heavy, he's so young. But the thing is, if he asked I'd have no problem explaining in whatever terms he can understand. So, what would you do? And if you do think we should wait for him to bring it up, at what point do we bring it up if he still hasn't?

imasinger

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 7:18 am

The odds of everyone else in the class having 4 grandparents are vanishingly small.

I agree. Leave it for now.

It is a common 1st or 2nd grade project to make a family tree, and that might be the time the subject logically comes up.

But your DS probably won't think about the implications of DH having lost a mother in HS unless you spell it out for him. Don't.

When he is much older, like in HS himself, it would be a better time to discuss that piece.

amother

Amber

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 8:56 am

We had a similar situation. When dd was very little, she saw family photos and heard conversations about her grandfather, so she knew he existed but died before she was born.

Very young children are not traumatized to know that someone died before they were born. It is like, as an adult, knowing that George Washington died before you were born. They also are naturally self-centered and wouldn't think about how someone else felt when something bad happened.

When dd was five, her other grandfather died, and she did feel real loss. Around that age children start to understand the finality of death and also have more complex thoughts in general. She realized that it was possible for other people in her world to die, and that was upsetting to her. She did not, however, connect it to her grandfather who died before she was born. He wasn't that real to her, and knowing about her father's long-ago loss was not then and remains (now that she is much older) not very emotional for her.

I would not hide your late MIL from your children. Let them see her picture and hear stories about her as they come up naturally in conversation. Your husband should certainly share with them, as you say he is planning to do, the fact that he lost his mother quite young. However, he needs to realize that the kids may respond to this information in unanticipated ways, depending on their ages and personalities. If they don't seem sad, that's ok. It doesn't mean they don't understand or don't care. Also, keep in mind that once the oldest knows, it won't be a secret from the others.

amother

Purple

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 9:38 am

I lost my father when I was child and my kids have always been told about my father. We have pictures around, and I talk to my kids about him. He's not some big secret that I have to figure out when to explain it to my kids. He's my father! Death is a fact of life. I don't explain in graphic detail exactly what happened to him, but they always know that Mommy's father was niftar. If you make it a part of their life before they're old enough to be traumatized, they will never be traumatized. I find as they get older they have more questions, but it's never really hurt any of them.

Why should your husband have to hide the fact that he had a mother and now she's dead? The fact that he lost his mother is hard enough, why should he treat it like something dirty and secretive?

observer

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 10:01 am

Honestly, I don't think it will be a heavy topic for him. I think you and dh are projecting your own feelings, since it's a heavy topic for both of you.

As for noticing, kids usually accept things as they are. Had he known the grandparent and then grandparent dropped out of his life, it would be different.

I would leave it for now. If he asks, give clear simple answers. Don't overload him with your and dh's emotions.

amother

Pumpkin

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 10:12 am

I think some of you are not understanding the situation. We are not concerned about trauma or how he would handle it nor are we hiding anything. There are pictures of her around the house and stuff. It's just that ds hasn't noticed anything on his own. He doesn't realize that he's missing a bubby and he has never asked who the lady in the pictures is. So my issue is, do we start the conversation ourselves or wait until he brings it up? What if he never brings it up, is there an age at which it should be brought up no matter what? Dh doesn't talk about his childhood much in general. Not because he's hiding anything, he just isn't the the nostalgic type.

amother

Purple

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 10:28 am

amother wrote:

Got it. I think you should bring it up, just don't make a big deal about it. Maybe look at all the pictures with him and casually mention that this is dh's mother who's not alive anymore. Something like that. Eventually he's going to find out, and you don't want him to wonder why you didn't tell him.

seeker

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 10:45 am

I have waited for dd to ask, but allowed for plenty of opening for that discussion. It has come up a few times and by now I think she has digested enough. It came up in context of discussing family roles ("daddy is your husband, right? Who is bubby's husband?") and other times I have casually mentioned it ("my daddy used to sing that song too." "Who's your daddy?") or, for a loved one who passed away after dd was born, she has seen the pictures in her baby book - I don't think she'd have been interested enough to ask about pictures that don't involve her Wink

but in her album she asks. Around kindergarten the parsha stories start to involve people "being nifter" so that might help the concept along.

We have never discussed the circumstances of their passing, though.

LittleDucky

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 11:18 am

I think this is a very personal thing. It depends on how often these things are brought up and how you approach it.

