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There is Chassidish and then there is Chassidish
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amother
Aquamarine


 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 2:09 pm
cnc wrote:
Except that Muslim is a religion and chassidus is not.

Also I don't think that the majority of Chassidish people see chassidus as a box. Maybe in your circles it's seen as such.

I don't think the majority of Chassidish people think it's perfectly okay for a woman who calls herself Chassidish to wear bikinis, uncover her hair, and wear skintight clothes.
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amother
Aquamarine


 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 2:10 pm
amother wrote:
Did I mention a woman at the beach with a bikini and uncovered hair? Or even dark nail polish?

I was thinking of - a Stolin or Boyan woman in Brooklyn or Lakewood with a longer sheitel who looks yeshivish, drives, doesn't shave, has a degree, etc., compared to a Satmar woman from Williamsburg or Monroe who wears a shpitzel, seams, shaves, doesn't drive, etc. (Sorry for the stereotypes.)

Is the Stolin woman, who leads a simple kollel life and whose husband goes to his Rebbe in Eretz Yisroel every Rosh Hashana, a tuna beigel?

See, there's different degrees. They're both chassidish - but yes, there is a spectrum. Yes, there may sadly be a box - but the box is bigger than most imagine, and the box has different types at each end, with plenty of other types in between the ends.

THIS thread is discussing those women who you'd only know they are Chassidish when you see their husbands in shul, or you see them talking to their sons in peyos. Not those other types that you're describing. The subjects of this thread are not on the same spectrum as the kind of women you're talking about, who are in the regular Chassidish box.
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amother
Coffee


 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 2:15 pm
amother wrote:
This thread is discussing those women who you'd only know they are Chassidish when you see their husbands in shul, or you see them talking to their sons in peyos. Not those other types that you're describing.


Why not?

I have many Stoliner and Boyaner friends, and there is no way I could tell they were chassidish until they told me. They looked like every other typical yeshivish woman in Lakewood.

OP described beautiful, trendy clothing and longer sheitels.

I honestly don't know why you assumed she was talking about women who dress in skin tight clothing and sit at the beach in bikinis.

There's many chassidish women who don't look like the stereotypical vision we may have of chassidish women. I'm talking about the ones you would think were litvish, more American, etc.

I really don't understand why you keep picturing bikinis and uncovered hair. (I mean, the OP even mentioned they were all wearing sheitels...)
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Butterfly




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 2:23 pm
dimyona wrote:
No, a dress code is either how you feel like dressing, how you want people to think of you, or sometimes simply the tendency to conform or vice versa.

I've met many people wearing shtreimels who are barely frum in the way they act and speak, I've met some who wish they wouldn't be forced to wear one because their heart is somewhere else, and many who haven't given it a second thought.

Clothing is the most superficial and innacurate way to define people, frumkeit or otherwise.


Daniellast wrote:
Well, most of you have the term chassidish wrong. Chassidish has nothing much with the way you dress. Chassidish means you belong to a Rebbe and follow his guidance. Yes, then you're husband (and sons) may dress according to their specific chassidus. One can be chassidish and dress frum or like a hipster. Your dress code says who you are in your heart (frum, modern, trendy etc) in the litvish world you have the exact same thing.

IMVHO you are both right on target!
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cnc




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 2:32 pm
amother wrote:
I don't think the majority of Chassidish people think it's perfectly okay for a woman who calls herself Chassidish to wear bikinis, uncover her hair, and wear skintight clothes.


Substitute the word religious for chassidish.

This has nothing to do with Chassidish people fitting into a box. This is against religious societal (halachic) norms in general.
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amother
Slateblue


 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 2:32 pm
How is dark nail polish the same as a bikini?

I'm not in the chassidish world, but I would think that a bikini would be considered by everyone as way more out of the box than dark nail polish. In my community there are definitely different degrees of deviation from what's considered the norm or "in the box" of acceptable.

I think that most (many) frum jews wouldn't wear a bikini in public, but many would wear dark nail polish.
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ROFL




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 4:45 pm
The problem is that some people do equate a bikini and dark nail polish. That is where we ( whomever we are ! ) are really a messed up religion !
Most of the normal frum people ---
chassidish yeshivish or even modern orthodox know that there is a difference.
Then there are the ones who don't know the difference ! They are the ones that stand outside the box!
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amother
Coffee


 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 4:48 pm
ROFL wrote:
The problem is that some people do equate a bikini and dark nail polish. That is where we ( whomever we are ! ) are really a messed up religion !
Most of the normal frum people ---
chassidish yeshivish or even modern orthodox know that there is a difference.
Then there are the ones who don't know the difference ! They are the ones that stand outside the box!


I really hope that most people know the difference...

