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Forum
-> Interesting Discussions
Do you have a close relative who is OTD?
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| No |
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37% |
[ 41 ] |
| Yes - a brother |
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24% |
[ 27 ] |
| Yes - sister |
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10% |
[ 11 ] |
| Yes - a son |
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3% |
[ 4 ] |
| Yes - a daughter |
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4% |
[ 5 ] |
| Yes - a brother-in-law |
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10% |
[ 11 ] |
| Yes - a sister-in-law |
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1% |
[ 2 ] |
| Other - State below |
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7% |
[ 8 ] |
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| Total Votes : 109 |
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amother
Navy
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 Wed, Nov 18 2015, 10:26 am
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I read in the Yated that Rav Steinman said he only recommends Nachala Charedi for boys that are totally off because this month alone 15 fathers came to him with their sons name he should daven they should die. The pain and shame of having an OTD family member is unbearable able
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5mom
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 10:32 am
| amother wrote: | | I read in the Yated that Rav Steinman said he only recommends Nachala Charedi for boys that are totally off because this month alone 15 fathers came to him with their sons name he should daven they should die. The pain and shame of having an OTD family member is unbearable able |
If a boy has the kind of father who would daven for his death, it's no wonder....
Though I don't believe the story. I can't bring myself to believe that people would want a child to die, much less tell it to someone they see as a gadol. I'm going to chalk this up to a clueless askan who thinks scaremongering is an acceptable educational technique.
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amother
Navy
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 11:09 am
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In the November 6 issue Food for Thought by Yitzchok Hissiger
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amother
Pumpkin
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 11:17 am
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as a mother of on otd son that is the craziest thing I heard to daven for your child to die. believe me its not easy at all and we went and are going through a lot but the more we do for him and help him the more we love him not the way he acts and the things he does but we keep davening that he gets out of all of this mess and shows everyone what he really is because we know he has so much good in him and hes just very troubled inside.
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amother
Navy
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 11:21 am
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Of course we love our children and we should keep beseeching Hashem to see nachas from them - but I guess there are parents that have tried everything possible and just can't bear it anymore
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PinkFridge
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 11:24 am
| amother wrote: | | Every single expert in the field, without exception, says the main reason kids go off the Derech is that they went through some sort of trauma in their lives. Otherwise they wouldn't want to live differently than their family. Its never a faith problem, even if they say it is. |
By main do you mean biggest part of the pie chart?
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amother
Pumpkin
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 11:34 am
| amother wrote: | | Of course we love our children and we should keep beseeching Hashem to see nachas from them - but I guess there are parents that have tried everything possible and just can't bear it anymore |
I still cant imagine thinking that. we were at the point where we thought there is nothing else to do and there is no hope but I just cry for him it never once entered my mind the thought oh him ch'v dying hes our child.
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amother
Navy
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 11:54 am
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We should never give up hoping praying loving them to no end I'm sure most of them eventually come around
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amother
Firebrick
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 11:55 am
My first cousin is otd. We are a very close extended family. And he is the first person in the recorded history of our family on either side (we can trace our yichus all the way back) who is not shomer Shabbos.
We all love him and support him. The only person who doesn't know his religious level is my 90 year old grandmother. He always puts a yarmulke on when he goes to visit her. Which he does often cuz he's a sweety. It would be too much for her to handle, and he knows that. So he hides his cell phone if he visits on Shabbos etc.
He works in the family business with everyone, he comes to Shabbos meals when he's not busy, we all like his band page on Facebook  .
Oh we are a Chabad family. (Gezhe for those who know and care, I certainly don't).
I could never ever ever ever imagine davening for him to die. Even my uncle who struggled with this tremendously loves his son enormously and can see his kindness and goodness even with his jewfro his ripped jeans and his lack of Tzitzit yarmulke beard etc.. All things important to my uncle.
The whole family is on a mission to set him up with a nice girl who is very similar to him. (He wants this- I've discussed it with him.) I personally think he is still young and immature. (Low twenties).
Anyway, I currently now live in a different continent to him so my only contact is via Facebook.
It was definitely not an easy thing for my family to accept, but he's family so you always accept and support and love them. That's what family means (in our family anyway).
I know I am not a sibling so maybe there are some deep dark secrets I don't know.
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amother
Black
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 12:07 pm
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Curious why dh is not an option? (No hugs necessary. We married happily with full disclosure)
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amother
Bronze
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 4:07 pm
 brother in law and sister in law.
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shoshana2
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 5:50 pm
My former husband went OTD - he did this at age 40.
Smilingmom, In what way is somone who goes off a different breed than a teenager? I tend to agree with that statement.