I grew up (as far back as I can remember) knowing about death. I wasn't traumatized or even very worried. I had a goldfish (ok several fish, none lasted very long) who died. My parents explained that it went to gan Eden where X relative was. Since everyone in my family is named for someone, many of the names of my siblings are not some long lost relative. Some are 3 generations back (my parents grandparents) but most are those "I should have known"- grandparent, cousin etc.
My parents just taught us from an early age that we have 5 grandparents and one was niftar. I don't think you should wait until they are old enough to understand- even if you are not worried about the trauma, there will likely be some. Especially since death is already "present in the house" Another kid I knew didn't understand why I was upset (for a day or two, not a long time) about a pet dying. She thought it was like a plane trip. I can't imagine what it was like for her to finally understand.

seeker

Sun, Nov 15 2015, 11:54 am

I agree that the younger kids are when exposed to the idea, the less of an issue it is. Little kids are generally very matter-of-fact and can deal with these things well. My DD is a very sensitive deep thinker and while she (not-yet-5) has had a lot of philosophical questions about death, it has not yet occurred to her to ponder the difficult aspects like how much you miss a person who is not with you anymore. Some of our best conversations have happened when driving past cemeteries. ("Mommy what kind of place is this? What are all those things? What do you do there? Did you ever go there?") (and then there was the time I let slip that the last time we were in Eretz Yisrael was "when you were still inside of Mommy." I sure hope that one never comes back to haunt me or gets repeated on the playground, but I'm glad it happened because until then I had no idea how to bring it up...)

observer

Mon, Nov 16 2015, 2:03 pm

seeker wrote:

(and then there was the time I let slip that the last time we were in Eretz Yisrael was "when you were still inside of Mommy." I sure hope that one never comes back to haunt me or gets repeated on the playground, but I'm glad it happened because until then I had no idea how to bring it up...)

That's regular household talk by us. My kids all know that a baby grows inside the mommy until it's big enough and ready to be born.

Why are you worried about that?

amother

Pumpkin

Mon, Nov 16 2015, 2:13 pm

observer wrote:

That's regular household talk by us. My kids all know that a baby grows inside the mommy until it's big enough and ready to be born.

Why are you worried about that?

Funny you mention that. I happen to be pregnant now, and he knows babies grow inside the mommy (he already has a younger sibling, though definitely doesn't remember that pregnancy) and as with this, we were also waiting for him to notice my belly and ask or observe something. I'm 28 weeks, and nada. But there, we've made a definite decision, if he still hasn't said anything by the end of Chanukah, we will just tell him Smile

Dolly Welsh

Mon, Nov 16 2015, 2:54 pm

When there are children under 4 in a house, the four year old looks like a grown man, in contrast to them.

Four is a very, very, very little child.

Let it all alone until six. At the earliest.

If he asks, that's different, but it would be awfully precocious and unlikely.

At four, you are living in the minute you are in. You aren't thinking beyond that. Certainly not about people who aren't there who ought to be there.

It is so easy to forget how little they are, when their development is ahead of even younger ones.

It is easy to forget that even when there aren't any younger ones.

Even the ones who talk older than their years still only really understand at their age level.

"Developmental is developmental" is the phrase. NOBODY escapes the slow pace of human development, no matter how smart they are.

Four is little kid.

seeker

Mon, Nov 16 2015, 5:09 pm

observer wrote:

That's regular household talk by us. My kids all know that a baby grows inside the mommy until it's big enough and ready to be born.

Why are you worried about that?

Because she asked some verrrry detailed questions, and while my philosophy is that it is healthy for children to know certain details I am sure others in my school/community might not see eye to eye on that. And even if others in the community do share my views, the school itself is mainly staffed by more chareidi types and I am pretty sure I don't want them judging me by the amount of anatomy my highly inquisitive 4-year-old knows.

mommyla

Mon, Nov 16 2015, 8:03 pm

I grew up without a grandparent and I have no recollection of learning that I was different than kids who had four grandparents. That's just the way it was. Some kids had grandparents locally, others had grandparents in other countries, some had great-grandparents (though not very many) and some had no grandparents. It's just a matter of fact, many kids won't think about it too much.

LiLIsraeli

Mon, Nov 16 2015, 8:12 pm

I had only one set of grandparents growing up. It's just the way it was. It was my "normal." I took it at face value, and at some point I understood that other people had two sets of grandparents. I remember once in elementary school - maybe 3rd grade or so - I realized I was in the minority, having only two grandparents, and I said to a friend, "Guess how many grandparents I have!" She looked at me quizzically and said, "Four, of course, like everyone else!" It was the first time she had heard of someone not having four grandparents. That was her "normal."

I don't think it's age-appropriate to bring up this topic with him. I would wait until he asks, if he does. It could be he never will and will just understand on his own.