I just don't understand the preoccupation with boxes.
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cnc




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 4:58 pm
ROFL wrote:
The problem is that some people do equate a bikini and dark nail polish. That is where we ( whomever we are ! ) are really a messed up religion !
Most of the normal frum people ---
chassidish yeshivish or even modern orthodox know that there is a difference.
Then there are the ones who don't know the difference ! They are the ones that stand outside the box!


For some reason I feel like those are the ones that stand INSIDE the box. Very Happy
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groisamomma




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 5:28 pm
cnc wrote:
For some reason I feel like those are the ones that stand INSIDE the box. Very Happy


I agree. I think, and I may be wrong here, that to people like that anything forbidden to them is the same NO. I think they don't understand that there are different levels of no. Big no-no and Little no. Nail polish might be a no for some but it's not the same weight as a bikini No. Kind of like thinking if you're going to "sin" then they go all out.

I know, I make no sense...that's just the way I look at it.
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shacn




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 6:01 pm
What is the issue with dark nail polish? Just curious...? I guess I may understand hot pinks or red is attention grabbing but what's wrong with a purple or maroon?
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Notsobusy




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 6:07 pm
groisamomma wrote:
I agree. I think, and I may be wrong here, that to people like that anything forbidden to them is the same NO. I think they don't understand that there are different levels of no. Big no-no and Little no. Nail polish might be a no for some but it's not the same weight as a bikini No. Kind of like thinking if you're going to "sin" then they go all out.

I know, I make no sense...that's just the way I look at it.


A friend, who is not as chassidish as she used to be, told me that when she wanted to stop wearing the white tichel on Friday nights, her sister told her she may as well stop covering her hair completely. And I've heard other such stories too.

I went to a very frum school that taught tznius chumros and halachos equally. Not covering your knees and elbows was as bad as wearing a denim skirt.
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amother
Blush


 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 6:12 pm
amother wrote:
I don't have a definite source - yet - but I did learn in Jewish History that shtreimels were commonly worn in Europe, even in Lithuania, with no Chassidish implications. It's just that chassidim kept wearing the shtreimel.

For example, the litvish Yerushalmis wear a shtreimel, too, many are Perushim who were part of the Gra's community, I think.


I think what you mean is that they wore fur hats because of the cold winters in Lithuania (and for others, Russia). As did the non jews. It certainly was not religious garb.

Have a great YT!
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cnc




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 6:32 pm
amother wrote:
I think what you mean is that they wore fur hats because of the cold winters in Lithuania (and for others, Russia). As did the non jews. It certainly was not religious garb.

Have a great YT!


That's exactly how Chassidish garb began. It was the garb of the country (city) that they originated from originally. A shtreimel was not originally considered a religious article.
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amother
Oak


 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 7:43 pm
cnc wrote:
That's exactly how Chassidish garb began. It was the garb of the country (city) that they originated from originally. A shtreimel was not originally considered a religious article.


That's so interasting. I was told it was so special because it's like a crown and its worn in shabbos because on shabbos we supposed to act holy and like kings, and it has so much meaning. So that's all not true? It was really just a way of dress back then? Wow!
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amother
Pumpkin


 

Post Thu, Apr 28 2016, 7:57 pm
amother wrote:
This is how it was explained to me:

A Tuna Beigel (Beigel, not Bagel!) is someone who comes into the store and doesn't look chassidish, but then they order a "Tuna Beigel" so you know they are.


I still don't understand. Pretend you are explaining to a six year old.
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Ruchel




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Apr 30 2016, 4:43 pm
The beigel thing is weird. Forget it.

There are people who keep chassidishe traditions or mentalities but are at the very best lite MO. Zehu. They may call themselves chassidish... to me they are heimish.
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amother
Orchid


 

Post Sat, Apr 30 2016, 4:45 pm
amother wrote:
I still don't understand. Pretend you are explaining to a six year old.


It doesn't work out in writing. Basically the accent gives them away. And the fact that they still call it a Beigel instead of a bagel. If you're not from NY, you won't get it.
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Maya




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Apr 30 2016, 9:33 pm
amother wrote:
I still don't understand. Pretend you are explaining to a six year old.

Non-Chassidish people would order a bagel, but someone with Chassidish background would say the Yiddish-ized "beigel." That would give away the fact that he's not a native English speaker but has Chassidish background even if he currently doesn't look like it.
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cnc




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Apr 30 2016, 9:47 pm
amother wrote:
That's so interasting. I was told it was so special because it's like a crown and its worn in shabbos because on shabbos we supposed to act holy and like kings, and it has so much meaning. So that's all not true? It was really just a way of dress back then? Wow!


Yes.
The reason different chassidusin have different garbs is due to the fact that they originated from different areas.
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