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zaq
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 5:54 pm
| amother wrote: | | I read in the Yated that Rav Steinman said he only recommends Nachala Charedi for boys that are totally off because this month alone 15 fathers came to him with their sons name he should daven they should die. The pain and shame of having an OTD family member is unbearable able |
IF this is true( I fervently hope it is only Yated's slanted journalism), then something is horribly, horribly wrong with these fathers and may explain why their dss are OTD. A normal father would daven for his son to come back onto the derech. We say every Yom Kippur "Ki lo tachpotz bemot hamet ki im beshuvo midarko vechaya." Even the KBH doesn't pray for sinners to die. Were these fathers absent from school the day they covered that?
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shoshana2
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 6:09 pm
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Somtimes Hashem takes a sinner from this world to prevent him from hurting his neshama further and to spare him from loosing his olam habah. But that is Hashem's cheshbon not ours.
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shoshana2
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 6:17 pm
| amother wrote: | My first cousin is otd. We are a very close extended family. And he is the first person in the recorded history of our family on either side (we can trace our yichus all the way back) who is not shomer Shabbos.
We all love him and support him. The only person who doesn't know his religious level is my 90 year old grandmother. He always puts a yarmulke on when he goes to visit her. Which he does often cuz he's a sweety. It would be too much for her to handle, and he knows that. So he hides his cell phone if he visits on Shabbos etc.
He works in the family business with everyone, he comes to Shabbos meals when he's not busy, we all like his band page on Facebook .
Oh we are a Chabad family. (Gezhe for those who know and care, I certainly don't).
I could never ever ever ever imagine davening for him to die. Even my uncle who struggled with this tremendously loves his son enormously and can see his kindness and goodness even with his jewfro his ripped jeans and his lack of Tzitzit yarmulke beard etc.. All things important to my uncle.
The whole family is on a mission to set him up with a nice girl who is very similar to him. (He wants this- I've discussed it with him.) I personally think he is still young and immature. (Low twenties).
Anyway, I currently now live in a different continent to him so my only contact is via Facebook.
It was definitely not an easy thing for my family to accept, but he's family so you always accept and support and love them. That's what family means (in our family anyway).
I know I am not a sibling so maybe there are some deep dark secrets I don't know. |
Rav Shimon Schwab said at his Seder table (heard this from his granddaughter), "My children, I love you, but I love Hashem more. If any of you leave the derech hayashar you will not be welcome at my table"
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zaq
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 6:29 pm
| shoshana2 wrote: | | Rav Shimon Schwab said at his Seder table (heard this from his granddaughter), "My children, I love you, but I love Hashem more. If any of you leave the derech hayashar you will not be welcome at my table" |
There is a slight difference between being unwelcoming and praying for someone's death, wouldn't you say? How do the suicide-prevention counselors express it: Don't seek a permanent solution to a temporary problem.
Also, this is what the late Rav said to make a point at a table full of people who were probably at fairly low risk of going OTD. Since afaik none of his children actually went otd, we have no way of knowing what the rav would really have done had any of them in fact gone otd. Hyperbole to emphasize a point is not the sole property of poets and politicians.
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shoshana2
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 6:43 pm
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Why would you say that I was equating being welcome at a table to praying for someone's death? I never said any such thing - putting words into someone's mouth is not the sole property of poets and polatitians.
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amother
Pink
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 7:22 pm
| shoshana2 wrote: | | Rav Shimon Schwab said at his Seder table (heard this from his granddaughter), "My children, I love you, but I love Hashem more. If any of you leave the derech hayashar you will not be welcome at my table" |
I would SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO love to hear that from his mouth! Or anything even close to that. No one thinks like that about OTD kids in 2015. Those angry sentiments are long passe.
According to the Stitchiner Rebbe, OTD kids are the Korbonei Tzibur of our generation, and are possibly OTD because the frum community didnt deal correctly with them.
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amother
Silver
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 7:27 pm
| amother wrote: | | Curious why dh is not an option? (No hugs necessary. We married happily with full disclosure) |
Amothers black, I would love to talk to u. My hub is also OTD. I found out before the chagim, and I'm still struggling to come to terms with it. I have times when I accept it so nicely, other times I cry myself out , and I'm down for days. We have a great marriage, we love each other to pieces, still it's so hard.
I'm the op of just discovered DH is OTD, I'm beyond shattered. I don't know how to link the thread.
U think we can communicate in person? I mean by phone? Only if ur fine with it, of course. Thanks!
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Cookie Monster
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Wed, Nov 18 2015, 7:57 pm
| amother wrote: | | In the November 6 issue Food for Thought by Yitzchok Hissiger |
If the Yated printed it it must be true.
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