Neutering a male dog

amother

Saddlebrown

Sun, Apr 17 2016, 7:17 pm

Anyone familiar with the Halacha of neutering a male dog? I'm aware that the dog has to be Sold to a non Jew and be brought to a non Jewish vet. Once dog is sold to non Jew, can the Jewish owner take the dog to the vet or does the owner need a non Jewish messenger to do it? Also, is there a specific amount of money the dog should be sold for?

*asked a rav who said it's complicated and will look into it. Wondering if anyone here has done it or got an answer from a rav.

Seas

Sun, Apr 17 2016, 7:39 pm

Selling to a non Jewish vet isn't such a simple thing. It's brought in the poskim that if someone does that they're forced by beis din to have to sell the animal. I had the same shailoh with a female pet, which is not as problematic, and the unanimous answer was that it's ossur.

The best thing is to buy a second hand pet that's already been neutered.

amother

Saddlebrown

Sun, Apr 17 2016, 7:52 pm

Seas wrote:

We already have the puppy. I didn't realize the halachic complications before the fact. I heard there is a way to do it, not by selling him to the vet directly, but by selling him to a non Jew (not the vet) and then when he's no longer under your ownership taking him or having someone else take him (not sure about that part) to the non Jewish vet to have it done. Then, you can buy him back.

amother

Saddlebrown

Sun, Apr 17 2016, 8:02 pm

greenfire wrote:

you would need a non-jew to bring it ... you can go along & you don't need anyone to pick him up to bring doggy home

Thanks for clarifying that. Do u happen to know the source?

greenfire

Sun, Apr 17 2016, 8:22 pm

amother wrote:

Thanks for clarifying that. Do u happen to know the source?

no tangible sefer - if that's what you're asking

been there done that with my daughter and her pets and a non-jewish friend who brought them ...

she also got her friend to do this for someone else's pet in the neighborhood

shayla was asked

but my rav is not your rav is not her rav

amother

Saddlebrown

Sun, Apr 17 2016, 8:44 pm

greenfire wrote:

Ok thanks for the info!

singleagain

Sun, Apr 17 2016, 10:30 pm

amother wrote:

I think the Pasuk is Vayikrah 22:24

This is abt korbanot, not pets

כד וּמָעוּךְ וְכָתוּת וְנָתוּק וְכָרוּת, לֹא תַקְרִיבוּ לַיהוָה; וּבְאַרְצְכֶם, לֹא תַעֲשׂוּ. 24 That which hath its stones bruised, or crushed, or torn, or cut, ye shall not offer unto the LORD; neither shall ye do thus in your land.

http://www.mechon-mamre.org/p/pt/pt0322.htm

gp2.0

Sun, Apr 17 2016, 11:14 pm

singleagain wrote:

It's about karbanot and pets and livestock. "Ye shall not offer unto the Lord" is about karbanot. "Neither shall ye do thus in your land" refers to any animals that belong to you.

amother

Saddlebrown

Sun, Apr 17 2016, 11:41 pm

singleagain wrote:

As far as I read, rashi and others comment on the words "neither shall ye do thus in your land" and say it implies that you can't do those things to any animal in your land.

amother

Oak

Mon, Apr 18 2016, 7:35 am

Don't know if this matters but there are medical reasons to neuter dogs--prevents pyometria in females and testicular cancer in males. Would that make a difference in what's halachically acceptable?

FranticFrummie

Mon, Apr 18 2016, 7:44 am

amother wrote:

Don't know if this matters but there are medical reasons to neuter dogs--prevents pyometria in females and testicular cancer in males. Would that make a difference in what's halachically acceptable?

No, it's still assur to do it directly.

I sold my pets to my non Jewish exhusband, and he drove us to the non Jewish vet. I bought back the animals after we got the pet back home. It's a lot easier to do in the US, but if you are in Israel, call around to vet offices and ask how they arrange things, or find a frum pet owner.

Neutering is very good for pets who are not being kept for purebred reasons, not just for health, but because psychologically they suffer when their hormonal urges are frustrated. This can make dogs destructive from frustration, or even aggressive. They will also do anything and everything to escape the yard, "looking for love in all the wrong places."

I also want to second that it's much better to adopt a pet who is sitting on death row, and deserves a forever home. All the medical stuff is taken care of in advance for you.