As jews, what pets aren't we allowed to own?

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Forum -> Judaism -> Halachic Questions and Discussions

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gp2.0

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 1:47 pm

amother wrote:

Even tho we are chassidish I'm not going to ruin my marriage over it. My husband is not strong in his yiddishkeit as is. I tried my luck 1ce. I'm not here to be his rabbi.

The reason why I didn't ask specifically what is accepted in our circles is because I already know it's not the best idea. I wanted to hear from all circles. If it's only a minhag than I won't feel so guilty about it and I'll save the battles for things that are black and white in the Torah.

I read other posts about owning pets and how it is accepted in certain communities and it made me worried. Someone wrote that the school wasn't happy about it and neither the neighbors. Hmm...

Lots of chassidish people have pets and just don't tell anyone. Fish, birds, reptiles, rodents and small animals like Guinea pigs, hamsters, rabbits etc. are owned by many chassidish people who just don't tell anyone.

simchat

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 4:58 pm

gp2.0 wrote:

I asked about chabad because I know they may have an issue with pregnant women or children being around non kosher animals.

Never heard of this shock

. What about animals in the street? Plus all the schools I know take the kids on trips to farms, zoos etc...

penguin

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 5:38 pm

Definitely not a pig though.
Now, a cute penguin....that would be an idea.

gp2.0

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 6:12 pm

simchat wrote:

Never heard of this shock

. What about animals in the street? Plus all the schools I know take the kids on trips to farms, zoos etc...

Well I'm not chabad so I don't have all the answers. But I have heard chabad pregnant women don't go to the zoo, they don't buy children's clothing with non kosher animals on them and sometimes don't buy stuffed animals either. It comes up now and then on imamother or you can search on the chabad site.

Maya

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 6:19 pm

gp2.0 wrote:

I was told not to go to the zoo or look at dogs in the street while pregnant. I thought it was a mainstream Chassidish thing.

The Chabad thing is about nonkosher animals in general, not only during pregnancy. Like you said, they won't buy clothing or stuffed animals of the nonkosher kind.

boymom

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 6:21 pm

I actually know a typical chassidish family in bp that has a rabbit. I think it's a cute pet.

simchat

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 6:27 pm

Right, there are some chabad families that try not to buy clothes etc with a non kosher animal on it (most people I know don't follow this 'rule'). However, I had never heard of this in regard to real animals.

gp2.0

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 6:56 pm

Maya wrote:

Ehh. I wouldn't say mainstream. More like people on the right side of mainstream chassidish. I heard of this from my side of the family, but DH family (also mainstream chassidish) never heard of it. KWIM?

sky

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 7:07 pm

I also have a few families I wouldn't buy a baby gift or toy with non-kosher animal. I thought it was pretty accepted in chabad.

I also though mainstream chassidish doesn't go to a zoo when pregnant.

Volunteer

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 8:24 pm

The only kind of pet you're prohibited to own is one that might be dangerous to others (such as an aggressive dog). The source is the verse about erecting a balcony that says, "do not place blood on your house." The sages took that to mean it is prohibited to have anything dangerous in your house, which might injure a visitor.

Tzutzie

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 8:53 pm

We don't go to the zoo when pregnant and trynot to look at cars and dogs in the street. We do buy outfits with pictures of nonkosher animals. We did have fish and a few of my married siblings did too. (Word of advice, dont get fish if you have kids between the ages of 1 and 5 unless you are ok woth them to tasting it).
We also kept some kittens that we found in our backyard till my father found out and made us let it loose and the mother came to take them.

amother

Babyblue

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 8:56 pm

Just clarifying about chabad since it came up...
Our minhag is not to buy anything with non kosher animal that a child will get attached to (teddy bear or stuffed animal, clothes with large animals on it, toys etc.) Some are extra careful and won't buy any toys / books / garments unless the animal can be covered.
Books or pictures used to teach (parshas noach, or animal unit) is completely fine. So is going to a farm or zoo. The point is the kid shouldn't get attached to it, but totally fine to learn / see it.
For this reason a non kosher pet is obviously strongly discouraged as kids will definitely get attached to it, and that's considered worse then a toy or fake animal.However there are still families that do have pets, it's not like it's ossur just a strong minhag. There are families that are extra strict and won't even allow their kids to play with dogs etc. but I think that's extreme and not norm.
Pregnant women is a whole separate thing -when pregnant it's our minhag not to go to a zoo or farm, and to try not to look at / stare at non kosher animals.
Sorry for going off topic, just clarifying since it came up...

