Checklist for fitting into Bklyn/5towns

Log in / Sign Up

List of Forums + New Post Recipe Box Usergroups Following My Posts Bookmarks

Private Messages Advanced Search Rules New User Guide FAQ Advertise Contact Us

Forum -> Interesting Discussions

1 2 Next

View latest: 24h 48h 72h

amother

Azure

Mon, May 30 2016, 2:07 pm

I've seen a lot of discussion here and on other social media sites about people feeling they don't fit in with their neighborhood. I've also read articles about this and I feel like nobody is being honest about this. I've lived in the 5towns my whole life (as has my husband) and I want to share what I believe to be a fact. There's a checklist of desirable attributes that people can have working for them. The more items a person can check off the more likely they will be able to make friends and feel like they are part of the community, get invited out on shabbos, and not feel like a nobody. Of course there are exceptions and I'm sure occasionally it's possible that someone with fewer checks is fitting in and someone with more checks feels like an outcast. I'm not writing this as a joke. I'm just stating the pathetically horrible situation a believe frum people have to deal with within their own communities. The checklist is as follows:

1- size 10 or lower.
2- $2500 sheitel.
3- expensive clothes.
4- $1000 stroller
5- prestigious family name.
6- money or family money
7- fancy house
8- outgoing social personality.

It is very unusual for someone who basically strikes out on this list to feel welcome in an intown community. Unfortunately I believe every word I wrote to be true.

amother

Dodgerblue

Mon, May 30 2016, 3:36 pm

Wow, that's cynical.

I grew up in Queens and went to HS in the 5 Towns and now I live there happily.

1. Nope, I'm a size 2x or 3x
2. Nope, finally got a new sheitel for $1000 after wearing the same one for 10 years
3. Nope, I shop in Kohl's and Dressbarn mostly for myself and Target and Children's Place for the kids
4. Nope, my Graco snap 'n go and my Citi Mini combined don't come close to $1000
5. Nope, I like my family but we don't have big $$ or a big name
6. Nope again. We get by.
7. Ha ha ha. Nope.
8. Unfortunately not. So I might have a smaller group of friends but that works for me.

OOTBubby

Mon, May 30 2016, 3:41 pm

If that's what your local really think, I'm sure glad that I don't live there (and my family is very prominent in the city I live in).

amother

Azure

Mon, May 30 2016, 3:41 pm

amother wrote:

But do you feel like your a part of the community? Do you get invited out on shabbos? Do people in shul know you and your husbands name and greet you guys warmly? Sadly, I doubt it.

amother

Dodgerblue

Mon, May 30 2016, 3:47 pm

We don't invite people that often ourselves so we don't get that many reciprocal invitations.

But yes people do know who we are and greet us warmly and welcome us to join in conversations and activities.

Rubber Ducky

Mon, May 30 2016, 3:50 pm

OP Azure,
My question for you is: Do you make an effort to help all the low status not rich introverts in your neighborhood feel welcome?

amother

Cerulean

Mon, May 30 2016, 4:11 pm

My sister lives in Queens. She was complaining to me about her overweight DD. She said "nobody in our community is overweight." Rolling Eyes

By the way I am very overweight.

amother

Jade

Mon, May 30 2016, 4:22 pm

1- size 10 or lower.

10? How about 6

2- $2500 sheitel.
At least, but Dinis are more like 3000+

3- expensive clothes.
With the brand name label, don't forget

4- $1000 stroller
Not so bad to have a city mini

5- prestigious family name.
Yep

6- money or family money
Yep

7- fancy house
Yep

8- outgoing social personality.
No, if you are rich and pretty enough, no one cares.

9. You forgot--knowing all the social nuances--when to laugh, when to lie, when to talk BY, when to be cynical.
[/quote]

#whyIdon'tliveinNY

amother

Azure

Mon, May 30 2016, 4:32 pm

Op here. The only thing I left out is that this list only applies to the 40 and younger crowd. Once a couple is past that age they usually start caring less about the rat race and not bothered as much by the exclusion.

OOTBubby

Mon, May 30 2016, 4:44 pm

I really find this discussion disgusting.

amother

Azure

Mon, May 30 2016, 4:56 pm

OOTBubby wrote:

I really find this discussion disgusting.

Op here - so do I.

mommy3b2c

Mon, May 30 2016, 6:09 pm

This whole discussion is nonsense. Be confident and friendly, hang out with people that are your speed, and you'll have friends.

ra_mom

Mon, May 30 2016, 6:17 pm

amother wrote:

I don't agree. I have my family and neighbors (who I am quite different from) here and we're quite happy.
I don't care what other people are doing and they don't seem to care what I'm doing either.

amother

Azure

Mon, May 30 2016, 6:24 pm

ra_mom wrote:

I don't agree. I have my family and neighbors (who I am quite different from) here and we're quite happy.
I don't care what other people are doing and they don't seem to care what I'm doing either.

It sounds like your agreeing with me. You are anonymous in shul, people in the community aren't friendly to you but you don't mind bec you have family and some local neighbors and toy don't need more. Good for you. I'm saying that for people who want to feel part of their community/shul they need to have many of the items on the list.

amazingmommy

Mon, May 30 2016, 6:31 pm

I don't agree op,
Me and my husband are very part of our community and shuhl. Regardless of money status, prettiness, brandname clothing and weight.

ra_mom

Mon, May 30 2016, 6:35 pm

amother wrote:

When I went to shul as a youngster I was part of that shul community and when I go back to visit my mom there I still feel welcomed.
Right now our community is my children's school and we very much feel part of it and love interacting with the families at school functions and by inviting for play dates.
We keep to ourselves as much as we'd like to with our neighbors and interact and engage whenever we see them and they are all lovely. The young children knock to play and our children knock on their doors to play too.
I'm disagreeing with you.
As much as we put ourselves out there we get back and as much as we'd like to hibernate we are given the space. We both work hard all week and enjoy both the give and take as well as the space.

mummiedearest

Mon, May 30 2016, 6:55 pm

here's my take on this: there is definitely an unfriendly atmosphere in brooklyn. I don't know about the 5 towns. the things on op's list do seem to be the fashionable values. however, I don't think there's any rule that someone of a size 12 will be shunned. here's what I think:

1) people gravitate to like-minded people. externalities may indicate the person's value. someone who is part of the $2500 sheitel mentality may not immediately be drawn to the woman wearing a short haircut under a cloche hat or the one wearing the wrapunzel scarf. a woman with a secondhand graco stroller will likely not fit in with the $1000 stroller crowd if they often discuss expensive baby purchases.

2) people have good friends and may not really know how to strike up a new friendship. I don't think this is uncommon in adults. school kids are thrown together daily and can make friends more easily than two adults who see each other every few months at a shul function. that leads me to

3) lack of eiruv. I think this is a huge part of the unfriendliness in brooklyn. those still in childbearing years often have a small child at home and cannot walk to shul, meals with friends, or new community members on shabbos. the men spend a LOT of time in shul on shabbos, especially if they go to shiur. childcare is often left to the mother, unless she has a teenager without plans for that shabbos. since most people in the community work and sundays are often used for errands, shabbos as a socializing day is pretty much nonexistent. you might get together with a very close neighbor if your little one is a toddler. beyond that, you're stuck at home.

4) people don't need each other in brooklyn. the jewish population is huge and established. if you don't like a shul, you go to a different one. you don't necessarily try to get to know the other members and find a solution as a group. you just leave. many people enjoy not being needed by the community for anything in particular. this allows people to just live their own lives. in a community with few shuls/schools, people are forced to spend time together to some degree.

over the course of a few years, I have made a number of good friends in brooklyn. spending time with them is difficult, though. finding the time to make new friends was certainly a challenge. I learned to go outside my comfort zone and say hi to some of the unfriendly-seeming women. I think it's shyness rather than unfriendliness.

amother

Purple

Mon, May 30 2016, 7:08 pm

amother wrote:

1- size 10 or lower.
2- $2500 sheitel.
3- expensive clothes.
4- $1000 stroller
5- prestigious family name.
6- money or family money
7- fancy house
8- outgoing social personality.

You're making me appreciate my NJ community more:

1 - check, same here.
2 - $2500? a bargain.
3 - not so much.
4 - nope.
5 - nobody cares.
6 - we're still small enough that divide hasn't happened yet.
7 - nope. goes with 6.
8 - not really.
9 - did DH go to yeshiva with the other guys? Happily mine did, else we'd be on the outs.

amother

Seagreen

Mon, May 30 2016, 7:36 pm

What it sounds to me is people not comfortable in their own skin, seeking validation from others and not finding it and blaming external factors.

I'm 0/8 on your list and lived in Brooklyn for 20 years. I had many, many friends who were my speed. Only a few close friends but that had more to do with me not having the time/energy/motivation to make more of an effort to socialize. Being a large community has its drawbacks but one advantage is that whatever your "type" is you'll find others like you.

amother

Natural

Mon, May 30 2016, 7:41 pm

Lol
I find this comical
Maybe u are referring to a specific part of five towns, but there are plenty of more down to earth types who do not care about those things.
If u choose to try and keep up with the wealthiest most exclusive type of social scene, then yes you might actually feel like these are what u need. But there are plenty of other parts of the five towns and Brooklyn that u can thrive socially in without this list.

Page 1 of 2

1 2 Next