Last edited by amother on Wed, Mar 13 2019, 4:08 pm; edited 1 time in total

sweb

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 9:15 pm

We're chassidish and have a rabbit for yrs never even thought of asking!! Why would I ask? doesn't feel like something to ask about!

yogabird

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 9:18 pm

sequoia wrote:

Still not clear what the reasoning about parakeets was. Aren't all birds kosher except birds of prey?

No there's a list of birds that are kosher and the rest are not.

howru2day

Mon, Nov 23 2015, 9:33 pm

yogabird wrote:

No there's a list of birds that are kosher and the rest are not.

And how about a yogabird? Wink

shabbatiscoming

Tue, Nov 24 2015, 1:18 am

When we lived in rbs a while ago, whenever I walked to my bus stop for work, I would always hear......a goat Smile

So people have all kinds of pets.
I know a family who own turkeys. (thats fun for the neighbors Wink

)

ValleyMom

Tue, Nov 24 2015, 2:04 am

I don't think I would ever own a pig.

33055

Tue, Nov 24 2015, 7:17 am

gp2.0 wrote:

There is a source against owning a dog that is either large or has a loud bark and would scare away people. Don't remember exactly what it is or how legitimate it is.

Some hold any unnecessary animal in the home is a source of tumah, muktzeh on Shabbos and some other issues. I think they're not clear cut and debatable with several different halachic positions. Some would hold that every time the animal touches you or you touch the animal you'd be tumah and have to wash your hands. Making a bracha in the presence of uncovered or smelly feces is an issue. Covered feces (as in litter box) is ok.

Spay/neuter is another issue but I think I've heard of a way around it, selling the pet for a day the way we sell chometz and getting it done that way.

In general I think less issues come up with smaller pets like birds, rodents, fish etc. But I don't think any one pet is explicitly against Halacha with no room for a heter.

Halacha is stronger than that. If even one person around is afraid of a non-kosher animal you can't have a pet. So even if one neighbor is afraid of a cat or a tiny cute non-barking dog then you can't own one. Even if the person is not being reasonable.

Many Chassidim believe a cat sucks out Torah learning from the human brain and many have never been exposed to dogs and have big fears practically speaking our family can't have a cat or dog. Some people keep chickens and goats. A few have fish tanks.

gp2.0

Tue, Nov 24 2015, 8:33 am

Squishy wrote:

I wonder how this worked, practically, when many people had non-kosher working animals like horses, mules or camels. There's always bound to be at least one person around who was kicked or dropped by a horse etc. as a child and has a terrible fear of horses etc.

Or does this not apply to working animals?

gp2.0

Tue, Nov 24 2015, 8:47 am

I don't know how accurate or out of context this is, but the consensus here seems to be that owning a pet dog is not an issue, especially if it is a small dog or large gentle hunting dog. An "evil" dog who barks and bites (some say only bites, some say even if it has loud scary bark without bite) is against halacha. http://www.daat.ac.il/daat/eng.....1.htm

So breeds like rottweilers, chow chows, akitas, huskies, eskimo dogs, malamutes, mastiffs, pit bulls - basically large, territorial dogs who were bred for strength, protection, fighting ability, loud barking and extremely hard "mouth grips" are not okay.

But small breeds like chihuahuas and terriers, as well as hounds, herding dogs, hunting dogs (these include labradors, retrievers, standard poodles - just for context of what hunting dog means) who are either too small to scare people or have been bred to be very gentle and quiet with a "soft mouth" are okay to own as pets.

Last edited by gp2.0 on Tue, Nov 24 2015, 8:58 am; edited 1 time in total

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